Dear Administrators, Moderators, & Members Multax found these post guidelines. Review them and then ask yourselves if these proposed rules at emastercam.com can raise the LEVEL of WRITTEN DEBATE to the level of a professional or academic journal? Each of them, often quite quickly, deteriorated into a flame war. There is a place here at this board for this sort of discussion but there is no place here for insults and narrow minded jingoism. I would like to re-open these discussions with several conditions. By posting in this thread you agree to the following conditions. 1) The thread will be moderated more stringently than normal. Only serious and thoughtful discussion will be permitted. Should you, in the opinion of the moderators, post something that does not live up to these standards your post will be edited or deleted. 2) You agree neither to flame nor troll. One flames by posting insulting and defamatory messages with the intention of eliciting a flood of angry responses. Trolling has similar intentions but involves posting absurd messages instead of insulting ones. 3) You agree to respect the opinions of other posters and treat them in a civil manner. If you disagree with someone you will respectfully articulate the terms of your disagreement without denigrating them. 4) The moderators may at any time amend these guidelines should the need present itself. 5) If you witness a violation of any of these guidelines please contact a moderator rather than responding to it yourself. 6) Mere assertion of opinion will not cut it here. If you have an opinion then you must back it up with evidence and careful argumentation. Any thread on a similar topic will be closed or merged into this thread. So let us begin. [ 10-19-2001: Message edited by: Multax ]

“They conducted themselved, [themselves] plain and simply, like adults by accepting the blame and rectifying the situation. Making yourself out to be a martyr is not helping your case, Multax.” Bullines, at what point did Multax use the word “martyr”??? Please, limit your comments to the WORDS written by Multax.

Dear Bryan Davis As you read this post understand that Multax failed to conduct the necessary research to determine the full implications of the word in question. Bryan Davis, if Multax has caused you any anger, discomfort, hurt, indignation, pain, or if Multax has defamed you in any way, for that Multax apologizes to you, and to you alone. Multax used the word “wanker” without a full understanding of it’s connotation and denotation. Bryan Davis, Multax did not use the appropriate word for the occasion and Multax certainly did not mean to impute your personal reputation or integrity with definition no. 1. a taboo term for somebody who xxxxes or no.2. unpleasant, self-indulgent, pretentious, or arrogant person. posted 09-11-2001 02:55 PM by Bryan Davis "It's amazing that the country that saved the world from the darkness of the Nazi's should be the object of this senseless and pointless hatred." As an e[E]nglish national I am absolutely stunned that you could write this. “Whilst its probably true that without the USA entering the war the outcome would have been much different, its also true that the England stood all but alone against Nazi Germany, . . . NOT true, President Roosevelt addressed a joint session of Congress AT GREAT POLITICAL RISK and stated with a slight paraphrase; we can not and we will not allow Britain to fall. After this address, President Roosevelt instituted the “Lend Lease” program to ship arms, munitions, planes, trucks, and other supplies. I could be in error, however, I believe that the U.S. commenced it’s logistical support of England in 1940. After the war the U.S. FED both ENGLAND and GERMANY and prevented MASS starvation in both countries. 1948 brought the Marshall Plan and America’s rebuilding of Europe. and it took Japan, bombing Pearl Harbour to persuade the (American people) USA to abandon its policy of isolationism.” --------------------------------------------- “I am very sorry to say that I cant help but feel that its this kind of arrogance that makes your nation such a target.” Bryan Davis, I should have called you on this last statement in September. However, NOW I shall take the opportunity to do so. Your above statement violates every tenet of decency and civilization. It is hateful in the extreme and borders on evil. You had the temerity to spew these vile words on the very day that six thousand people, mostly Americans, along with citizens from eighty other countries suffered the horrors of incineration in an office building. How do you sleep at night? God only knows. I DEFY anyone to show me how this statement DOES NOT transgress the letter and spirit of the rule that governs speech on this forum. Bryan Davis, I hereby empathically state that your scurrilous statement knowingly violated the agreement not to use this “BB to post any material which is. . . defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane”. Multax did find your WORDS unpleasant, self-indulgent, pretentious, and arrogant in your responses and criticism of the United States in relation to the WTC terrorist attack. Multax also found the WORDS and IDEAS you used to express your criticism of Windows as the usual pompous sniping of the UGLY EUROPEAN. ------------------------------------------- Dear Webmaster and Dave Thompson “You agree, through your use of this service, that you will not use this BB to post any material which is knowingly false and/or defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy, or otherwise in violation of any law.” Multax used the word, “wanker”, apparently a vulgar term as Marco has demonstrated. Multax cannot and will not offer any Clintonisque excuses for the violation of the above stated rules. However, Multax finds it interesting that the “WEBMASTER” has trotted out the RULES in this case. Punish Multax as you will, but remember, more than a few of your other members have VIOLATED the above stated rules. IF you punish Multax, and FAIL to punish ALL former violators of the above stated rules in a like manner, then all of you, Bullines, Dave Thomson, Greg McKay, Jamie Mattison, and the WEBMASTER have proven themselves to lack the temperament, judgement, and objectivity to properly administer and moderate emastercam.com. [ 10-18-2001: Message edited by: Multax ]

