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3D toolpath


snguyen6
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CNC released a Chook to help finding commands. It s on download tab of official forum

 

so it has such a good interface that commands are difficult to find for seasoned users? how well does that work for newer users who don't even know the commands exist?

 

the more i read about mcam 2017 here on the forum is the more i think i'm not going to bother "upgrading" from v9, which in reality is a retrograde, and switch to cimatron instead.

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so it has such a good interface that commands are difficult to find for seasoned users? how well does that work for newer users who don't even know the commands exist?

 

the more i read about mcam 2017 here on the forum is the more i think i'm not going to bother "upgrading" from v9, which in reality is a retrograde, and switch to cimatron instead.

 

Not so much......there existed a pdf for previous versions to do the exact same V9toX, this time instead of the pdf, they used a chook

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...the more i read about mcam 2017 here on the forum is the more i think i'm not going to bother "upgrading" from v9, which in reality is a retrograde, and switch to cimatron instead.

 

As a user and big fan of the kosher CAD/CAM system you mentioned, and a fellow newbie to the world of 5 axis, let me just say, slow down. Make sure you know what you're getting. The 5 axis part of Cimatron is the same Module Works add in that MC uses. They claim their integration makes it better and easier to use than MC. I can't say if that's BS or not, but I can say that I can't imagine how making a decent 5 axis toolpath could be any harder. :no

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... They claim their integration makes it better and easier to use than MC...

B.S.

 

Everyone is calling nearly the same UI and API functions. This is equivalent to say a CAM system is better than another because of the post-processor platform it uses.

 

Posts don't make toolpaths... Just localize them...

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B.S.

 

This is equivalent to say a CAM system is better than another because of the post-processor platform it uses.

 

I have heard that very comment why NX is so much better than MC. How come we don't step up and use a High Level Programming Software like NX or CATIA to program customer projects. Many times we are going into places programming wtih Mastercam and they don't even have it.

 

End of the day code is code and it is up to each programmer to use the tools they got to make good parts. Anything other than that is just preference plain and simple.

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As a user and big fan of the kosher CAD/CAM system you mentioned, and a fellow newbie to the world of 5 axis, let me just say, slow down. Make sure you know what you're getting. The 5 axis part of Cimatron is the same Module Works add in that MC uses. They claim their integration makes it better and easier to use than MC. I can't say if that's BS or not, but I can say that I can't imagine how making a decent 5 axis toolpath could be any harder. :no

 

They all have a little different way of approaching the integration. Theirs could very well be easier for some people to understand. I know Aaron from CNC was working hard to make the 2017 5-axis toolpaths simpler to use and seeing some of the changes he made he did a good job. Others I'm not sure of yet but that's because I'm so used to the X9 layout that I need to get used to where things are. Its funny though, the 5-axis toolpaths he had a goal of putting commonly used functions all on the same page to reduce the number of clicks. Just the opposite of what they did in other areas. :thumbdown:

 

g hun, give it some time and you will start to gain an understanding of how the paths work. Once you do it will be like a light switch was turned on and you will really start making the machine do exactly what you want. I had a hard time with it at first too. I'm now at the point that even when doing 3D work I tend to use the 5-axis paths and just restrict them to 3 axis. The give you far more control. It's all about telling the CAM what to do instead of asking it to do what I want.

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The give you far more control. It's all about telling the CAM what to do instead of asking it to do what I want.

I don't want control. I want tool paths that have linking motions that don't plow through my part. Leadouts I don't have to manually edit so they don't plow through my part. I don't have hours to "develope" a perfect tool path. I can program dozens of electrodes a day in 3X. I don't see ever getting near that in 5X. I don't know what MC charges for seat of 5X, but for what we paid for ours, I expected more help from the software. What you call control, I call an infinite possible combo of mouse clicks of which any single click can be the difference between a decent tool path and total chit.

