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Siemens Macro Programming


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Shop I work in has a Matsuura With Siemens 840 control on it. Never had the need to run any macros on it but I plan to convert some Fanuc macros to run on his machine. It’s not running in Siemens Mode so it’s just running Fanuc/Yasnac g code. I started to convert the variables from From #100 to Y_[100] format. The arithmetic and Other functions seem self explanatory. My main question is What’s the format for an address like Z#100 or X#101? If anybody can point me on the right direction I appreciate it. 

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It always runs in Sinumerik mode. Yasnac gcode on top of Sinumerik is a joke...shows exactly what happens if you give a taliban a F35, they will try to plow with it.

On a short story...you can use R parameters for that. In Sinumerik works like this... X=R101 equivalent to funbuc X[#101]. If u perform calculations x=(r100+r101) equivalent to funbuc X[#100+#101]..observe you don't need to format your text with capital letters.

I suggest you read ...and I mean really read, the Sinumerik Programming manual, and especially Advanced programming manual.

Remember, you have at your fingertips a fully fledged programming language, not a kids game as fanuc macroB.

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Thanks for the reply. I have a Sinunerik manual that I downloaded but the Yaskawa/Siemens manual that came with machine doesn’t have much information in it. I do have the Yaskawa/Siemens “Supplementary explanation for Macro Porgram”. Thanks for the help and nice in the right direction.  

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11 hours ago, Grievous said:

It always runs in Sinumerik mode. Yasnac gcode on top of Sinumerik is a joke...shows exactly what happens if you give a taliban a F35, they will try to plow with it.

On a short story...you can use R parameters for that. In Sinumerik works like this... X=R101 equivalent to funbuc X[#101]. If u perform calculations x=(r100+r101) equivalent to funbuc X[#100+#101]..observe you don't need to format your text with capital letters.

I suggest you read ...and I mean really read, the Sinumerik Programming manual, and especially Advanced programming manual.

Remember, you have at your fingertips a fully fledged programming language, not a kids game as fanuc macroB.

Programs in Siemens macro language IMHO can be less than half the size and complication of Fanuc and do the same function almost instantaneously.  No long processing time....

I wish Fanuc would give us the same power without having to go to integrator school...

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  • 3 weeks later...
3 hours ago, jlw™ said:

Bringing up an OLD debate... Siemens is still better than funook. 🙈🙉🙊

 

Long time ago, in a beautiful summer day, on a side of the road, one guy lay down a big sh_t. It looked like a Indian turban in size, with the sharp tip, and a nice brown color and good texture…and it was smelling very bad.  Lots of people passing that sh_t commented and covered their nose as they pass along.

After a while the sh_t got dried, like a crust formed on the exterior. Couple of days passed and no one complained anymore

…until…

one guy, ( jlw™was his name), passed by …poke it with a stick.... and all hell breaks loose again

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LMAO...I was looking for this...lets begin. I won't post 2 much 'cuz I'm busy...so:

Funuc enthusiasts are a bunch of cultists. I call them "flat earthers". They all live on forums like this, posting some urban stories about some puny machines they program and how great they are 'cuz they can write and "IF" in an ancient and outdated language. After they do a post like this, they all gets very enthusiastic and start blowing themselves with revered comments. ...Exactly like on flat earth forums...

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11 hours ago, Grievous said:

Funuc enthusiasts are a bunch of cultists.

The EXACT same thing can be said of (Haas, Okuma, Heidenhein, Siemens, Fidia, etc...) users and enthusiasts.

We ALL have our preferences for one reason or another. There's things I like about other controls and things I don't. One of the things that I find annoying are those that say "Control 'X' can't do..." when in fact it can. They are speaking out of their ignorance rather than out of experience.

Look, we all live in different manufacturing environments. Some environments are suited to "Conversational" type controls and some are not. Some are better suited for this, and some are better suited for that. A number of controls do a better job of getting users trained than others. 

The reality is some people are in more different shops in a single year than the vast majority of machinists and programmers are in an entire career. Some people have a very small window of perspective and others have a very large window. How many machine shops have you walked into anr/or worked in your career out of curiosity?

The size of the machine doesn't matter for the most part when it comes to control capability.

Considering that one form or another of BASIC has been around since the mid-1970's IIRC and up until recently it (VB/VB.NET) was stilll the most widely  used programming language for a large variety of tasks. I would hardly call "IF" an "outdated" language. Ancient? Yeah sure. Conditional statements will be relevant long after you and I are gone.

