Automating a Haas VMC

[[email protected]]

Hi guys I have a real cool question today about eliminating two steps for an automation process. I am trying to get rid of the need to have an operator load a program from server into the active memory of the Haas and press cycle start. I know there is a port 5900 on the haas machines that can let you use an app called REAL VNC where you can see everything from the controller on another device but I don't know of a way to control the machine from an outside source.

Anyway please let me know if you have any relevant knowledge or the direction to look for some, Thank You

 

 

 

[JoshC]

30 minutes ago, [email protected] said:

Hi guys I have a real cool question today about eliminating two steps for an automation process. I am trying to get rid of the need to have an operator load a program from server into the active memory of the Haas and press cycle start. I know there is a port 5900 on the haas machines that can let you use an app called REAL VNC where you can see everything from the controller on another device but I don't know of a way to control the machine from an outside source.

Anyway please let me know if you have any relevant knowledge or the direction to look for some, Thank You

 

 

 

I do not know much about this but i just watched a Haas Tip of the day recently that talked about this and right in the video the individual mentions this data is read only and can only be viewed and nothing can be sent back to the control. Im only going by what he stated in the video but from that video i dont think you can send data to the controller. Here is a link to the Haas Tip of the day where he discusses this. 

 

[crazy^millman]

39 minutes ago, [email protected] said:

Hi guys I have a real cool question today about eliminating two steps for an automation process. I am trying to get rid of the need to have an operator load a program from server into the active memory of the Haas and press cycle start. I know there is a port 5900 on the haas machines that can let you use an app called REAL VNC where you can see everything from the controller on another device but I don't know of a way to control the machine from an outside source.

Anyway please let me know if you have any relevant knowledge or the direction to look for some, Thank You

You need an external system with a PLC logic to control this. This is what Cell System Controller does. You schedule your program hit the green button and it does all the rest. Not sure you going to do that with a HAAS I think you need to look to Fastems or someone like that to help make what your after happen.

[[email protected]]

Thanks for the quick responses JoshC and C^Millman. Is Cell System Controller a company or a type of controller? The goal of this step is to take an operator completely out of an automated process. Where the only two tasks the operator does is select a program from server and press cycle start. From what I understand the server automatically sends the program that corresponds to what the Haas will be cutting. I contacted my local Haas distributor as well I'll let you all know what I hear back.

[nickbe10]

16 minutes ago, [email protected] said:

Is Cell System Controller a company or a type of controller?

 

Cell System Controller is the control used to Manage a cell system made up of at least 1 spindle (normally an HMC as these are configured for the purpose) and 3 Pallets (each carrying some sort of work mounting device or "tombstone"). The system also includes a robot which loads and unloads the pallets from the machine to a load station for part changes while the spindle machines another pallet. This is the most simple form.

Last Cell I ran was a Linear Cell with 2 spindles (Mori Seiki HMCs) with 42 pallets. The Cell controller allocates appropriate programs to the spindle for the Pallet entering the machine and prioritizes jobs in the queue.

[mkd]

asking the simple question first, Is this something that could be done with an M98?

[Colin Gilchrist]

17 minutes ago, nickbe10 said:

 

Cell System Controller is the control used to Manage a cell system made up of at least 1 spindle (normally an HMC as these are configured for the purpose) and 3 Pallets (each carrying some sort of work mounting device or "tombstone"). The system also includes a robot which loads and unloads the pallets from the machine to a load station for part changes while the spindle machines another pallet. This is the most simple form.

Last Cell I ran was a Linear Cell with 2 spindles (Mori Seiki HMCs) with 42 pallets. The Cell controller allocates appropriate programs to the spindle for the Pallet entering the machine and prioritizes jobs in the queue.

I am not aware of any system that will allow you to "run" the machine automatically. Someone has to be there to physically hit the button. 

[crazy^millman]

1 hour ago, Colin Gilchrist said:

I am not aware of any system that will allow you to "run" the machine automatically. Someone has to be there to physically hit the button. 

I think they understand someone has to start the process hitting some button, but I think reading between the lines is they have several parts running through the machine and must load programs for each of those parts. Then hit the green button. Could be a Robot loading parts and unloading them or it could be 20 different parts on the machine your guess is as good as mind since we are throwing darts in the dark blind folded from 1000s of miles away. If it is the 20 parts on the machine then running them all from USB and use M198 would be one way if the programs are to big to fit in the memory. A lot of questions on this one before someone hits the right combinations to ask to get more facts.

