PARAMETER FOR ALL DEPTH, FINAL DEPTH

[PcRobotic]

Hello,
   I wonder if there are any parameter number for ALL DEPTH and FINAL DEPTH?  I looked and I couldn't find the right one.  These only I found
12265, DO FINISH PASSES AT ALL DEPTHS (TRUE/FALSE)
12250, bit 0 means line are relative...
12397, machine finish passes at: true = all depth, false = final depth

 

ps: I am trying to write an alarm message if I am using DEPTH CUTS with ALL DEPTHS.  Somehow I didn't make it right, please help if you have time.

I would like to know the parameter for (A) and (B).

 

Thank you.

 

====================================
I tried like this....
 

#Region PHeader
pheader$         #Call before start of file
	  if FinishPassesType <> 0 | FinishPassesType = 0, *FinishPassesType, "FINAL DEPTH", e$

#Region Customed variable
FinishPassesType: 0
#EndRegion Customed variable

fmt      4 FinishPassesType

if prmcode$ = 12396, FinishPassesType = rpar(sparameter$, 1)

if DepthCutsIO = 1 & MultiPassesIO = 1 & FinishPassesType = 0, [if mprint(sFinishPassesAllDepthCheck, 2) = 2, exitpost$] #Check spring passes

#Region sFinishPassesAllDepthCheck
sFinishPassesAllDepthCheck = "CUT# "+sToolPathNumber+" You have ALL DEPTHS in FINISH PASSES in DEPTH CUTS"
                             +no2asc(13)+"TOOL#"+no2str(t$)
                             +" ("+no2str(tldia$)+", "+s20001+")"
                             +no2asc(13)
							 +no2asc(13)+"This will lead to time consumming, everything is DOUBLE!!!"
                             +no2asc(13)
                             +no2asc(13)+"If you feel this is a mistake, do these following steps:"
                             +no2asc(13)+"Step 1 = Click on PARAMETER"
                             +no2asc(13)+"Step 2 = Click on MULLTI PASSES tab"
                             +no2asc(13)+"Step 3 = Change from ALL DEPTH to FINAL DEPTH"
                             +no2asc(13)
                             +no2asc(13)+ "If you avoid to fix this issue, you have TOO MUCH air cut!!!"
                             +no2asc(13)
                             +no2asc(13)+"                                      OK to proceed posting."
                             +no2asc(13)+"                                      CANCEL to abort posting."
#EndRegion sFinishPassesAllDepthCheck

[Zaffin_D]

41773, but it's  a new parameter for Mastercam 2018.

[crazy^millman]

If I had to answer any question from the post like the ones it looks like you are doing I would go find me a different job, I am not trying to be mean, but you chase some of the most obscure things I have seen in my 30+ years of programming. 

[jlw™]

8 hours ago, C^Millman said:

If I had to answer any question from the post like the ones it looks like you are doing I would go find me a different job, I am not trying to be mean, but you chase some of the most obscure things I have seen in my 30+ years of programming. 

My thoughts exactly.  I wonder if a lot of it is just to see if he can do it.

[Zaffin_D]

Even if the question isn't practical, it shows how powerful MP is.  There's not much you can't do in MP, especially when you consider that MP can call a hook and access Mastercam's API. 

 

[PcRobotic]

Hello all,
   The reason I wanted because most previous programmers they did the program right but WITHOUT OPERATION COMMENT and lack of TOOL COMMENT.  Most likely having MULTI PASSES and DEPTH CUTS at the same time is he meant to having RELIEF TOOL and He didn't say that since he is PROGRAM, SETUP AND RUN the parts by himself.  Therefore, I am writing an alarm just to double check, to ensure it is noted RELIEVED TOOL.

PS: Please see attached image for detail.

Thank you for your comment,
   S.Luong.
 

===================================

 

[Newbeeee™]

errrr, I don't understand this either.

Yes, MP is fantastic for getting what you want - but some of these requests are probably the reason CNC want to lock down the posts and go to MP Net

 

Stephen - are you saying that a person programmed, and then ran the parts (previously) and all was okay?

And when you have to make the parts again, you then want to check the mastercam file to see what tools are needed?

If so, how do you know that any changes that the original programmer and operator made to the program (speeds/feeds/depth of cuts if sub prog) were fed back into the mastercam file?