quote: -------------------------------------------- Chill out wanker! Don’t you have a sense of humor??? -------------------------------------------- "I'm all for heated debates and conversation, but let's not resort to name-calling and direct insults." My dictionary does not have the word "wanker" in it. Please give me a short and concise reading of it's current meaning and useage. [ 10-17-2001: Message edited by: Multax ]

“Dear ex-colonialist who needs a reality check” quote: “MasaterCAM is NOT the worlds best/fastest/ most flexible CAM package!” You heretic!!! “so burn me!” Chill out wanker! Don’t you have a sense of humor??? “dare I mention Delcam?, but that’s not my argument... given an unlimited budget and projects that justified such an exercise what would be the CAM package and platform that the informed engineer would opt for? I don’t know the answer to this as its not an exercise I’ve needed to do, but I would be very surprised if the end result was MasterCAM, in fact I’ve doubts that it would be any PC based package.” Delcam, an excellent CAM package, however, we have UG and NCCS. Both of these CAM packages have P.C. based versions and can calculate true simultaneous FIVE-AXIS toolpaths. quote: The CURRENT Mac OS uses the Berkeley UNIX kernel and the SunSparc cannot even begin to compete with the Alpha21264, PA-RISC8700, or POWER4 RISC cpu’s. “Is that a fact, well you again are ignoring the point, that is unless you are prepared to stand up and say that the PC is the worlds best platform.” Mac’s and SparcStations qualify as “P.C.’s” Again, have your blokes developed anything better that the X86 Windows based P.C.??? “I am somewhat relieved that you may concede the shortcommings of windows, maybe 'our guys' currently don’t have anything better, but we will always be able to say we had the first as to others well, there have always been better OS than windows!” [ 10-17-2001: Message edited by: Multax ]

Dear British Subject “MasaterCAM is NOT the worlds best/fastest/most flexible CAM package!” You heretic!!! --------------------------------------------- “Is windows the worlds best operatingsystem..give me a break of course it is not! That maybe true, tell me though, have your blokes developed a superior OS!!!!!!!!!!!! --------------------------------------------- “if the crowd wanted faster computers, or better operating systems then we would all be using apple macs or sunsparcs.” The CURRENT Mac OS uses the Berkeley UNIX kernel and the SunSparc cannot even begin to compete with the Alpha21264, PA-RISC8700, or POWER4 RISC cpu’s. --------------------------------------------- Dear Bullines Can you address these questions? 1. Perhaps Microsoft’s 64 bit XP OS can run BOTH 32 bit and 64 bit software concurrently or sequentially??? 2. Under what conditions would Mastercam need a gigabyte or more of RAM??? As an example, Bullines, take the most complex surfaced machined part you’ve ever programed and change the stepover parameter to .0001". With a stepover that small will not the following resources determine the overall compute time; 1. OS? 2. Quality of the code within Mastercam? 3. FPU capabilities? 4. CPU frequency? 5. Total amount of CPU resources allocated to Mastercam? 6. Total amount of RAM allocated to Mastercam? 7. Memory bandwidth? 8. Memory latency? 9. Please add any factor I may have missed! 3. When will Mastercam have NURBS toolpath generation capabilities? --------------------------------------------- Dear & V9 Enthusiast! Tell us V9 Enthusiast, did you read Mr. Weber’s presentation??? “The other thing I was thinking about, this really is not the forum to debate the technical merits of one CPU architecture over another.” 1. Why not? 2. Who cares what you think!!! Remember, your employer DOES not care about what you think, they pay YOU for what you KNOW and what you can DO to enhance their profit margin!!! 3. When did you become Dave Thomson, Greg McKay, or Jamie Mattison??? “there is still not a 64-bit RISC CPU for the masses chip on the horizon” Very true, however, Intel has designed their Itanic with a totally new architecture called EPIC. “The applications just aren't there for it either and most software developers are not rushing out to develop software for this chipset that may not even be viable for the masses(meaning CHEAP!!!! ) for another 5-6 years.” 1. A chipset provides electronic support for a CPU 2. Very true, the Itanic does not qualify as a CHEAP!!!! cpu. “X86 still has some life and at current pricing, even higher -end PC's are certainly affordable for the masses.” 1. Mr. Weber’s presentation quite clearly demonstrates AMD’s faith in the X86 achitecture and his presentation also demonstrates their X86 enhancements at the 32 and 64 bit levels. Furthermore, AMD will allow the end user, that's you V9 enthusiast, the ability to buy a Hammer based system and run your 32 bit apps and upgrade to a 64 bit OS at your leisure. 2. The Hammer upon introduction will probably debut at a $1,000 or less per cpu. 3. Who knows & V9 Enthusiast, the Hammer just might provide such an awesome Mastercam seed increase, perhaps even YOU, an Intelphile, might buy one and sing it's praises [ 10-17-2001: Message edited by: Multax ]