Comparing FANUC enthusiasts to "Flat Earthers". How obtuse... :coffee:

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840D is the most advanced and powerful controller out there. All the others controllers on the market are just copy cats. From like mid90’s from my first machine show, I see how everyone are copycating whatever the germans bring.

..and James...I don’t bash funuc or hate...I actually like it a lot for its simplicity and ease of some functions, and more then that, I confess I’ve been a flatearther myself. Btw, I’ve seen machine shops on 3 continents. Did you ever seen a machine shop other than a ‘merican one?

The problem I have is with some of yours and other users statements on here...

When you said that “everyone should align to funuc standards” ..and something like that...That's "flat earther" attitude. A lots of you guys are actually very smart monkeys (I refer to every human with this term, so don’t get offended). You can see that from your post in here that your mind goes places.. but same time, some of you have a lot of ego and you are very tribal monkeys.

I thought at start that you guys just trolling with those statements but now I believe that there are things that some of you guys don’t actually know, and that combined with your ego, wishful thinking and the need of being right, gets to your flatearthers type posts in here.

BTW..from wikipidia: “FANUC System 7 was a joint venture between FANUC and Siemens because FANUC were then unable to produce a 5 axis controller.” …so who’s aligned with who? Saying that funuc is better than Sinumerik is like saying that mastercam 5x is better than moduleworks … and we all know the answer to that. Now..does any of you noticed that on all controllers out there, 5x simultaneous and 3+2 are the same? Traori/g43.4(5)/M128 or Cycle800/G68.2/PlaneSpatial , all there are behaving same way, just the codes are different. So, how come all these controllers developers came somehow using same ways of defining a tilted work plane using Euler angles, Roll/Pitch/Yaw/3points/2vectors etc..did same muse strike them somehow on same time? How come almost all CAM software use same 5x toolpath type (moduleworks ones}? Did same muse strike them somehow on same time? So I’m asking again the question: who’s aligned with who?

You think that calling funuc enthusiasts “flat earthers” is to much?.. let me go more into that with some examples. On this forum, 2 funuc boys bashing sinumerik, with statements like: “fanuc macroB puts sinumerik to shame, because the bavarians didn’t crack this one yet”. When I read this, I laugh for days. I wanted to answer but I let it go, as I usually do. Now..to these guys…and you know who you are…let me rub a big bavarian sausage all over your faces(I’m not german btw…I’m canadian)…you guys are living under a big rock. MacroB compared to the programing language you have in sinumerik is like playing Mario vs Crysis(they are both fun btw). Defining custom variables of type real, integer, booleans, strings, arrays, and frames (work offsets), are just a dream for funuc..I won’t go into details cuz I’ll need to write for days only on this.

Now..let me rub another one so you would know that “flatearther” is not 2 much. Colin Gilhist..sorry mate if I butcher ur name..another very smart monkey(for real), but on same time a very wishful thinking just so the discussion will not end with a loss of an argument. You said regarding the use on fanuc of attachments (angle heads) that you are sure fanuc done it probably over 100 time over the years..well..wishful thinking. Let me tell you how it’s done on 840 and then you judge about that 100 number. On 840 one can define different type of tools, endmills, drills and in our case angle heads. On a angle heads tool data you can shift from your spindle face to your tool tip on XYZ direction. So if let’s say your tool is pointing on X+dir, you shift on Z and X dir( and Y if needed) and activate that tool offset using D1(or D2…etc) More than that, on newer 840’s you can define the direction vector of your tool(dx dy dx) in tool data. On older ones you would need to manually program that tool rotation. When you want for example to position your angle heard in a tilted plane, you as a programmer, you just program the plane in which you want your tool to work using Cycle800. No special post or something. Just program it like a regular tool. The control will sum the tool vector defined in tool data and align your attachment in that plane(of course if a valid solution is founded based of your kinematic), all this regardless of your machine kinematic. Now…let me correct that number you were wishful thinking. The actual number of times fanuc did this over the years is: 0, ZERO, NULL, NADA! Why? It lacks all these options I pointed above. You can do it in fanuc of course, I did it, and others of course, but with use mathematics gymnastics and post changes. Nothing so streamlined like I pointed above.

