Isometric, Orthographic vs Perspective view?

[robertcnc]

Solidworks, Autocad and Inventor all have the ability to switch from Isometric or Orthographic view to perspective view. Can Mastercam do a perspective view? It's very annoying to me not to be able to work in perspective view.

[Ron Branch @ Verisurf]

Yeah it is called G-view. You can set a C-plane to the G-view and you are done.

 

Welcome to the forum.

 

HTH

 

Also from help:

 

Mastercam uses a 3D Cartesian coordinate system to locate your work in three-dimensional space. This means that geometry and toolpath positions are expressed in terms of three coordinate axes—X, Y, and Z. Each axis is signed, which means that it has a positive and a negative direction.

 

 

Because actual machining jobs often require you to work with coordinate locations in sophisticated ways, Mastercam includes several useful tools which let you transform, overlay, slice, and otherwise manipulate the coordinate system so that you can draw and machine your part in ways that make sense to you.

 

The main tool for applying coordinate systems in Mastercam is the view. A view consists of two main parts:

 

A plane, or slice through the coordinate system

 

An origin, or zero point

 

Views also have names, so they can be saved with the part and selected at a later time. Every Mastercam part includes by default seven views. These correspond to the six faces of a cube (Top, Front, Back, Right, Left, Bottom) and an Isometric view. In addition, you can create your own views, name them, and save them.

 

Some of the most important applications of views include:

 

The graphics view (Gview). This defines the perspective from which you are looking at the part in the graphics window.

 

The construction plane (Cplane). This is the plane in which new geometry is created.

 

The tool plane (Tplane). This is the cutting plane for a toolpath, typically normal to the tool axis.

 

You choose one of these functions, then select a view to apply to it. For example, to look at your part from the right side, choose the Gview function, and then select the Right view. To draw geometry on the back of your part, choose the Cplane function and select the Back view. To machine a contour on the front of your part, choose the Tplane function and select the Front view.

 

Because Mastercam breaks these out into separate functions, you can maintain the plane selections for each function independently. For example, you can be looking at the part in isometric view (Gview = Isometric), while drawing geometry on the front of the part (Cplane = Front). The default plane, Top, corresponds to the standard XY plane for simple 2D geometry.

 

Choose Gview on the status bar to orient the graphics view. You can also use the menus at the top of the screen: select Views, Standard or Views, Orient.

 

Choose Planes on the status bar to set tool and construction planes. For most applications, you will want these to be the same, so this function sets both at the same time. (Click here to set them individually.)

 

Work coordinate systems

Mastercam also lets you shift and move the coordinate axes themselves. This lets you create a work coordinate system (WCS), which lets you move the coordinate system to your part geometry instead of moving or transforming the part geometry. Think of the WCS view as defining the "shop floor" relative to your part. For example, an aerospace part might be drawn and dimensioned to the tip of the nose or wing. You can use the WCS to align the coordinate axes and origin with the part before creating the toolpath. Then, when you post the toolpath, the NC code will look like the part is flat so you can machine it simply. Or, you can create different WCS’s for different part fixtures and assign work offsets to each one, so that when you post the toolpaths each will start at the zero point with the proper work offset code included automatically.

 

Gviews, Cplanes, and Tplanes are all measured relative to the WCS and its origin. However, you change the WCS in exactly the same way that you change those functions: create a view which captures the orientation and origin that you desire, then set the WCS equal to it.

 

Choose WCS on the status bar to realign or create a new work coordinate system. This menu is also the standard way to access the View Manager, which is a central location for editing, renaming, and managing views.

 

Coordinate systems and machine definitions

You should not use the WCS or custom views to model your machine tool or axis orientation – for example, rotating the coordinate system for a horizontal mill, or tilting it for your slant-bed lathe, or turning it around to machine at a different spindle. Instead, use the machine definition to accomplish this.

 

Mastercam maintains a separate coordinate system, called the world coordinate system, that is used to model your machine tool. Use the machine definition to tell Mastercam how the axes of your machine tool are physically laid out and oriented — for example, the orientation of the Z axis on a horizontal mill. When you create your toolpath and select your tooling, Mastercam will also know about axis combinations, turret and spindle orientations, and how tools are mounted. This information is available to the post processor when you post the toolpath.

 

By separating machine-dependent coordinate systems from your part geometry, Mastercam makes it possible for you to move a part file transparently from a vertical mill to a horizontal mill, or from one spindle of your lathe to another, without having to manually transform the coordinate system in your part file.

[robertcnc]

Wow! Thanks man, you're very cool for providing such a good explination.

 

Thanks

 

Robert

[robertcnc]

H'mm still can't get perspective view only orthographic. I've been tryng but can't figure it out.