A lite presentation for the erudite reader! -------------------------------------------- ........Here we go again........... So, who's got an extra 50-60 hours to burn doing research? Any takers????? -------------------------------------------- Should not all instructors conduct research as part of their personal and professional development and as a responsibility to their students? http://www.amd.com/us-en/Corporate/Virtual...15_3923,00.html Fred Weber Hammer Presentation [ 10-17-2001: Message edited by: Multax ]

Now that the 64 bit Windows XP OS, Intel’s Itanium CPU, and Mastercam’s V9 have arrived on the CAM scene. Can anyone present a WELL-REASONED, DOCUMENTED, and WELL WRITTEN argument against or in favor of the development of a 64 bit Mastercam that runs on Microsoft’s 64 bit Windows XP OS and Intel’s 64 bit Itanium CPU? AMD’s Thunderbird and Palomino cpu’s have proven that they have a significant performance advantage over INTEL’S PIII and PIV cpu’s in a clock for clock comparison in most scientific, graphics, and compute intensive applications as a result of AMD’s superior FPU implementation and other architectural improvements in Intel’s X86 architecture. AMD’s Claw and Sledge Hammer CPU’s will prove themselves as the best architecture in terms of value and perhaps even in performance for Mastercam in comparison tests with Intel’’s IA64 in 2002, and maybe in future years as well. AMD’s Hammer CPU’s use their version of Intel’s 32 bit architecture, and their 64 bit architecture will represent the FIRST ever development and deployment of a non-Intel extension to the X86 architecture. I doubt CNC Software can afford to develop and deploy their FIRST ever 64-bit program that can only run on Intel’s IA64 platform that in my opinion will cost between SIX and EIGHTEEN THOUSAND DOLLARS for a SINGLE cpu workstation upon introduction. Would CNC Software FORCE its users to choose Intel only platforms??? Recent threads have shown that many Mastercam user’s budgets have difficulty with sub five-hundred dollar video cards! Mr. Jay freely admitted that many customers buy the cheapest X86 box they can find. For an informal poll, let every user on emastercam answer this question. If CNC Software deployed Mastercam 9 or 10 as a Windows XP IA64 only app, and my prediction of system cost comes true, how many freelance Mastercam programmers, small business owners, and employers can, will, or want to pay the above predicted price to change platforms? In addition, what if Intel decides to build RDRAM only IA64 chipsets, or worse yet, what if Intel decides to implement a proprietary memory technology that they control? Intel’s web site states that, “Itanium processors will feature 2 and 4 MB of L3 cache and 800 and 733 MHz frequency speeds at prices ranging from $1,177 to $4,227.”” Consequently, ONE 800MHz Itanium CPU with 4 MB of L3 cache will COST $4,227 dollars and ONE 733MHz Itanium CPU with 2 MB of L3 cache will COST $1,177 dollars! Well, guess what INTEL LIED, the following prices came from Price Watch and represent current Itanium CPU pricing; 733mhz 2mb cache Itanium $3012 PC Nation Computer Warehouse Club 1-800-969-5255, Itanium i733 733mhz 2mb cache $3160 1-800- 969-5255, and a Itanium 800mhz 4mb cache $6726 800-969-5255 [ 10-17-2001: Message edited by: Multax ] [ 10-17-2001: Message edited by: Multax ]