 

I have no doubt that some people want/need that level of control. But for me, to program a basically disposal part that will be made one time and tossed, it's overkill. We run Roeders machines to cut our electrodes. They are fast, very fast. The time saved by being able cut an electrode in a single setup can't be blown by me spending a ridiculous amount of time programming it. Deciding what every piece of the path should do. That's what I pay the software to do.

 

I know, I'm whining. I'll stop now.

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Since transitioning from Esprit to mcam my favorite 5ax path is convert to 5ax. I get what I want in a 3d surf path then convert it. I have some stuff I do that my reseller told me mcam simply couldn't do in a 5ax path. That and flow 5ax. I use the crap out of flow 5ax and swarf. you can do A LOT with swarf.

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I don't want control. I want tool paths that have linking motions that don't plow through my part. Leadouts I don't have to manually edit so they don't plow through my part. I don't have hours to "develope" a perfect tool path. I can program dozens of electrodes a day in 3X. I don't see ever getting near that in 5X. I don't know what MC charges for seat of 5X, but for what we paid for ours, I expected more help from the software. What you call control, I call an infinite possible combo of mouse clicks of which any single click can be the difference between a decent tool path and total chit.

 

I have no doubt that some people want/need that level of control. But for me, to program a basically disposal part that will be made one time and tossed, it's overkill. We run Roeders machines to cut our electrodes. They are fast, very fast. The time saved by being able cut an electrode in a single setup can't be blown by me spending a ridiculous amount of time programming it. Deciding what every piece of the path should do. That's what I pay the software to do.

 

I know, I'm whining. I'll stop now.

With all my respect, I think the software you're looking for does not exist yet. Even at a minimal level some control is required.

 

I wonder if your company ever spent some time customizing your libraries, operations, posts and lots of other things to get MC tuned for your environment so you don't waste time with trivial stuff and can spend more time tweaking your paths... Mastercam is not IMHO the best stuff out there but is VERY capable for the work you appear to do. There are thousands of 'grammers getting excellent results with it in the mold making and HSM.

 

How many mold makers out there rely on it to compete with China's products and incredible short time to market? I'd say a bunch of people...

 

Most common thing in this world is people complaining about systems and expecting them to do everything with out of the box settings...

 

Just saying...

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With all my respect, I think the software you're looking for does not exist yet. Even at a minimal level some control is required.

 

I wonder if your company ever spent some time customizing your libraries, operations, posts and lots of other things to get MC tuned for your environment so you don't waste time with trivial stuff and can spend more time tweaking your paths... Mastercam is not IMHO the best stuff out there but is VERY capable for the work you appear to do. There are thousands of 'grammers getting excellent results with it in the mold making and HSM.

 

How many mold makers out there rely on it to compete with China's products and incredible short time to market? I'd say a bunch of people...

 

Most common thing in this world is people complaining about systems and expecting them to do everything with out of the box settings...

 

Just saying...

 

You are probably right about the software I want not existing. From what I've seen of Hypermill, and that's just shiny, fancy demo videos, it looks closer to what I had hoped for.

 

And for the record, I'm not using MC. :secret:

 

Just another software that shares the same 5X ModuleWorks interface. I am very happy with my software the vast majority of what I do. If anything, it has spoiled me, making my life too easy.  

 

When we did 5X training, our trainer explained the process like this; you have a very dumb template setup. That template sets all the thousands of possible selections and checkboxes to their safest, simplest selections. You then pick your geometry, use your best guess as to what type of path, tilt options, linking motions, etc will work for your particular part. Calculate the path with a huge tolerance and stepdown because it will crunch fast. If you like the result, copy it, paste it, tweak it, try again, always keeping the last copy you were somewhat happy with because it's easy to go from a somewhat acceptable toolpath to no toolpath at all with one mouse click. This struck me as absurd.

 

I threw some of our parts at him, not just his training samples, it took him several tries to get a toolpath that was somewhat acceptable. And even that took a lot of prep work, splitting faces, building extra faces, etc. I knew we were in trouble. If somebody with years of experience can't look at a part and KNOW what will work, we are in for an even longer learning curve than I imagined. 

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