[nickbe10]

1 hour ago, Colin Gilchrist said:

I am not aware of any system that will allow you to "run" the machine automatically.

Most cell systems and controllers will allow "lights out unmanned" running. I don't see how you would rig one into a VMC that would be cheaper than just buying a cell system.

I used to arrive at work , load up 15 - 20 pallets , hit the button and go run another machine for a few hours and then go back and swap some parts from one op to the other add stock material etc......I would also load a bunch up before leaving and they would run out between end of "swing" and "days" arriving.

Of course for this you need to have the tool management system up and running, and it was all Aluminium. Get's more involved with hard metals, but doable with a good set up

If you could do it with an M98 it probably wouldn't be classified as a true cell but as a pallet changer, which you can get in VMC but your unmanned machining time is limited as you have only two pallets swapping back and forth.

[huskermcdoogle]

1 minute ago, nickbe10 said:

I used to arrive at work , load up 15 - 20 pallets , hit the button and go run another machine for a few hours and then go back and swap some parts from one op to the other add stock material etc......I would also load a bunch up before leaving and they would run out between end of "swing" and "days" arriving.

BIggest problem we had with our's was keeping the chip bins from overflowing onto the floor....

[[email protected]]

Okay I apologize for not giving more info but there is only a certain amount of detail I can go into. This is for an Automated process to cut unique parts that a robot identifies by reading a QR Code placed on the "pallet" at an earlier stage on the conveyor. When the robot has read the code it queues the system to have the server send that program to the Haas VMC. This is where currently the Human Operator loads the program from "NET SHARE" on the Haas Controller and saves it to its internal memory, selects it as the active program and presses cycle start. From what I have been told the part is loaded by robot and the door opens and shuts automatically. Hope that clarifies some things.

[mkd]

Seems like such a specific question could be answered only by Haas in Oxnard or a remote chance someone has already done it on a modern Haas. All my exp is with older hardware. I'd suppose with Haas' linux based NGC anything is possible.

 Seems like for such a high end application would route a shop to a high end cell system already commercially available.

 It seems your prescribed method is really swimming upstream and that reasoning is not readily apparent. Why would you not simply order a cell controller to run XXX program with XXX pallet?

[[email protected]]

I may look to Custom Macro B programming because there may not be a need to control it from another source. The Haas simply has to select whatever program is in its net share and cycle start. I would love to give you guys every detail for clarity but I don't think I'm permitted to do so, I can say that all of your replies have been a great help and I thank you all very much.  btw mkd what is this Haas' linux based NGC you speak of? I've never heard of it.

[YoDoug®]

Most MTB's have some sort of robot interface that allows for remote program select. This is what cell controllers and robots use to load programs. Some of them are Ethernet IP and others are oldschool BCD IO. I know for sure Fanuc and Okuma are add on options. I don't know what Haas has but I would guess they have something available. 

[huskermcdoogle]

I was going to say was yodoug was said.  Surely they have something.  If not, it would be pretty simple to setup some I/O communication between the robot and the control that could easily through macro programming based on I/O status select a program.  If you had 8 bits of communication,  you could select up to 256 different programs. 

But I am guessing you have unique programs on each pallet, that will have to be supplied from the network source.  If this was a fanuc control, this would easy as pie to accomplish....

[mkd]

12 hours ago, [email protected] said:

btw mkd what is this Haas' linux based NGC you speak of? I've never heard of it.

What they are calling their Next Gen Control is really running linux under the hood, from what I heard.

What you need to do sounds simple enough.  it would probably save time to ring Haas in oxnard and ask about robot interfaces.

 love to hear what the solution ends up being. Report back. Haha

[nickbe10]

Seems like a long way round when you could have just bought a linear cell in the first place. All the best MTBs make them and then you have a truly integrated system.....and probably cheaper too, once you factor in the time......

[[email protected]]

Hey all I don't know what their solution is going to be, but my part in this is done for now I appreciate all of the knowledge and information shared. I pointed the team leading this project to many of the options you all mentioned and their applications engineers will explore them.  If I ever hear back about what solution they went with I will definitely let you guys know what I am permitted to.

[Matthew Hajicek - Singularity]

I've seen some setups where they actually have a robot physically push the green button.  Wouldn't be too hard to have it push buttons to load the program too.  In theory one could even have it punch in MDI commands... 

[[email protected]]

You know that sounds like a pretty simple solution, but kind of like you guys I wasn't given every detail but if the robot had the dexterity to load the part it could probably be programmed to push the buttons necessary to load a .NC file from net share and hit cycle start. Thanks