Stephen

Haas VF2 accessories

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I'm looking at adding a 5th axis trunnion to a Haas VF2. Should I get a Haas TR160 or should I look at other brands? Do I need to relocate the OTS table probe? Lastly, can you recommend a tooling plate system to quick change/locate the trunnion and Kurt vises? This will be used in an educational setting.

 

Thanks,

Steve

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The 160 is kinda a toy. even their 210 is not a robust unit and wont fit on the vf2.

sell the VF and get the UMC SS.

 

Chick has ready made vise and tooling plates for hass products. Especially if you are going to tombstone a 4th.

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The 160 is kinda a toy. even their 210 is not a robust unit and wont fit on the vf2.

sell the VF and get the UMC SS.

 

Chick has ready made vise and tooling plates for hass products. Especially if you are going to tombstone a 4th.

Huh! I ran a VF2 with an HRT210 on it. Ran just fine (indexing and full 4th axis machining). It does use up a little real estate but it works. We might have had a riser under it, or a subplate of some kind as maybe the T slots don't line up in the VF2, not sure...

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^^^i sit corrected.open mouth, insert foot.

I ran a 210 on a VM3 and it was a total pig on space, so i just assumed...

 

one thing to keep in mind on the TR160Y is that it leaves some real estate on the table, right?

 enough to get a vise maybe?

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We have TR160's on our VM2's and have TRT100's on the way for them. The 160's work great on the 2 size machines. The 160 perform really well for us on 3+2 and 5x. Its pretty seamless plug and play. We mount our OTS unit on a riser to get them above the rotary. We have UMC 750's as well depends on your work and part size as to what would be better for your application. 

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We installed 8 TR160-2's with New VF-4's several years back. I had a lot of issues with accuracy, in particular on the A axis tilts. We would zero out the platter and tilt to 90° and it would be out by .001"+ over 4.5". This doesn't seem bad until you start working on long objects high off the platter 6-8" and you have taper in your part because the platter isn't really at 90°. The error would double when working on 180° faces, so thicknesses would be off by as much as .004-.006" depending on the setup. Keep in mind, new trunions are supposed to have a scale now. I had to have Haas unlock the ball screw comp page in the control to work this issue out. Still from time to time I have to comp odd A-tilt angles when tight part tolerances are out of spec. All of the trunions had these issues.

 

Other thing is the brakes are pitiful (200 ft-lbs holding). I've overcome the brake with relatively small drills (7/16 I believe was the smallest) unless you want to slow down what you're doing.

 

So if these headaches are acceptable it's a pretty cheap way into 3+2. But if you're considering new machines to get into the 5 axis realm, I would seriously consider others. I did price out a comparable Koma precision table and it nearly cost what the machine cost to begin with. But the brakes were 8000 ft-lbs holding with hydraulic pressure and certainly much more accurate and robust. We also have Mazak variaxis and matsurra MAM and their accuracy is excellent as well as holding power, with much larger working areas.

 

Good luck

 

Greg

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I had a lot of issues with accuracy, in particular on the A axis tilts.

 

Did you have them calibrated?  That can make a huge difference.  We had PQI do a laser cal and ball-bar.

 

Yes, the TR160Y is designed to be setup with the A rotating around Y.  In the VF3 it fits without giving up any table travel, not sure about the VF2. I have it right-justified on the table and I have enough X leftover for a 6" vise and a Lang pallet station.  The tool setter lives on the back-left corner of the table.

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Did you have them calibrated?  That can make a huge difference.  We had PQI do a laser cal and ball-bar.

 

Yes, the TR160Y is designed to be setup with the A rotating around Y.  In the VF3 it fits without giving up any table travel, not sure about the VF2. I have it right-justified on the table and I have enough X leftover for a 6" vise and a Lang pallet station.  The tool setter lives on the back-left corner of the table.

sounds like a nice setup...

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We ran a TR160 on a VF2SS and a VM3.  On the VF2 it was a really tight fit and the tool setter had to be on a riser.  When tilted at 90 degrees, Y-axis travel could also be an issue but for smaller work it wasn't a problem.  On the VM3 we biased the rotary toward the front of the machine and did all of our work with the rotary tilted away and there was a ton of room.  We could also use the tool setter without needing a riser.  The only downer was it was SLOOOOW!  We were porting some heads at 55 minutes where a faster setup (Makino/ Koma) got it done in 20 with a better finish.

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Yeah, it's not the fastest trunnion out there that's for sure.  In our case it's a relatively inexpensive way for the company to try out in-house prototyping.  Once I prove well enough that I can make the parts (with short enough turn around) there's money for better machines.  With four to twelve part runs it's not that big a hindrance.

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Did you have them calibrated?  That can make a huge difference.  We had PQI do a laser cal and ball-bar.

 

Yes, the TR160Y is designed to be setup with the A rotating around Y.  In the VF3 it fits without giving up any table travel, not sure about the VF2. I have it right-justified on the table and I have enough X leftover for a 6" vise and a Lang pallet station.  The tool setter lives on the back-left corner of the table.

We had Haas come in and tried to work with them. I don't remember anything about having them calibrated. I remember going back and forth to get the ball screw length comp page unlocked so I could do my own calibrating, but I didn't go through every angle combo.

 

Do you have any more info on PQI, I've not heard of them. I'd be interested in at lease learning more about them. I still would have thought that with the addition of a scale, it would be a bit more accurate out of the box.

 

Greg

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