[Colin Gilchrist]

Robert,

 

There is no "perspective" view in Mastercam. There is an Isometric view, which I'm assuming is what you are referring to as orthographic. If you want a different viewpoint from the normal Top, Front, Right, Iso, you basically have to rotate the graphics view using "dynamic" to the approximate view you wish to use.

 

 

Ok,

 

After a quick internet search, there is no Perspective view in Mastercam. Orthographic only.

 

If you need something with Perspecive, then look into using something like Solidworks for your modeling and stick with Mastercam for machining...

 

HTH,

[crazy^millman]

Colin of course you can. You rotate your view to what you see. Then you set your C-plane to that G-view now everything you draw and machine is in that view or prescriptive view so to speak.

 

All you have to do it move to a view you want to see. Then go to Planes at the bottom. Then there is a Gview=Cplane click on that and now the Cplane dialog box will come up. Now you can grate all of your geometry in that view. I use this all the time when I am doing 5 axis machining. I move to a view that I feel will machine the part. I then follow the same process to create a cplane and now I have my axis control for my 5 axis hard or table to do the machining operation I am after.

 

HTH

 

[ 04-01-2009, 10:14 PM: Message edited by: Crazy^Millman ]

[Pete Rimkus from CNC Software Inc.]

If by "perspective" view robertcnc means that things appear smaller the further back they are...no we don't do that.

[robertcnc]

"We don't do that"

 

That is a real drag! Solidworks, Inventor, etc.. all have perspective view capability, even the Vectric products such as Aspire and V Carve have that function.

 

Isometric sucks because that's not the way our eyes see things and at times it can be confusing and make models, pockets look crappy. You would expect a big badass program like Mastercam to have perspective view. Perspective view is important enough for all the other programs to use and incoporate why not Mastercam? Too bad there is not a plugin to ad this function.

[FP1]

Hey Pete, I always appreciate your input, keep it coming. Comments like the one above is when I can really appreciate your siggy. Forums just make it too easy to vent frustrations sometimes.

[taperlength]

Is "robertcnc" another pseudonym for Jon Banquer?

[Dave.L]

In a design or machining software, I can't understand the need to have a perspective view, but that's just me.

[robertcnc]

I am Robert Monroe Turner, I don't know who Jon Banquer is except that he is not me. Mastercam is a great, powerful program and I've just invested in some training I'm just surprised and disappointed that I am forced to use Isometric.

 

I do my modeling in 3D Studio Max and my CAD in Inventor and I always switch to perspective rather than Isometric or Orthographic because when I do a profesional rendering of a model it only appears photo real as a perspective view.

 

My favorite is Inventor's Perspective with Ortho faces. The problem is when I spend several hours modeling with perspective and then switch to Mastercam and am forced to use Isometric everything looks strange and it is annoying to me because I get used to seeing the model a particular way.

 

As far as me venting, well I don't see it that way because if perspective was added to the program then it would be a benifit to users who would enjoy working that way, there would be no issue just choose your desired view and go with it.

[taperlength]

My mistake--Jon Banquer is becoming well known for his heated criticisms of software that he doesn't own or use, often posting under aliases, sometimes even answering his own messages.

I suppose a perspective view would be valuable for some people and purposes, but the lack of it is not a hindrance to the majority of users whose goal is to cut materials accurately in the shortest time.

[FP1]

When you put it this way it sounds like a reasonable request. You might try posting this explanation and request in the Mastercam Enhancement Dicussion Board. This board may not always show up when you first enter the forum page, just click on the mastercam logo to see more boards.

 

I have just the opposite opinion on perspective view. When I go from Mastercam to Solidworks, the use of perspective view makes geometery look strange and not parallel to me. I have never needed perspective view to get my parts programmed. I suppose it just what we get used to using.

[Todd Tracey from Fastech]

You guys need to remember that Mastercam is a CAM program first and foremost. Yes it has a CAD side, but we model for manufacturing.

JM2C

[Jason B.]

quote:

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NOTE: No modeling should be attempted while in perspective mode. This is a viewing mechanism only.

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This is how my software feels about perspective view. Keep in mind when modeling in perspective you no longer have true parallel lines and your arcs turn into splines. (in view terms only-they don't actually turn into splines.) It becomes harder to visually see an improper wall angle and stuff related to things like this.

 

quote:

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if perspective was added to the program then it would be a benifit to users who would enjoy working that way

---

I agree with this statement but then again we can use this statement for every item that each of us would like to have added or changed to the program. (I can think of a few that I myself have requested here.)

 

Please don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to tell you that modeling in perspective view is a wrong way to do it. You have been doing it this way and you enjoy doing it this way. I'm just saying you need to be a little more cautious about your final product.

