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Mastercam 2020 Constantly shuts off without warning.


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Hey Arron, any chance you can motivate someone over there to fix the moving plane issues in 2020. My company will not move to a new version for at least 6 months after release and My planes have a mind of their own in 2020! This is going to be costly to one of the Mori NMV5000's at some point. It seems like most issues are just pushed to the next release, leaving rouge issues in old releases. This is the kind of thing that could lead to early termination for a programmer and worse than that every time I repost something I am over whelmed with anxiety about a potential crash that may result from a plane moving... Thank God for Vericut! but we share 1 seat of it between 4 programmers so sometimes u make a quick modification and resend to the floor with out waiting for a turn to rerun vericut and that's when I'll get got. Never had problems before we moved to 2020

 

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2 hours ago, motor-vater said:

Hey Arron, any chance you can motivate someone over there to fix the moving plane issues in 2020. My company will not move to a new version for at least 6 months after release and My planes have a mind of their own in 2020! This is going to be costly to one of the Mori NMV5000's at some point. It seems like most issues are just pushed to the next release, leaving rouge issues in old releases. This is the kind of thing that could lead to early termination for a programmer and worse than that every time I repost something I am over whelmed with anxiety about a potential crash that may result from a plane moving... Thank God for Vericut! but we share 1 seat of it between 4 programmers so sometimes u make a quick modification and resend to the floor with out waiting for a turn to rerun vericut and that's when I'll get got. Never had problems before we moved to 2020

 

Hi Pete,

What functions are you using to create your Planes? I ask because I have seen issues when using the "Duplicate" Plane command. This seems to "link" the new plane, back to the original plane, somewhere in the background. If you end up moving the origin of one of the planes, then the other moves as well. This has bit me a couple times.

The solution I've found is to never use "Duplicate" from the Right-Click, or any other menu option.

Instead, I use the "Create Relative" Function. Even if I want a "New Top Plane", the "Create Relative" Plane command can be used to create any of the "6 relative views", in orientation, relative to the "Plane you have 'selected' in the Planes Manager". This means, if I click on the "System Right Plane", and use "Create Relative", then the " Top view " in the Relative Planes Dialog box, is actually a "duplicate plane". This is true, no matter which Plane you are using the command on. Again, the "Top Plane", in the 'Create Relative' dialog, is always a 'duplicate plane' of whatever Plane you have selected in the Planes Manager.

I do this because creating new planes with this function gives you independent planes, that are not associated back to the 'parent plane' in any way. You can move, rotate, or otherwise manipulate this newly created plane, without it screwing up anything else...

Also, this gives me a great way to create "Front, Right, Left, or Back" views, of whatever Plane I want to manipulate.

It is kind of funny, because you'd think a "relative plane" (Create Relative - Plane Command - under the "+" button in the Planes Manager), would mean it is "connected" in some way, but I have found the opposite to be true.

  • Both "Rotate Incremental" and "Duplicate" (Plane Commands - from Right-Click Menu in Planes dialog), have given me issues. By 'issues', I mean there is some kind of weird link back to other existing planes, and it has caused my toolpaths to "jump around", due to some plane data being modified that I wasn't expected to happen.
  • For those reasons, I've just changed my work habits to use either: [ Planes (panel), "+" button, "Dynamic..." ], or [ Planes (panel), Right-Click in white panel area, "Create relative..." ].
  • With 'Create relative...', I'm usually making a copy of an existing Plane (multiple work offsets anyone?), or truly creating a "Front" or "Right" plane that is relative to an existing Plane, for constructing 3D geometry. 

The other option I'll choose is "Dynamic Planes". I do this if I want to "create a 'rotated' Plane, relative to an existing Plane.

  • For example, if I have a part "off in space", then I'll typically create the first "OP 10 Plane", relative to the part "in space".
  • Once I've finished that 1st OP (OP 10), I need to create a new Plane which is "rotated 180 degrees" from the OP10 Plane.
  • First, I'll make the OP 10 Plane, the Active WCS, Tplane, and Cplane. I do this prior to activating the "Dynamic Plane" option in the Planes Manager.
  • By setting the 'active plane' to my current WCS, when I launch Dynamic Plane, the Dynamic Gnomon is "pre-oriented".
  • I will first begin by selecting the point where the WCS Origin will be.
  • Once the origin has been selected, I'll activate one of the 'rotary handles', which allow me to rotate the plane. Depending on your settings, it will usually have a 5-degree increment that will "lock" to each position. I'll make my 180 degree rotation, and then save that as my OP 20 Plane.
  • This process can be repeated, ad infinitum, to create new Planes which are 'relative to an existing Plane', but then manipulated in some way.
  • I'm typically "creating a new 'rotated' copy of an existing Plane" (with Dynamic...)

