New 5x mills

[cncappsjames]

On 10/16/2022 at 6:47 PM, ?Mark said:

Wow. Why?

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If you have a local/close support, then DMGMORI should be at the top of the list for 5axis consideration.

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But hearing someone say to stay away from a DMGMORI is just nuts.

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7 hours ago, MSL said:

As you said "If you have a local/close support, then DMGMORI should be at the top of the list for 5axis consideration".

We don't have that support in Southern California. I like to hear from actual customers not from DMGMORI.

Hate to break it to you Mark but I've spent the last 15+ years following up on the 5-Axis FANUC controlled Mori support here in Southern California when they go with a Matsuura they should have bought in the 1st place  

In all seriousness, what I've run into in roughly a dozen cases where there has been the need to untrain the incorrect information about how the functions work together programmers from what they learned from either the Ellison or the Mori Applications Engineer, or I've needed to make parameter change suggestions for the customer so the functions work properly. Maybe it's a different story on the Siemens machines.... that's been my experience... at least in SoCal.

[Dmitrij]

Hello guys, 

I have a question here regarding Yasda px30i.

Do you have any problems with tool change times ? Tool change time+tool breakage detection takes about 1 minute per tool i think thats really a lot. There are a lot of subprograms that came from manufacturer with a lot of G4 X... codes. I dont really understand that for a such highspeed machine it takes 1 minute to change a tool. Thats waay to much.

Has anyone else experienced this problem with Yasda Px30i.

[rgrin]

I am in the middle of setting up a Yasda H40i.  The basic Yasda toolchange programs leave a lot to be desired as far as speed is concerned. One thing that stands out is that it always does a power check on the probe which adds some time. I also modified my toolchange cycle to add a dwell for my thru spindle coolant tools so that they have a longer air purge prior to toolchange.

The Yasda tool break cycles also have a lot of ways for speeding them up. In the manual there are actually 2 different tool break cycles and within those 2 are a bunch of variables you can set to fine tailor to each one. G600 is the "normal" accuracy focused one where it does it all in feed moves. G650 is done at rapid. I played with the G650 but I found it to be too inaccurate and would alarm out saying a tool was broken more often than not. I switched back to G600 and there is a Y variable that controls if the machine does an air blow or not and I switched that off since the air blow adds around 20-30 seconds. My machine is set up with a laser as well as contact plunger style setter and my break cycles can pick which one I use. I prefer laser since that is what I set my tools on but theoretically it should not matter.

Yasda is very picky about letting people make modifications to their subprograms. In my mind they should be a lot leaner which would help them cycle faster but they have their reasons for doing them and they don't want anyone other than Yasda Japan modifying them in my experience.

One last thing is that Yasda is really not a high speed machine tool. I look at them more as marathon machines than sprinters.

Edited October 24, 2022 by rgrin
one last thought

[gcode]

Is one minute the time it takes to physically change the tool or does that include lasering the tool

to validate tool length offset, diameter and tool nose radius

[rgrin]

So if I have a tool prestaged(which you should and if you don't then start here and fix your post so it does) and all I do is toolchange it takes maybe 5-10 seconds depending on rapid distance. If I do just a basic tool break detect where all I do is laser for length to verify within +/-.005" it usually adds 45 seconds since the setters are mounted on the side of the trunnion. It also goes through all of the basic power checks and cycles the laser on and off to confirm its ready. If you add an air blow or air blow with axis movement (the laser has an air nozzle by it and blows the tip of the tool off) that adds around another 30 seconds just for air blow. Then if you do what you said where you scan for corner radius or tool diameter its probably around another 10-20 seconds. I program with wear comp so I don't bother with the diameter and corner rad stuff. I touch all my tools off as if they are centric tools and go from there. So a toolchange can balloon up to around 75 seconds which is unfortunate but kind of just the fact of the matter.

If you need faster tool break than you will need to play with your accuracy tolerances and switch to the G650 rapid tool break. That brings it down to a true 10 second tool break, but I found it be too unreliable for my needs

[cncappsjames]

@rgrin , the reality of the situation is as the old axiom goes; "There are no perfect solutions, only tradeoffs." I think it was Thomas Sowell that said it. 

Touch style tool measurement systems are faster and more reliable than laser systems, but there are a number of things that make them not fit for every application. Lasers tool measurement systems are awesome, you can check tool profiles, broken teeth, tool radius/diameter, etc... but... they are slower, they are susceptible to environmental issues (coolant mist, through tool coolant drips/drainage, etc...), built up edge, chips, tool coatings, high polish tools, etc...