Probing Cycles. Another one I can go for days. Fanuc has no native probing cycles like 840, and the ones that comes from a 3rd party developers are again just copycats. The sheer amount of options from the 840 probing cycles puts probing in fanuc to shame that you guys don’t even imagine, like updating a wo in a tilted plane, updating kinematics, logging results under what name of file I want, even increment names and even what location I want(I can save results even on my freeking desktop). In fanuc even getting the actual date means you need to do some mind gymnastics. On 840 you just ask for date hour etc…The control of behavior during probing, like displaying results on screen or requirement of pressing the start button to continue or not, multiple probe data or probing just using one edge of stylus with spindle orienting….good luck doing that in fanuc in a tilted plane with your stylus not perfectly aligned with Z axis (totally possible in 840) Remember…all that regardless of your machine kinematic….some of you will get it. On fanuc? If the machine builder did not install those 3rd party probing cycles, then you will need to pay (you will pay regardless in the machine price anyways)

Handling machine kinematics…well this is not even fair for fanuc. Let me scratch the surface on this one with an example. We have here machine with a table 2.5m on x and 1m on Y, Z travel 0.9m. Head swivel around Y B±100deg. On the table there is C axis. We attached at the end of the table another 2 rotaries.. A1 on left and A2 on right. So there are total of 4rot axis. We can bridge the A1A2 or use them separately, we can use any combination possible between all these rot with a press of a button. Changes in our programming or post = zero. Can you do that in fanuc…well… NO!

WSEC= another copycat function. This in sinumerik has no name from what I know..but this is just an ability and it’s been there for 30y. On funuc is like the next great thing…and you pay extra..why?..I’m wondering why? A frame(work offset) on 840, beside the transitional components have also for every axis a fine translation, mirror, scale and a rotational component. Well let me rub that sausage again on your faces with an example. I can probe 3 points on a surface, using the native (not copycat cycles) probing cycles, they will find and update my frame rotational components, without any mathematical gymnastics, so that all my programming will follow that rotations. In a nutshell, if let’s say your fixture is not perpendicular to your Z axis, the probing cycles will find and populate your frame with the necessary rotations so that your program will align with your actual fixture posture. No mathematical gymnastics. And all can be done at the controller by operator.

Dual channels…no need to expand on that. No competition here. I have no fingers on my hands and feet as of how many channels an apparatus can be built with 840. I believe 30 channels …I honestly don’t see an application one will do with that number of channels, but if someone will launch on such endeavor, imagine that you can have some apparatus in which on all those 30 channels you can do all this things above, on all 30 you individually probe, do 5x 3+2, etc, all govern by global variables..etc..Ludacris. Programming such a thing is just sifi. Actually programming 840d other than a single channel is not a easy task, that’s why CAM mill-turn applications outhere. Tring to handle a larger than life system like sinumerik with 2 channels even today is not an easy task, since all these functions from 840are not possible to access from a CAM system. It’s like trying to program a programming language using a CAM interface. All what these mill-turn CAM applications like moduleworks (Mill-turn module in Mastercam) are doing, is a just using stiff template hardcoded with a post, but in fact there are so many ways that this can be done with the programming language available in 840. Again, you are trying to program a programming language using a CAM system.

Some of you didn’t not have probably the chance to work on a Sinumerik machine I’m fortunately in that regard. For sure that guy who said MacroB wasn’t cracked in bavaria didn’t, that’s why I understand some of yours tribalism towards fanuc. That makes me smarter than you? Not at all. Life shouldn’t be of outsmarting others, but to gain more knowledge for better ourselves…like is depicted in star trek..not the new ones..STD sucks sooo much!!!

For a simple on channel 5x application and depending on what you want to do with that machine, a fanuc will do more than fine. I’m yet to see a machine other than an european manufacturer with 840, who is configured correctly, Not many builders have qualified personals to handle an application like sinumerik (at least not in north america), but saying stuff like fanuc is the best and so on, is just ludacris. Stop with urban legends and posting stupid sh..t just for the sake of an argument.

PEACE! \m/

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  • 2 weeks later...

We have both here. Put me down for another 310i please. 

Commonality

Reliability 

Userbase

U.S. support.

 

On a separate note, I wish you worked here because not only do you seem knowledgeable, but then a lot of my co-workers would realize how good they have it working with me 😄.

Mike 

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Since you felt it necessary to call me out by name, let's hear yours.

All I've ever done over the years is try to learn, first and foremost, from the people on this forum, and then have attempted to give back that knowledge to others who were seeking help. A great bit of my knowledge has come from reading about something in a manual, or on this forum, and then "trying something" until I figured it out on my own and got it to work.