 

quote:

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Isometric sucks because that's not the way our eyes see things

---

This isn't entirley true. If you hold a AAA battery about 12 inches from your face out in front of you and look at it the long way (looking at the round end head on) you will see a round object. Now turn the battery ever so slightly and notice the round end away from you does not appear any smaller than the end closest to you. This will be the same for most anything you design. Perspective comes into play with things like looking down an alley at several buildings lined up along the sides and looking that whole distance. This is when perspective is noticed. I have used perspective a time or two for my rendered drawings just to give them that "look" but in my 17 years of designing you are the first person I have run across that does it as an everyday designing process. I only say this to point out that it probably would be a hard item to get Mastercam to add to their next release. But it can't hurt to try right?

[gcode]

When I encountered perspective view in SolidWorks

the first thing I did was figure how to shut it off. I guess its a matter of what you're used too.

[HyperSix]

People get used to the weirdest things.
After searching and reading about this subject, I'm convinced that the isometric view is just a relic from the past,
and the only reason it seems to even exist is that, in the olden days, it was easier to draw by hand.

Even a simple rectangle looks like a trapezoid that gets wider and wider in isometric view when viewing from a steep angle (the sides are literally pointing in opposite directions!) ,and as it says on wikipedia "...the result is a perceived distortion, as unlike perspective projection, it is not how human vision or photography normally work. It also can easily result in situations where depth and altitude are difficult to gauge..."

It's like I'm stuck rotating drawings by a 9-year-old.

Sure, I can live my life without perspective view in mastercam, and I'll get used to it, but coming from programs that have realistic 3D graphics (e.g. Autodesk's perspective with ortho faces), this seems ridiculous.
 

[JoshC]

1 hour ago, HyperSix said:

People get used to the weirdest things.
After searching and reading about this subject, I'm convinced that the isometric view is just a relic from the past,
and the only reason it seems to even exist is that, in the olden days, it was easier to draw by hand.

Even a simple rectangle looks like a trapezoid that gets wider and wider in isometric view when viewing from a steep angle (the sides are literally pointing in opposite directions!) ,and as it says on wikipedia "...the result is a perceived distortion, as unlike perspective projection, it is not how human vision or photography normally work. It also can easily result in situations where depth and altitude are difficult to gauge..."

It's like I'm stuck rotating drawings by a 9-year-old.

Sure, I can live my life without perspective view in mastercam, and I'll get used to it, but coming from programs that have realistic 3D graphics (e.g. Autodesk's perspective with ortho faces), this seems ridiculous.
 

yea i guess its all about what your used to, because i just started my solidworks to try perspective views out and dont like it one bit from what im seeing. probs just one of those things that once you get used to something that what you like or are accustomed to. seems like also the settings intended for more of making drawings and things, from a manufacturing a part standpoint i don't see any benefits personally, these are of course just my opinions and to each their own so nothing wrong your suggestions tho and welcome to the forums, glad to have you

[Jobnt]

Nice necro!

First thing I do is turn that crap off. It's deceiving when looking at it on a 2d screen. If screens had 3d it "might" be a different story. 

It's like I'm stuck looking at a drawing of a horse from a typical 6 year old with a huge head, normal body and tiny feet.

[JoshC]

if anyone doesnt know what we are talking about heres an image

[SuperHoneyBadger]

On 6/2/2023 at 2:38 PM, HyperSix said:

 coming from programs that have realistic 3D graphics (e.g. Autodesk's perspective with ortho faces)

 

The big difference is between engineering design, and artistic design. I have spent my time in XSI SoftImage, Unreal and various 3D compositing environments. Priority there is solely what an object looks like. That category of program doesn't even have the option of handling scale 95% of the time, and units are arbitrary outside of degrees. Model it, UV flow, texture/materials, animate, render, move on. The image/model IS the final product.

Priority in CAD/CAM is fit and function, you can't see that in a perspective viewport. The model here is not the final product, but a means to an end. Parallel lines and similar sized features are two big examples that come to mind. Orthographic was selected not only because it was less taxing on the CPUs of the day (matrix transforms for each movement, etc), but because it shows features the same way as engineering drawings were made on drafting tables, and we needed consistency between the physical and the virtual. Hell, we still do. It's not that the projection is antiquated, but necessary to represent 3D features in 2D in a way that is easily, and quickly understood.

Dissertation aside, I had my gripes with it initially, moving from the art world into CAD with SolidEdge, where you are allowed to model in a perspective viewport. It's whackadoodle crazy trying to line things up, or make similar sized features. I didn't spend more than a few days struggling, with an old-salt engineer over my shoulder chuckling to himself.