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Fadal over travel in Z when positioning


navsENG
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Ok, so I am helping a buddy at another shop and he has a late 90s fadal 3016. The issue I am having is that when it calls up E1 (offset) and positions in X and Y , it wants to move in Z as well.. 

I think my issue is that I set all the tools off the table, and my Z work offset is say 5 or 6". It seems that if this value is over the 4" that you have (for tool change height above Z0) , then it will alarm out.. I have been able to "fix" this by putting a z-3. or so on the intial positioning line (before it calls up a tool offset) and it runs ok.. It is just a pain in the xxxx because I have to do this manually.... Is there a setting or something on the machine to fix this???

I would rather not have to change where I set my tools 

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7 minutes ago, Leon82 said:

What is E1?

A also normally you would use a g43 with the h1 that would tell it to compensate your height for the tool unless the control is unique with the code it requires

 

without the g43 it's going to move z up whatever your work offset positive value is

This is just "fadal language" I guess.. They have format 1 and format 2. I am currently using format 1 and this is how it posts out/reads the code.. 

E1 is just a work offset. Like g54/55 etc. I have e1,e2 and so on 

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The G43 is not needed in the Fadal using format 1.  E1 is the call to use fixture offset 1.  E0 cancels fixture offset.

I usually run with values for X and Y in my fixture offsets with Z being zero.  My tool offsets are always negative and is the distance with z in home position from tool tip to Z zero on my part.  Press the manual key until "Enter next command " in display then type in DF for fixture display, DT for tool offset display,  There a tool length setting utility  Type UT and select option 1 and it will walk you through setting the length.  If you want to set tools off the table you should be able to compensate to your part zero using the Z value in the fixture offset but I have not done this.

More info on this is in the operators manual and these are available online but don't have a link in front.

Rick

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3 hours ago, rickt said:

The G43 is not needed in the Fadal using format 1.  E1 is the call to use fixture offset 1.  E0 cancels fixture offset.

I usually run with values for X and Y in my fixture offsets with Z being zero.  My tool offsets are always negative and is the distance with z in home position from tool tip to Z zero on my part.  Press the manual key until "Enter next command " in display then type in DF for fixture display, DT for tool offset display,  There a tool length setting utility  Type UT and select option 1 and it will walk you through setting the length.  If you want to set tools off the table you should be able to compensate to your part zero using the Z value in the fixture offset but I have not done this.

More info on this is in the operators manual and these are available online but don't have a link in front.

Rick

If I was only running one part at a time, ok I would just use a negative tool offset to the part sure.. I am running multiple programs, multiple fixtures etc with the same tools. I am trying to keep it as simple as possible so the people I am getting going can just change the fixture and run the appropriate program. 

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Can't  help with  that problem.  It seems to me that you want to set tool lengths as the distance from the gage line to the tool tip as would be done setting tools offline then using the fixture offsets for the different jobs.  Don't know if that can be done on a Fadal in format 1.  Maybe in format 2.

All of the Fadal manuals are available online and maybe somewhere in those there would be information that would point you in the right direction.  There is a thread on the Practical Machinist where someone has a method of setting positive tool offsets. I didn't read through it so I can't comment if it would be what you are looking for.

Sorry I can't be more help.

Rick

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It's  been over 10 years since I ran Fadals, so my memory is a bit fuzzy. We ran them in Format 1 as well. I recall the tool lengths in the offset page being the distance from the home position to Z0, so it was always a negative number, something like -8 to -12 inches, or so. It was never a positive value.

When we picked up our zero, we used the SETX and SETY commands. We never SETZ.

I also recall using G43.

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15 hours ago, rickt said:

Can't  help with  that problem.  It seems to me that you want to set tool lengths as the distance from the gage line to the tool tip as would be done setting tools offline then using the fixture offsets for the different jobs.  Don't know if that can be done on a Fadal in format 1.  Maybe in format 2.

All of the Fadal manuals are available online and maybe somewhere in those there would be information that would point you in the right direction.  There is a thread on the Practical Machinist where someone has a method of setting positive tool offsets. I didn't read through it so I can't comment if it would be what you are looking for.

Sorry I can't be more help.

Rick

I think the isssue with this format 1 is that it was designed for there to be a very small or 0 value in your fixture offset. If I tried to use positive tool lenghts, then my Z would be something like -10" or so in my fixture offset. In that case I believe it would try and go down -10" in Z (before it calls the tool offset) rather than heading up , since my value is a positive number... 

I "think" format 2 is what I should use , and it will be more traditional fanuc style code. I just dont feel like changing things over at the moment.. I will continue with my hand edits unless I figure out a better way... 

Thanks 

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On 10/17/2019 at 3:19 PM, navsENG said:

Ok, so I am helping a buddy at another shop and he has a late 90s fadal 3016. The issue I am having is that when it calls up E1 (offset) and positions in X and Y , it wants to move in Z as well.. 

I think my issue is that I set all the tools off the table, and my Z work offset is say 5 or 6". It seems that if this value is over the 4" that you have (for tool change height above Z0) , then it will alarm out.. I have been able to "fix" this by putting a z-3. or so on the intial positioning line (before it calls up a tool offset) and it runs ok.. It is just a pain in the xxxx because I have to do this manually.... Is there a setting or something on the machine to fix this???

I would rather not have to change where I set my tools 

I do exactly how you explain here but am using the fanuc format (g54, 55 etc). works very well for multiple setups on the table at one time.

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