Guess what > there is a bunch of information in the Fanuc Manuals, which specifically mention Right-Angle Head Applications. You're completely right when you say that it is much easier (and possible) to do directly on the 840D control. This is possible on the 840D, in a way that is not possible on a Fanuc. However, I've helped a great many people do positional and "full 5-Axis" RAH work, and have used the Generic Fanuc 5X Mill Post to output RAH 5-Axis Code for a Fanuc. So I've personally gotten this to work with some limited applications, and I'm trying to help some other people make the same kind of discoveries on their own. When I see entire chapters in a manual, mentioning an application for Right-Angle Heads, I think to myself "they've obviously done this enough times to put chapters in the manual about it"; so it can't be that uncommon. I have only seen the handful of RAH ops that I've done in-person myself. I extrapolated that "100 times" number because for there to be a manual section written about RAH attachments, and how to handle the offsets, I think "this can't be a unique application if they have written a section in the manual about it".

Contrary to what you may think, I've run several DMG Mori machines, with 840D Controls. Tool Types 130 & 131 are nice functions. It is much easier to program an Angled Head Tool on an 840D than it is to do so on a Fanuc. You won that argument. Congratulations; I'm sure your arm will be sore over the next couple of days as you pat yourself on the back.

Everyone copies everyone else in life and in art. Art imitates life, life imitates art, and we are all just pawns in a very large game where we barely even started to understand the rules.

The 840D is very complex. You get a truckload of "capability" in a package where you have to buy all that capability upfront. This means that the 840D will always have a fixed price which is higher than a Fanuc "Bare bones" 5-Axis Control. It is a different approach between the Germans and the Japanese. Fanuc has built an advanced "Lego Set", where you can plug in different modules, to customize your machine. This, in turn, changes the parameter sets and NC Code which is required to run a given machine. So, you've got to "know the system", and how these changes will affect the NC Code output which is needed to harness the power of the control. Both the sales and the technical staff at each machine tool builder are then responsible for putting together "the right package", so you get the correct functions available on the control. Fanuc does offer "standard packages" (MTB's also build their own), so the customer can purchase a fully configured machine with all the bells and whistles, if they choose. Or they can buy functions on an "ad hoc" basis, if they want to start with a lower level of complexity, and add additional capabilities later on.

The Siemens 840D Language is very complex. Sure, it is powerful for a guy who really knows it, as you clearly do. But how easy is it to run the control, and use all the functions? How much training is required to learn all the functionality which is possible to use? For complex stuff, like a Right-Angle Head, the 840D makes that very easy indeed. But if your shop does not require all of that complexity and power, you've just paid for a control which "can control like 30 channels, and do 5-axis, probing, swap axis addresses, and use a FFT to draw a picture of a bavarian sausage in your mouth (they are tasty, I'll give you that)", on each channel, but you'll be hard pressed to find someone who can run it to make parts, let alone use all the complexity.

But let's be real: in this day and age you need a CAM System, to program a part of even moderate complexity, because your machine isn't making money while the spindle is not cutting metal. So yes, sure it is possible to hand-program a complex part on the machine, using an 840D, in a way that isn't possible on a Fanuc. I'm sure you could go and program a large weldment, or mold base, on the control, without the need of a CAM System. Single-part lathe programming with 'part hand-off', can be much easier on an 840D. I've also done my fair share of programming on a control using templates, such as those in Manual Guide i, and IPS/VPS on Haas machines.

But try doing that with an Impeller. For most parts: it is far better to program offline with a CAM system, and run the machine using NC Code. For offline programming, you don't want to be making edits on the controller (machine), unless you then go back into the CAM System, and edit the source file to output that matching (edited) NC Code. Otherwise you've lost traceability, unless you manage the "edited NC File", and save/backup those programs, which again, breaks the traceability back to the original NC File. So my preference is to always "fix the Post, and create 'the necessary input' in the CAM System, to get 'perfect NC Code' out the other end, which is traceable back to the CAM File".

We talk about Fanuc and Haas and Matsuura, because that's what our customers are using, and we're helping them succeed even without "the greatest control in the history of the world, that everyone has copied, because it is clearly so superior". I can tell you this > those Fanuc machines and controls are running day-in, day-out, without ever skipping a beat.

I like the Siemens 840D Control.