Would it not be safer to run the original nc file (machine proven program) through something like NCPlot and watch to see what has been done, collate your tool list, and if it's okay to run?

 

[crazy^millman]

On 7/29/2018 at 6:20 AM, jeff.D said:

Even if the question isn't practical, it shows how powerful MP is.  There's not much you can't do in MP, especially when you consider that MP can call a hook and access Mastercam's API. 

 

Jeff, our job as programmers is to make the work practical, predicable and repeatable to run day in and day out and yes MP is very powerful and yes it can do some amazing things, but none of that is going to help the companies he works for recoup all the time he puts into projects like this that from my experience cannot reap benefit. This is a case of someone before him that didn't do their job correctly and adding all of these checks and balances will never replace real world experience. There are 100's of way sometimes to machine a part and in this case it might serve this purposes, but what about the other 99 cases? Error checking anything is always 10X t o100X the original work of doing the process. A slippery slop is just that and when you get away from practical knowledge and trust some thing to always error proof something the problem is you don't learn what is the best way to get the job done. I can run it through this post that has the 500 questions to ask me things to check for mistakes. What happens when the 501th or the 657th error comes through? When does it becomes enough to check all the wrong things and not enough to just do it right the 1st time? When you spend 20 minutes answering all the questions on something that is programmed correctly would only take 2 minutes where is the value in always checking when if the correct process were done and trained then there wouldn't be an error to being with? That is the slippery slope when the process becomes to top heavy the supporting of it becomes so labor intensive it creates a lack of concern or care because well I don't have to do it right because the error checks will catch my mistakes.

[PcRobotic]

3 hours ago, Newbeeee™ said:

errrr, I don't understand this either.

Yes, MP is fantastic for getting what you want - but some of these requests are probably the reason CNC want to lock down the posts and go to MP Net

 

Stephen - are you saying that a person programmed, and then ran the parts (previously) and all was okay?

And when you have to make the parts again, you then want to check the mastercam file to see what tools are needed?

If so, how do you know that any changes that the original programmer and operator made to the program (speeds/feeds/depth of cuts if sub prog) were fed back into the mastercam file?

Would it not be safer to run the original nc file (machine proven program) through something like NCPlot and watch to see what has been done, collate your tool list, and if it's okay to run?

 

The reason is, he didn't put proper TOOL NOTE and that causes us some trouble because of misunderstanding.  Well, what can I say, I am here looking for an answer, not debating.

 

 

Thanks for your help.

[Newbeeee™]

1 hour ago, PcRobotic said:

The reason is, he didn't put proper TOOL NOTE and that causes us some trouble because of misunderstanding.  Well, what can I say, I am here looking for an answer, not debating.

 

 

Thanks for your help.

Yes, i understand that. But my question was valid.

Do you run the saved nc prog again when you make for a second time, as this program is surely proven? Or do you post out from mastercam and run that program for a second time?

Just trying to understand your process. I know you're looking for solutions but perhaps your processes need looking at

[Zaffin_D]

13 hours ago, C^Millman said:

Jeff, our job as programmers is to make the work practical, predicable and repeatable to run day in and day out and yes MP is very powerful and yes it can do some amazing things, but none of that is going to help the companies he works for recoup all the time he puts into projects like this that from my experience cannot reap benefit. This is a case of someone before him that didn't do their job correctly and adding all of these checks and balances will never replace real world experience. There are 100's of way sometimes to machine a part and in this case it might serve this purposes, but what about the other 99 cases? Error checking anything is always 10X t o100X the original work of doing the process. A slippery slop is just that and when you get away from practical knowledge and trust some thing to always error proof something the problem is you don't learn what is the best way to get the job done. I can run it through this post that has the 500 questions to ask me things to check for mistakes. What happens when the 501th or the 657th error comes through? When does it becomes enough to check all the wrong things and not enough to just do it right the 1st time? When you spend 20 minutes answering all the questions on something that is programmed correctly would only take 2 minutes where is the value in always checking when if the correct process were done and trained then there wouldn't be an error to being with? That is the slippery slope when the process becomes to top heavy the supporting of it becomes so labor intensive it creates a lack of concern or care because well I don't have to do it right because the error checks will catch my mistakes.

I don't disagree, as you've seen my posts are as basic as it gets.  I'm sharing information, not just for PcRobotic, but for any one that has the same question in the future.

