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Simulation set up Vericut vs Mastercam?

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9 replies to this topic

#1
Darin

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Hello,


We have Vericut and Mastercam X5... I want to start running a machine simulation to verify some of our parts... We have several Mazak's with 4th axis heads with trunnion tables. The heads are on the right side... I need to set up a machine with the 4th on the right side instead of the left like the 2-4AXGEN_VMCTA is.... Is it easier/better to learn Vericut and set up new machine or just edit this machine in Mastercam? I have solid models of 4th axis head and full trunnion table set up... So if I could just add these models to a 4th axis machine I should be good right? Also why do I always get this message ( 1 operation(s) are skipped ) when I use simulation?


Thanks

#2
gcode

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do you have an transform operation in your file?
machine sim does not support them ..
If you've got Vericut, I'd go through whatever needed doing to get it running... simulating gcode
not Mastercam NCI. Gcode simulation is always better than NCI simulation

#3
Dtm

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do you have an transform operation in your file?
machine sim does not support them ..
If you've got Vericut, I'd go through whatever needed doing to get it running... simulating gcode
not Mastercam NCI. Gcode simulation is always better than NCI simulation


I agree 100% Use vericut not mastercam.

#4
Darin

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do you have an transform operation in your file?
machine sim does not support them ..
If you've got Vericut, I'd go through whatever needed doing to get it running... simulating gcode
not Mastercam NCI. Gcode simulation is always better than NCI simulation



No transform operation in my file... Thanks for the info.. I will learn how to set up Vericut properly... It just seamed pretty close when I used Mastercam simulation that I thought I could just change a few settings to come out looking correct.. But with Vericut it use the G-code which is safer...

Thanks

#5
Dtm

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No transform operation in my file... Thanks for the info.. I will learn how to set up Vericut properly... It just seamed pretty close when I used Mastercam simulation that I thought I could just change a few settings to come out looking correct.. But with Vericut it use the G-code which is safer...

Thanks


Much safer. I ran the simulation in mastercam and everything looked good. Then I ran it in vericut and the file had 25 gouges. Vericut saved me bigtime. Also, vericut is pretty easy to set up.

#6
Guest_CNC Apps Guy 1_*

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I agree 100% Use vericut not ANY mastercam.

Free fiss.

You cannot beat checking G-Code.

#7
MotorCityMinion

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Much safer. I ran the simulation in mastercam and everything looked good. Then I ran it in vericut and the file had 25 gouges. Vericut saved me bigtime. Also, vericut is pretty easy to set up.


I don't have X5 or X6 experience. Very rarely use the HS tool paths. Never touched a 5X machine or used a trunnion. I do have a decent level of experience with the traditional surfacing tool paths. Keeping those limitations in mind... how does one get 25 gouges in Mastercam and not see it in back plot or verify? I know there are issues to be considered with the last two releases but still, 25 gouges? C'mon... this sounds like carelessness or a lack of experience. In over 4 years of programming MC, I've only gouged a part twice at the machine, both times were attributed to something I did, not MC. (Yes, I do make other dumb mistakes on occasion, I'm still human)


I have a co worker who stands at the machine with his head in the door watching every fricken move start to finish, all 2D to boot and he looks as serious as  a brain surgeon while he's doing it. Drives me nuts. He either doesn't know what he has programmed, doesn't know what he's looking at, or is putting on a show for those that don't know better and just killing time to avoid running another machine or programming the next job. The point is, knowing what your looking at in back plot or verify will catch most of the gouges and crashes prior to posting, at least in a 3 axis realm. Am I way off base here?

#8
andate caga

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I don't have X5 or X6 experience. Very rarely use the HS tool paths. Never touched a 5X machine or used a trunnion. I do have a decent level of experience with the traditional surfacing tool paths. Keeping those limitations in mind... how does one get 25 gouges in Mastercam and not see it in back plot or verify? I know there are issues to be considered with the last two releases but still, 25 gouges? C'mon... this sounds like carelessness or a lack of experience. In over 4 years of programming MC, I've only gouged a part twice at the machine, both times were attributed to something I did, not MC. (Yes, I do make other dumb mistakes on occasion, I'm still human)


I have a co worker who stands at the machine with his head in the door watching every fricken move start to finish, all 2D to boot and he looks as serious as  a brain surgeon while he's doing it. Drives me nuts. He either doesn't know what he has programmed, doesn't know what he's looking at, or is putting on a show for those that don't know better and just killing time to avoid running another machine or programming the next job. The point is, knowing what your looking at in back plot or verify will catch most of the gouges and crashes prior to posting, at least in a 3 axis realm. Am I way off base here?


A little.

5axis, or even a horizontal using B axis can cause some interesting things to happen. You start dealing with long holders hitting. A rapid move that should have been a straight line but it's a dogleg. Also the 5 axis parts that I make cost 6 figures and the forgings take months to get. You want all of your kinematics verified before making a chip. Some of our parts I program and verify and I have another programmer look at what I have done to see if I missed anything.

G code verification is the way to go. Test what you use.
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#9
MotorCityMinion

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 I agree with those statements and understand the need for verification software. Protecting serious investments like that is a no brainer.  Things like dog leg moves, holder clearances, collisions with fixture components are not the liability of MC or any other CAM package. Those responsibilities lie in the hands of the programmer and the set up man. There is still a need to eyeball the code in those scenarios.  Scrutinizing code 100% manually is silly. But watching the indexing moves and clearances is a must. Most of the 3 axis work I do does not require verification software as I have the luxury of being the set up guy and the programmer 90% of the time and know whats going to take place before the set up starts and cycle starts get pressed. Easy work as far as set-ups and clearances go. 

#10
MrFish

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We have a Limited Vericut licence that just covers our 5 axis machine and 99% of what i put in there goes through vericut first as it is just too costly and time consuming to manually check every retract and index move , but these definitly need checking outside of mastercam. Very seldom do I get a completely gouge/clearance issue free toolpath out of mastercam first time when doing complex 5 axis work. As for 3 axis, run it through verify, check for gouges, if none i set it up and walk away. This is the huge difference between 3 axis and 5 axis work. Table/Table 5 axis machines aren't as taxing as head/table machines tho.