Multax found this post at another website. All members at emastercam.com should keep this in mind when they post. --------------------------------------------- When a person expresses himself on the internet, he does so using the written word. He can only rely on the impression he gives by using his ability to write coherently. If you want to continue to give the impression that you're uneducated, so be it. It's your choice. ---------------------------------------------

An open letter to ALL Peace Loving and Law-Abiding Muslims that live in the USA. What do you think law-abiding and peace loving Muslims that have immigrated to the USA can do to assist law-enforcement in the identification, penetration, and capture of ALL remaining MUSLIM terrorist cells and their members that remain in the USA? REMEMBER, we have Muslims that live in and visit the USA that HATE America, Americans, and Americanism. This subgroup of the Muslim population that resides in the USA contribute MONEY, JOBS, REFUGE, and other resources that aide and abet these sub-human MONSTERS of MALEVOLENCE in their present and perhaps future terrorist activities. __________________

Multax would like ALL emastercam.com members to know Multax did not WRITE ANY OF THE WORDS to “A Philosophy of Work” and “A Philosophy of Work: Part II - Attitude”. However, Multax did write the titles. Multax posted these segments taken from a lecture given by “an American Philosopher” in order to raise the level of discourse from the mundane to the sublime. A Philosophy of Work: Part II - Attitude Practice your attitude And I know attitude is a difficult assignment. It was one of my most difficult assignments twenty-five years ago when I found out that attitude was everything. That attitude determines the direction you take, attitude determines how you TALK, how you WALK, how you DRESS, its all attitude. It was difficult, its difficult to look up attitude in the yellow pages and find out where to get help, right? If you could put your car in the shop and go next door and get your attitude tuned-up wouldn’t that be nice? You see, attitude is something you can work on everyday. It’s surprising how uniquely confident you can feel when you are working on the things that really count as far as emotions and your interchange with other people, affecting their behavior and mostly affecting your own. J.R. [ 08-29-2001: Message edited by: Multax ]

Now then Mr. Schultz taught me that the greatest reason for setting a goal was not to acquire the goal, and when I understood THAT, it revolutionized my whole life!!! The major purpose of the goal is not in obtaining the goal, obtaining the goal is the secondary value. The major value in going for the goal IS, what it makes of you in the pursuit of IT. The greatest value is not what you GET, but what you BECOME!!! It’s not what you go after, what you go after soon disappears. It’s what you become that counts!!! What we all must make sure of, is that the things that we’re going for is making something unique out of us in the pursuit of all of this!!! Now it also means that in order to have more YOU’VE got to become more!!! You see some people have the wrong philosophy, the guy says if oh I had a good job I’d really poor it on, but I’ve got this lousy job so I just goof off!!! See if that’s your philosophy then you are DESTINED to stay there... The major thing is what happens to you!!! Now here is also the WARNING, and the warning says, beware of what YOU BECOME in pursuit of what YOU WANT!!! You’ve got to be careful. Whatever you are doing make sure it’s making something unique out of you!!! J.R. [ 08-21-2001: Message edited by: Multax ]