I hope that helps...

-Colin

 

 

 

 

 

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Colin good information, but planes are broken in 2020. Issue has been corrected for 2021, but in 2020 they are not fixed and not going to be fixed so 2021 will be when people want stable planes will be able to use Mastercam again without locking them. Lock them after creation and life is good.

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Thank You as always Colin, but sadly I have never used the duplicate plane function. I almost always use dynamic, from solid face, or from geometry or from gview. We still program from center of rotation (I know, I know) My work flow for 5 axis is almost always the same for setting up a part. I create  an origin point, then make all my planes associative to that point. Reason some of the machines are different and to move machines I can move the point and regenerate with very little work in most cases..

 

But In 2020 plane association is broken. If I use a dynamic plane to the point I get no associative check box to work with. Only planes by solid face, or geometry will give me the associative check box, then I use the lil arrow in the plane manager to select my origin point and viola! I have the plane I need, associative to a point! But at any given time with out rhyme or reason it will just move. I have tried locking the planes which does not seem to help... Its all buggy as heck. 

 

The rumor is they have fixed this in 2021, fingers crossed, but It needs to be fixed in 2020 as well. We will no doubt not move to 2021 for at least 6 months after release, and what about the customers that do not pay maintenance or have vericut. They will be stuck with broken 2020 for life. The cost of master cam in my mind dictates the fact that no version should be abandoned for the next version. They need to at least fix the major issues and make a version stable. Honestly I am like a kid at Christmas every year when a new version is released, I love the new features and new toolpaths etc. I look forward to it all year. But I really get frustrated with how CNC will abandon older releases that are not at the very least stable....

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55 minutes ago, motor-vater said:

But In 2020 plane association is broken. If I use a dynamic plane to the point I get no associative check box to work with. Only planes by solid face, or geometry will give me the associative check box, then I use the lil arrow in the plane manager to select my origin point and viola! I have the plane I need, associative to a point! But at any given time with out rhyme or reason it will just move.

motor-vader,

if you can find and example of a mastercam file with one of these (broken) planes and post it here, I could look for a solution, also please send one to [email protected] if you haven't already. If the geometry in the file is sensitive, you can remove it except the (associated) geometry.

Thanks,

Peter

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On 5/2/2020 at 2:33 PM, motor-vater said:

Hey Arron, any chance you can motivate someone over there to fix the moving plane issues in 2020. My company will not move to a new version for at least 6 months after release and My planes have a mind of their own in 2020! This is going to be costly to one of the Mori NMV5000's at some point. It seems like most issues are just pushed to the next release, leaving rouge issues in old releases. This is the kind of thing that could lead to early termination for a programmer and worse than that every time I repost something I am over whelmed with anxiety about a potential crash that may result from a plane moving... Thank God for Vericut! but we share 1 seat of it between 4 programmers so sometimes u make a quick modification and resend to the floor with out waiting for a turn to rerun vericut and that's when I'll get got. Never had problems before we moved to 2020 

 

I'm not sure what specific problem you're talking about, I'd either bring it up on the official forum so that the guys responsible can see it, or send over a part with steps to reproduce.

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3 hours ago, Aaron Eberhard - CNC Software said:

I'm not sure what specific problem you're talking about, I'd either bring it up on the official forum so that the guys responsible can see it, or send over a part with steps to reproduce.

I will try but it is almost impossible to reproduce. Its so random, and sometimes when u move it back it will stay after that. I know I'm not the only one I have checked the official and quite a few people have taken notice. Is this the first you have heard of it?

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44 minutes ago, motor-vater said:

I know I'm not the only one I have checked the official and quite a few people have taken notice.

Drives me mad...

I stopped using duplicate and copy several versions back....It's gotten to the point that once I create a plane, I lock it...