[crazy^millman]

3 hours ago, jeff.D said:

I don't disagree, as you've seen my posts are as basic as it gets.  I'm sharing information, not just for PcRobotic, but for any one that has the same question in the future.

Great and appreciate you doing it.

[PcRobotic]

17 hours ago, Newbeeee™ said:

Yes, i understand that. But my question was valid.

Do you run the saved nc prog again when you make for a second time, as this program is surely proven? Or do you post out from mastercam and run that program for a second time?

Just trying to understand your process. I know you're looking for solutions but perhaps your processes need looking at

 

Here is his note from PROVEN PROGRAM, how do you explain this?

 

 

 

N30( .6250) ======================> This is the only note.... from proven NC, if you run you fail because this tool needs to be relief.

 

G0 G17 G40 G49 G80 G90
G91 G28 Z0 M19
/G28 Y0.
T30 M6
G90 G54 S3500 M3
X.7063 Y-1.1225
G43 H30 Z2. M8
Z.1
G1 Z-.305 F10.
G41 D30 Y-.9663
G3 X.55 Y-.81 R.1563
G2 Y.21 R.51
Y-.81 R.51
G3 X.3937 Y-.9663 R.1563
G1 G40 Y-1.1225
X.7063 Y-1.12
G41 D30 Y-.9638
G3 X.55 Y-.8075 R.1563
G2 Y.2075 R.5075
Y-.8075 R.5075
G3 X.3937 Y-.9637 R.1563
G1 G40 Y-1.12
Z.1 F.3
G0 Z2.
G91 G28 Z0. M9
/G28 Y0. M5
G0 G90 G54 X0.
M30

[crazy^millman]

1 minute ago, PcRobotic said:

 

Here is his note from PROVEN PROGRAM, how do you explain this?

 

 

 

N30( .6250) ======================> This is the only note.... from proven NC, if you run you fail because this tool needs to be relief.

 

G0 G17 G40 G49 G80 G90
G91 G28 Z0 M19
/G28 Y0.
T30 M6
G90 G54 S3500 M3
X.7063 Y-1.1225
G43 H30 Z2. M8
Z.1
G1 Z-.305 F10.
G41 D30 Y-.9663
G3 X.55 Y-.81 R.1563
G2 Y.21 R.51
Y-.81 R.51
G3 X.3937 Y-.9663 R.1563
G1 G40 Y-1.1225
X.7063 Y-1.12
G41 D30 Y-.9638
G3 X.55 Y-.8075 R.1563
G2 Y.2075 R.5075
Y-.8075 R.5075
G3 X.3937 Y-.9637 R.1563
G1 G40 Y-1.12
Z.1 F.3
G0 Z2.
G91 G28 Z0. M9
/G28 Y0. M5
G0 G90 G54 X0.
M30

Hew was lazy and the owner should have the work redone the correct way verses having you spend all this time writing error check in posts.

[PcRobotic]

1 minute ago, C^Millman said:

Hew was lazy and the owner should have the work redone the correct way verses having you spend all this time writing error check in posts.

Wait until you work with those kind of people and they left, leaving you a big trash mess to clean up then you'll need to write a lot of ERROR check for you.  In here we have no time to spend just to check other's people program, using AUTOMATIC CHECKING SYSTEM is the ONLY WAY.

[PcRobotic]

Just now, PcRobotic said:

Wait until you work with those kind of people and they left, leaving you a big trash mess to clean up then you'll need to write a lot of ERROR check for you.  In here we have no time to spend just to check other's people program, using AUTOMATIC CHECKING SYSTEM is the ONLY WAY.

 

3 minutes ago, C^Millman said:

Hew was lazy and the owner should have the work redone the correct way verses having you spend all this time writing error check in posts.

The owner doesn't are, he cares about MONEY.  Parts comes out good, who cares others.  This is the real story about us in CALIFORNIA, SAN JOSE, all shops are like that.

[Newbeeee™]

What type of work are you doing? Is it very complex/many tools or simpler 3axis type work?

Do the Parts repeat lots of time, or just once every blue moon?

 

[crazy^millman]

50 minutes ago, PcRobotic said:

Wait until you work with those kind of people and they left, leaving you a big trash mess to clean up then you'll need to write a lot of ERROR check for you.  In here we have no time to spend just to check other's people program, using AUTOMATIC CHECKING SYSTEM is the ONLY WAY.