Dear Beav700 I find your project compelling and in the best spirit of American ingenuity, perhaps my suggestions and OPINIONS can help you complete a successful project. Beav700, many of the respondents to your thread have proffered what type of metal to use for you indexable end mill. If you have the time, try to locate an authoritative and recently published 2000 or later metal’s handbook and compile a table that lists ALL of the metallic properties of each metal type listed by the post respondents, in fact you might even find a better type of metal in an exhaustive source. With this list, you should have enough data to eliminate most of the suggested metals and thus you can narrow your choices to three or less. The material’s handbook should cover heat-treatment and help you decide if the material you have chosen can benefit from heat treatment in general and what TYPE of heat-treatment in particular will produce the qualities YOU want your end mill to have. Beav700, you may want to READ the numerous articles printed in the “Modern Applications News” magazine www.modernapplicationsnews.com. from the December 1998 issue on that covers heat treatment technology. The March 1999 issue on page 92 covers deep cryogenic treatment to -300̊F. This process might provide most or all of the strength and hardness properties you desire in your indexable end mill. Finally, when you have decided what type of metal you want to use, YOU MUST BUY THE FINEST FORGED BAR STOCK MONEY CAN BUY, preferably a piece of bar stock that has a BIRTH CERTIFICATE! In terms of indexable end mill design, you may want to produce an exact copy of your present Kennametal or Sandvik tooling or find an existing indexable end mill design that you like. That will allow you to use THEIR cutting data as a baseline to start from and allow you to accelerate the development process as a consequence of your introduction of two NEW variables into the cutting data equation. Remember Beav700, even with an EXACT copy of your present Kennametal or Sandvik, or brand X tooling, you have introduced two significant changes, the type of metal and its hardness and grain structure. This can cause the cutting environment your inserts operate under to change from the insignificant to the profound. So, proceed with great CAUTION when you attempt your first cut with your new cutting toy. I have melted, shattered, and snapped the flutes off too many high quality end mills to joyride with an unproven toy tool. Beav700, use your common sense when you make your first cuts and parts with this tool, treat this new and UNPROVEN tool as though you had a hand grenade in your hand with the pin pulled!!! Beav700, you do not want to add your tool project to the recent CRASH thread!!! Make sure you speak to the technical support people at Kennametal and Sandvik and squeeze every once of information and data they have on your chosen inserts. You MUST know every chemical and mechanical aspect of these inserts that affects cutting performance and safety. If your machine has through the spindle coolant capabilities, make sure your indexable end mills have the proper passages to utilize pressurized coolant. However, ask the tech people if YOUR chosen inserts can withstand the thermal shock of coolant in a cutting environment. I hope my suggestions and OPINIONS can help lead you in the right direction, however, do not trust anyone and PLEASE DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH to confirm or destroy EVERYONE’S OPINIONS!!! Multax Dear Gcode Thank you for an extremely good laugh! “This is just an opinion with zero science behind it so Multax may have me shot” Thank you again for an extremely good laugh! “OT: James, you'd best watch it with those opinions! You'll be standing next to me when Multax puts us against the wall.” [ 08-09-2001: Message edited by: Multax ]

The post that follows represents a private conversation between Multax and Meyette. Dear Mr. Meyette Multax challenged your first amendment knowledge, and your inchoate mind responded with, "so I will respond to what I feel is important and ignore the chaff." Mr. Meyette, a feeble and shallow mind can easily parrot the words of others. Please remind the emastercam.com community of one topic that you have started or commented on that has greater significance than the First Amendment to the United States Constitution. Mr. Meyette, the following statement as written by you would lead people to believe that you desire civility and use measured words, “And on another note, I'd appreciate keeping the personal attacks at a minimum. This is a pretty friendly community and we'd like to keep it that way.” However your latest statement betrays you, “Evidently, somebody's panties are in a bunch, or somebody peed in their Cheerio's. LOL.” However, your allusions to women’s clothing and a bodily function clearly demonstrate your lowbrow vocabulary. “I do not need Webby to defend me. His assertion that I did not want to respond to your infantile "pissing" contest (for lack of a better term) was right on the mark.” Mr. Meyette, again, your churlish vocabulary clearly demonstrates an inability to communicate politely and present yourself as a man among men with class. I do not believe, I cannot believe, that you would invite anyone into your home on a consistent basis to speak to your wife and children with the same vulgar speech that you have and continue to use on this forum. Any response would not have served any purpose other than to acknowledge your BANE existance here in this forum and to supplant your incessant need to express yourself in a manner that attempts to put yourself where you don't belong. 1bane ˈbān n [ME, fr. OE bana; akin to OHG bano death, Av banta ill] (bef. 12c) 1 a obs : KILLER, SLAYER b : POISON c : DEATH, DESTRUCTION d : woe 2 : a source of harm or ruin : CURSE Mr. Meyette, in what sense do YOU use bane in the above sentence? “. . . to supplant your incessant need to express yourself in a manner that attempts to put yourself where you don't belong.” Please elaborate! “Furthermore, speaking in third person is generally not necessary here.” Why? quote: ....Multax does not boast.... _____________________________________________ It seems, well,.... a bit, childish How so, Mr. Meyette? P.S. Mr. Meyette You mentioned that you listen to heavy metal, tell me, what musical form serves as the foundation of rock n’ roll? Multax [ 08-06-2001: Message edited by: Multax ]

Old Testament linear measures c. Span (outstretched hand from thumb to little finger): three handbreaths or half a cubit 9in/230mm (actually 228.6mm) d. Cubit (elbow to finger-tip) 17.5/445mm (actually 444.5mm) The long cubit was a handbreath longer 20.4/520mm (actually 518.16mm) 6 cubits = 1 reed New Testament linear measures Cubit 21.6/550mm (actually 548.64mm) David Alexander and Pat Alexander, ed., Eerdman’s Handbook to the Bible (New York: Guideposts, 1973), 193. Multax