Inserted Wood Cutting End Mills

[Trevor Bailey]

Is there anybody out there that has any experience with inserted mills for wood. I saw a couple of venders at the IWF show in Atlanta. They look pretty good. I am looking mainly at cost. I would think that changing inserts would be better than spending $100 a pop for a new mill. I have much experience with insert cutters in various metals, not wood.

 

What venders, price, life of inserts with speeds/feeds in mind, etc...

[PBpaul]

We have a couple of two-flute cutters from Amana Tool that take carbide inserts. We use them to cut out wood and MDF. The inserts are reversible so you get to use them twice, making the cost a little more bearable. They do not cut as smoothly as spiral cutters and they do not like to plunge! Anyway, their stuff is good quality and we have no complaints. Their website is www.amanatool.com

Paul

[Trevor Bailey]

I found their website yesterday. However, that is not exactly what I am looking for. The one I want has mulitple inserts running down the length of the flutes. The average feedrate I run is 250 ipm and when our router finally arrives, I hope to double that for surfacing and triple that for 2d paths.

 

Thank you for your reply.

[Guest]

Trevor:

 

What Router did you finally decide on?

[chris m]

Let me preface this by saying that I know nothing about cutting wood [except with a chainsaw] but wouldn't a standard inserted endmill [like a Sandvik Long Edge cutter] with an uncoated insert with a good positive edge work for you?

 

If not, please let me know why so I can avoid making dumb statements in the future.

 

Thanks

 

C

[Trevor Bailey]

Chris,

 

I experimented with this to confirm my own suspicions. You need a "knife" edge to shear the wood, where as the metal working insert more or less pushes the material. Even the aluminum cutting inserts have a radius on the cutting edge. I have used a valenite 1" insert cutter I have to make test cuts. It does nothing but blow out the wood. Way too much tool pressure on the material. That is a big no-no, because 90% of my fixturing is held down by vacuum and locating on 1/16th pins. It would rip my necks right out of the machine. I am now using 3 flute coarse corn-cobb's and finishing with 2 flute's. No blow outs, but with the hard wood's we use, the end mills break down really fast. I have a concentrated cold air blast on the end mills while they are cutting, butthey still break down very fast. I heard rave reviews about the inserted mills from the IWF show I mentioned earlier in my post, but I have not recieved any information as of yet

 

Mark,

 

I am about 90% sure we are going to go with the KOMO twin table machine. One head with a tool changer and c-axis that will be dedicated to one table and two spindles with manual changers that will be dedicated to the other table.

 

As always, I am open to any suggestions that anyone has concerning my tooling and cut methods.

[chris m]

Thanks for the lesson; I always am interested in broadening my horizons!

 

Sorry I couldn't help out

 

C

[ERIC14779]

Trevor,

 

I think you will have the best luck with solid carbide ROUTER BITS and/or carbide tipped ROUTER BITS.... One good supplier is Onsrud cutter they can help you select a ROUTER bit for any application.

[McRae]

Poly Chrystalline Diamond - PCD

How many of you wood guys use this stuff??

 

[ 09-27-2002, 03:48 PM: Message edited by: Andrew McRae ]

[Trevor Bailey]

I talked with Onsrud yesterday and had many conversations with the Onsrud Router tech guys. From a general perspective, the carbide end mills will not last any longer than say high-speed steel or cobalt. They just cost more. As far as brazed bits, they will not apply to my cut methods. All the work I do is 3d. Well, 98% is 3d. I need the strength of a solid shank end mill so that I may drive it as hard as I want and still achieve a good, quality surface finish.

 

Do you have anything specific in mind that you have used from Onsrud that would apply to my application? If so, please let me know the part number is so that I can check it out.

 

Thanks for the reply,

[Trevor Bailey]

I have heard the PCD tooling works great for MDF. Other than that, I have never personnally used anything of the sort. What do you know about it?

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

PCD is to wood as PCD is to Aluminum. MAX spindle RPM, and feed it. The only concern I would have would be the edge treatment (lap etc...) on the insert but you could expect a substantial tool life increase. The tools are pricey but worth it IMHO.

 

JM2C

[Racer]

At my work we use Letz tools they have Inserts and can plunge cut they come in many sizes , we also use ther diamond tooling for mdf and partacal board. we run tools at the max rpm wich is 18,000 rpm, and feeds any ware from 1 meter a minit to 7meters. as most our cuts are 19mm or less in od. we do on specail jobs use cutters up to 3" in diam.this is on a scmi tech 100 machine with ther crudy control! So hope this helps jimmy

[Trevor Bailey]

thank you racer. all info is much appreciated.

[sir Camalot]

Hey Trevor,

Try Guhdo's insert tooling.(www.guhdo.com)Their Novitec bit is great. Extremely high feedrates and excellent hogging properties.Initial cost is high, but you get 3 sharpenings out of each set, & a longer tool life. Another cutter is from an Italian co. called "Fapil." They have a line of six flute hoggers that run at 18,000 rpm and can eat a ton of wood in short order. The only U.S. distributor I know is CMS North America out of Grand Rapids.

[Trevor Bailey]

sir camalot,

 

the guhdo line of inserted router bits was exactly what i was looking for. thank you for your reply. when i get the tools i need in, i will post my speeds and feeds along with the application process that i will be using them for for general info.

 

your company also does beautiful work. very nice website. what machines are you using?

 

[ 09-28-2002, 10:20 PM: Message edited by: Trevor Bailey ]

[sir Camalot]

Hi Trevor,

Thank you! We are using a CMS KM-48. Beautiful machine! 5 axis with a table mounted horizontal rotary and aggregates. Comes with a 16 tool changer too. I was at the show in Atlanta. Man, if I had to choose another machine ...there are just too many good ones anymore! That insert bit is really sweet! We use it a lot for cutting 1" thick red oak/white oak at about 275 ipm @ 18,000 rpm.(That's a full cut too!) This allows it to stay cooler and cut longer. We are able to cut 4 times as many parts for a couple dollars more. Watch the plunge cuts though, you need a small ramp in some cases.