I agree, recreating is nearly impossible...it just happens randomly as near as I have been able to tell.

It got so bad that for actual work planes, I will create the initial positions but as I transform up&down and around a tombstone, I have taken to letting the system create the addition planes for work shifts...and then I lock all of them.

 

 

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21 hours ago, motor-vater said:

I will try but it is almost impossible to reproduce. Its so random, and sometimes when u move it back it will stay after that. I know I'm not the only one I have checked the official and quite a few people have taken notice. Is this the first you have heard of it? 

Thanks for bumping the thread on the main forum.

I have seen that thread before.  I have not experienced the problem myself, and I'm not aware of every defect that the system team has for planes, so when you asked for me to ask them about, "the moving plane issues in 2020" I wasn't sure exactly what I was asking them for.  Thanks for clarifying.

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23 hours ago, gcode said:

I just finished a big project in MC2021

5 axis (3+2) 400+ operations 35+ planes

I experienced zero problems with tool planes, but I don't recall ever having problems in

MC2020 either

 

Man thats Awesome. I'm jealous and curious at the same time. By chance are all of your planes related to TOP? I seem to have the most problems when I have to create planes from scratch aka "New Top" then trying to link planes to that New Top Location

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6 minutes ago, motor-vater said:

Man thats Awesome. I'm jealous and curious at the same time. By chance are all of your planes related to TOP? I seem to have the most problems when I have to create planes from scratch aka "New Top" then trying to link planes to that New Top Location

Many were duplicates of Top and Front, rotated with the rotate incremental command

also in this file a bunch of them were created with the Normal command from lines  created with the Hole Axis command

I should also note, this file was done in X2021.

I wouldn't normally use a beta for a project like this, but the new 5x pocket roughing toolpath was so feakin' awesome

I had no choice.

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1 hour ago, gcode said:

Many were duplicates of Top and Front, rotated with the rotate incremental command

also in this file a bunch of them were created with the Normal command from lines  created with the Hole Axis command

I should also note, this file was done in X2021.

I wouldn't normally use a beta for a project like this, but the new 5x pocket roughing toolpath was so feakin' awesome

I had no choice.

LOL! So I have lots to look forward to with 2021, But that wont help me now... 

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On 5/1/2020 at 8:43 AM, Aaron Eberhard - CNC Software said:

Are any of you guys able to reproduce the crash/restart?  If so, please get steps in to your reseller or [email protected] so they can track it down.

There's not a lot of CNC people who hang out here like Pete and I, so you'll probably get better visibility of repeat problems on the official forum.

Nope, I was not able to reproduce it sorry.

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31 minutes ago, Aaron Eberhard - CNC Software said:

Arg..  Thus is the problem :)

Keep your eyes up and hopefully it'll materialize in a controlled manner sometime..

I will keep hunting,

thanks for the support Aaron!

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 5/1/2020 at 4:28 PM, Aaron Eberhard - CNC Software said:

Yes, please report even the ones you find running your custom scripts & c/net-hooks.  I know that my toolpath team works with the API guys when there's problems like that reported, so they get handled just like any other defect.

The SDK team found a memory leak in one of my chooks, soo maybe that was the problem, if that's the case its weird it only affected Mastercam 2020 not 2018, there was a function I was using called ps_tag_to_mc_ents, I guess it is allocating memory with malloc and I missed the note where it said I needed to call free() 😕 

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On 4/29/2020 at 1:32 PM, content creator said:

Soo, I like my mastercam 2020 very much, but it keeps closing itself!!!

Any ideas would help, I can't in good conscience approve this software for the company until I fix this issue!!

I don't have any of the updates so let me know if this was a bug in the first release.

Clearly the problem is a corrupt .net framework installation. Uninstall .net and reinstall. The problem is never MC.

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Just now, pro grammer said:

Clearly the problem is a corrupt .net framework installation. Uninstall .net and reinstall. The problem is never MC.

I know you are being sarcastic, but that is worth looking at.

It has happened to others I work with before.

3 minutes ago, pro grammer said:

Clearly the problem is a corrupt .net framework installation. Uninstall .net and reinstall. The problem is never MC.

You know, I think you should try using an older version like 2018, it will prolly work better..

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