Been most of my life doing that very thing and part of the job going into some shops. Sorry, but your preaching to the choir here and been in many shops were people were penny wise and $100 foolish. People think making an extra penny is good throwing a $100 away to make it. Funny when you show someone how to make that $100 verses the penny they always want to make $100 more verse the penny and that sir is our job teaching ans showing those who don't understand how to do it better. Once they see it only takes you 5 or 10 minutes to make something correct the 1st time verses 30minutes to an hour fighting and fighting something not sure you are making it correct then they take notice. Time is money also and our job is to show them how much they are wasting verses what they think they are saving.

[PcRobotic]

1 hour ago, Newbeeee™ said:

What type of work are you doing? Is it very complex/many tools or simpler 3axis type work?

Do the Parts repeat lots of time, or just once every blue moon?

 

 

We have repeat jobs but not big quantities, from 10 to 30  small pieces (about 7 inches as biggest).

We are working in an environment of which people afraid to get fired, so they after fixed the NC and never BACK UP, saved them in their own USB FLASH DRIVE.  The next person is JACKED UP from the SOURCE file.  That is what happening now and that is what I need to get some knowledge from you guys how to make it checks for me for the COMP and other stuff.

 

[PcRobotic]

14 minutes ago, C^Millman said:

Been most of my life doing that very thing and part of the job going into some shops. Sorry, but your preaching to the choir here and been in many shops were people were penny wise and $100 foolish. People think making an extra penny is good throwing a $100 away to make it. Funny when you show someone how to make that $100 verses the penny they always want to make $100 more verse the penny and that sir is our job teaching ans showing those who don't understand how to do it better. Once they see it only takes you 5 or 10 minutes to make something correct the 1st time verses 30minutes to an hour fighting and fighting something not sure you are making it correct then they take notice. Time is money also and our job is to show them how much they are wasting verses what they think they are saving.

If you were as an OWNER in SAN JOSE, CALIFORNIA you'll understand.  He cannot get the job at the price of what I wished for, so the price is low margin already.  Scrap parts will causing him out of business due to the cost of living, salary and benefits he has to pay so high.  Therefore, time is money for him and he is willing to scream on the floor whenever an error is occurred at any employee.

[crazy^millman]

7 minutes ago, PcRobotic said:

 

We have repeat jobs but not big quantities, from 10 to 30  small pieces (about 7 inches as biggest).

We are working in an environment of which people afraid to get fired, so they after fixed the NC and never BACK UP, saved them in their own USB FLASH DRIVE.  The next person is JACKED UP from the SOURCE file.  That is what happening now and that is what I need to get some knowledge from you guys how to make it checks for me for the COMP and other stuff.

 

Because there is no security there is a the biggest problem with that shop. The owner is foolish and may be making money, but is throwing away so much more making everyone of the employees feel that way. I am sorry you feel you have to work that way, but you don't. I have taken problems home and fixed them at some places brought them back and showed owners what doing it the right way does for them and the people having to run the programs. Once they see the light many times they back up and see why they should do it differently. Not always and have walked from some job because of there very mentality you are talking about. I worked in 42 shops before doing what I do now and if that doesn't tell you how I put up with things like what you are talking about nothing will.

[Guest]

47 minutes ago, C^Millman said:

I worked in 42 shops before doing what I do now and if that doesn't tell you how I put up with things like what you are talking about nothing will.

DAMN, I'm at 24 right now, and it almost became 25 this morning

[Newbeeee™]

2 hours ago, PcRobotic said:

 

We have repeat jobs but not big quantities, from 10 to 30  small pieces (about 7 inches as biggest).

We are working in an environment of which people afraid to get fired, so they after fixed the NC and never BACK UP, saved them in their own USB FLASH DRIVE.  The next person is JACKED UP from the SOURCE file.  That is what happening now and that is what I need to get some knowledge from you guys how to make it checks for me for the COMP and other stuff.

 

Not teaching you to suck eggs, but you have a culture and process situation going on here.

So operators run a prog, and "fix" the prog and then save it to their own usb drive.

This was the point I was trying to get to. It's been programmed in mastercam, FIXED on the machine and then saved.

#1 is you need to round up all the USB drives and implement a controlled (backed up) network/file management system, where just the one FIXED program is available.