I like the Heidenhain 530 & 640 Control.

I like the Fanuc 31i-B5 Control (and other Fanuc Control variants).

I love the Haas Control (especially the NGC) because, guess what, it's what I learned to program on with 3-Axis code, back when I had only ever programmed a 2D Profile using a Prototrak mill, and I knew basically nothing about CNC Machining. It is also easy to teach, learn, setup, run, and make parts with.

I started learning with Mastercam 6.13, cutting pockets and contours. I graduated to 3D machining using 'Flowline' on single surfaces at a time. (Because that's what we had.)

I would program using an Etch-A-Sketch, if there was value to be had in doing it that way.

There are a great many systems in the world that are superior to other systems in some metrics. I'm a firm believer in "anything can be measured, but not all measurements provide insight or value". Power and capability are good metrics. So are training, service, support, and availability of potential candidates in the local labor pool.

I hope you feel superior to me, if that in any way helps you to feel better about yourself. I wish you peace, happiness, prosperity, and a Very Merry Christmas, and Happy New Year!

All my love,

Your wishful thinking flat-earther monkey,

Colin

P.S., If I had one wish for this new year, it would be this: for you to be kind to the people you love and work with.

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Finally have a proper screen

On 12/4/2021 at 10:10 PM, Grievous said:

840D is the most advanced and powerful controller out there.

That is a COMPLETELY subjective statement. You're showing YOUR bias. Is it Advanced? No question. Is it powerful? Absolutely without a doubt. I don't recall anyone seriously contending an opinion to the contrary. Maybe in jest, or probably throwing shade on their dog $#!+ support in the US but you sound like you're shilling for the Sony BetaMAX here. Seriously.

Blah...Blah...Blah... Defining ... Blah...

Sigh... too much ignorance in that paragraph to address it all. You know everything clearly so I'm not going to cast my pearls before swine. I refer to every human with this term, so don’t get offended.

When you said that “everyone should align to FANUC standards” ..and something like that...That's "flat earther" attitude.

:bs: Add up all the controls that use a base standard of code (Haas, Mitsubishi, FANUC, Yasnac) and that's probably close to 75% of the CNC motion control market. That's not flat earther, that's English is the language of business on earth pal. No more, no less. Sony BetaMAX is superior is flat earther attitude.

Blah...Blah...Blah... angle heads ...Blah...Blah...Blah...

Please don't ever write technical manuals. A FANUC 6M manual is an easier read. You seem to know your stuff but dayum. Naysayers find ways something cannot be done. The naysayers need to get out of the doer's way. Sit back, watch, or don't. Whatever. More pearls before swine. Colin is far more gracious than I.

Blah...Blah...Blah... Probing ...Blah...Blah...Blah...

Personally, I think Renishaw does it best. Better than BLUM. Better than Marposs. It's what they do. FANUC DOES have a probing interface with their own graphcally guided method. Just because YOU don't know it's there doesn't mean it isn't. :coffee: In addition, with the FANUC Manual Guide i, Panel i, and HMI interfaces I have added all the probing cycles (single surface, bore, boss, web, pocket, etc...), to an easy to insert into existing part programs interface. Is it elegant pretty pictures? Probably not. Does it work and work well? Absolutely. I don;t know how many other AE's outside of my organization know how to do this kind of thing? Not sure. Not really my concern. I train my customers to the best of my ability at the time I train them. Tomorrow I will be better than I was today, that's just a fact.  

Blah...Blah...Blah... Machine Kinematics ...Blah...Blah...Blah...

If the machine tool builder does not configure the axes correctly (and YES it does happen from time to time) not much the average user can do about that if they don't know how to correct it. We sell a machine that has a feature that to the best of my knowledge FANUC does not have. The Mitsubishi M800 (??? IIRC ???) carries the freight on that machine. It happens. I don't think I have ever said that FANUC can handle every single kinematic possibility.

Blah...Blah...Blah... Sinumerik... Blah... Blah... Blah... 30 Channels ...Blah...Blah...Blah...

:cough:

FANUC 30i-B Series Control (current latest generation)

Max. number of paths : 10 - 15 paths
Max. total number of controlled axes :
96 axes ( 72 feed axes, 24 spindles ) / 10 paths
72 axes ( 56 feed axes, 16 spindles ) / 15 paths
Max. number of simultaneous controlled axes : 24 axes

:cough:

The bottom dollar reality in the machining world regarding controls is there are a number of VERY capable controls on the market. Personal preference, available "tools" on hand (CAD/CAM, Options, local applications support, etc..., etc..., etc...) can make or break a control or machine. FANUC does not do a great job about educating the populace regarding the capability of it's controls. However, as poor as that education is, FANUC vs. Siemens US support in the US is stellar.