#2 yes, you can implement a million checks into your post, but the mastercam file is wrong. It is not FIXED by the operator on the machine. The changes that were made to get the good parts, were not fed back to the mastercam file.

This is why I suggested running the proven (FIXED) nc file through something like NCPlot to verify what it's doing (and collate a tool list then), before running the next batch of parts.

[crazy^millman]

3 hours ago, JParis said:

DAMN, I'm at 24 right now, and it almost became 25 this morning

Well only 6 in were in the 15 years before doing what I am doing now. In 3 months I worked in 7 different shops when I was 22. By the time I was 25 I had about 30 different jobs. I worked at one place for one hour and told them to fly a kite. Worked at some shops for a week and said nope not doing this. Was brought in as a shop supervisor at one place. After 3 days of sweeping the floor I was put on a lathe to rough some parts. The prints were all messed up and pointed out the errors to the owner. He said just cut tho these dimensions and I will get you the answer next week. He didn't expect me to rough it in 1 day and be ready for finish, but I was. He then got the answered and figured out I was correct and had rough an extra 1 to 2 inches of stock in key areas. He said no worry we will just sleeve and pin it and ship it to the customer they will never know. I was 1200 miles from home thinking this was going to be good chance for me. I packed up that night and went back home. People talk about how hard it is I had to call the police one time to clear my name after being accused of stealing tools I didn't. I had to pack up my tools at another place after every one left on a Friday night because they had kept several employees tools who had quit. I talked to a police officer and he said if you have keys to place possessions is 9/10 of the law you go get your tools and then quit. So I did next day the owners son shows up to fight about it. We talked and he was not happy I quit, but said he got it. Then Monday I get a call from the police for stealing company files. I talk to the police officer and he walks out to the file cabinet I kept everything for the shop in above and beyond what they did and proceeded to show them all the files and work they accused me of stealing and told me to have a nice day. I worked in another place for about 6 weeks where the one owner came in stoned out of his mind and started cleaning his loaded 9mm at the desk right behind me and told me if I couldn't handle it I could leave. I was working in another shop as an apprentice getting paid $8.50 an hour. They would bring 20 year guys at $18/hr to $20/hr and have me train them on different machines in the shop. How to run the speeds and feeds I would run on tools because they were all too scared to cut parts like I was doing it. When I asked for a raise I was told your an apprentice and if you want your card you will just have to deal with it. I was teaching half of the classes in the apprenticeship programs. I got cussed out by the one of owners for something he told me to do, but felt I didn't. He kicked a hole in a door and threw some tools and they sent me home without pay and cut my pay by a dollar an hour. I came back in with a new job and they were willing to let me stay if and the other owner admitted he was wrong, but the sower who cussed me out wrongly was not going to apologize I told them to fly a kite. I then worked in a shop were I was told learn the screw machine and if you do that after 3 months you will get a $2/hr raise. I learned it and helped them get $7 million in medial contractors. I had a ladder logic process they patented and sold to Fanuc that I didn't get a dime for. My 3 months came and I was told I was young with no family and don't need a raise.  I stuck it our for one more month and then the owners son was trying to do this project he couldn't. I took it over and got it all done and figured out. He then proceeded to take credit for my work. I called him out about it and he cussed me out and demoted me to operator. I told them to fly a kite.

I was shop supervisor at a place where an employee was stealing time from the company and I fire him. He showed his immediate supervisor a glock 9mm and said he was going to kill me. I had to call the police the owner was not going to. I helped that company get AS9100 approved and was in pain before having Diverticulitis surgery. We got through our audit and I told them I am going to the hospital to have surgery I was back to work 4 weeks later 45lbs lighter. They were not going to support me on someone trying to kill me. Police call me after I left that job that I worked with gcode at and John316 is still at to tell me he was going to prison for 25+ to life as the gun found on him at his arrest for assault charges on someone was used to kill a CHP officer.

That is a small sample of things I have been through in my 30+ years in this trade. Point is we have to know our worth and our value and be willing to do what is right even when everyone around us is calling us crazy. Right is right no matter how rack it, stack it or do it. When you always try to do your best the truth will come out. Not always going to win and not always going to get treated correctly, but when you just say nothing and do nothing to make your life better then it will not get better.

[Newbeeee™]

Ron, I think it's quite apparent that you've come across more than your fair share of utter waste of space business owners.

There's the odd bad one in the UK that I have come across, but they're amateurs to what you've faced.