Rest assured, when some guys in here hear somebody say "...can't..." that's when these guys shine, can and DO get it done. Just because someone doesn't know how to do something doesn't mean it can't be done.

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I love pissing contests because their educational. Please continue.

We need to have a macro competition lol. Heidenhain automatically loses cuz it's limited even though it does have some cool features.

 I'm interested in how to do the right angle head stuff on the latest fanuc and Siemens control. On heidenhein you call a external kinematic file for the right angle head from the tool table basically.

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On 12/15/2021 at 7:23 PM, cncappsjames said:

Personally, I think Renishaw does it best. Better than BLUM. Better than Marposs. It's what they do. FANUC DOES have a probing interface with their own graphcally guided method. Just because YOU don't know it's there doesn't mean it isn't. :coffee: In addition, with the FANUC Manual Guide i, Panel i, and HMI interfaces I have added all the probing cycles (single surface, bore, boss, web, pocket, etc...), to an easy to insert into existing part programs interface. Is it elegant pretty pictures? Probably not. Does it work and work well? Absolutely. I don;t know how many other AE's outside of my organization know how to do this kind of thing? Not sure. Not really my concern. I train my customers to the best of my ability at the time I train them. Tomorrow I will be better than I was today, that's just a fact.   

 

 

I've got a lot to learn on the FANUC probing side.  We had a question come in recently where our fanuc guru was like ..um.. lets get BLUM involved with that one. 😳 Calling G65 macros out of your head using renishaw's easy-set macros is my point of reference. That really blows compared to native Heidy spindle probe cycles that don't change base on who installs the tool laser/ spindle probe  system (BLUM / HEXAGON M&H/ Reni) . But is sounds like you've got a really nice way to drop in some code. Wish i knew how to do that.

 Manual probing (not automated cycles) on Heidy are sweet.

call probe into spindle

jog to location

navigate to softkey of appropriate type of probing

select x/y/z direction desired

GO!

 so really just a few clicks to probe points all around and sending probed location to an fixture offset is just one click after that.

**********************************************************************************************

SO Cincinnati's acramatic 2100 was really Siemens underneath, right?

*********************

Kinda interested who copied who between Siemens and Heidenhain, since functionality is so similar. I guess it doesn't really matter just like CAM companies  playing checkbox warfare.

 Working for an outfit that sells high end machine tools with Fanuc , Heidenhain and Siemens controls the clear winner in motion control and feed rate planing is Heidenhain. Siemens drives have been criticized for being comparatively sensitive differences in setup weight. So there's that.

 One thing I miss with the Fanuc control from an operator's perspective  is the total lack of latency between user input and motion. PC based controls seem to have latency here and there that gets the operator wondering wtf the machine is doing. Triggering TCPM in a program with Heidy results in a little pause whereas Fanuc is 100% go go go.

 I was really hesitant in getting involved with yet another CNC control a few years ago, but know i wanna convert all the machines I've worked on. So many things streamlined. Probably not fair comparing a 20 year old Haas 3 axis to a $1million dollar 5 axis with all the bells and whistles. But F*ckit.

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14 hours ago, mkd said:

I've got a lot to learn on the FANUC probing side.  We had a question come in recently where our fanuc guru was like ..um.. lets get BLUM involved with that one. 😳

 😬😬😬

Manual probing (not automated cycles) on Heidy are sweet.

call probe into spindle

jog to location

navigate to softkey of appropriate type of probing

select x/y/z direction desired

GO!

Can be exactly that simple and straightforward on a FANUC Machine. Just depends on who set the machine up.

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Implementation (or lack thereof) isn't FANUC's fault. They give builders all the tools they need to implement nearly all the things people complain about. Maybe Heidenhein is more strict "You muzt, do it zis vay".

I've seen a few Siemens customers (with several different builders) complain about the same sorts of implementation things.

To me, this is a "nature of the beast" issue. When you have control manufacturers that have a relatively open system (FANUC, Siemens, and Mitsubishi to name a few) some builders will take advantage of everything, some will take advantage of almost nothing, then there's the in-between. 

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