Okuma MC-V4020 tapping

[jeff]

I have the E100M control and when I tap there is a delay when going from hole to hole.

About 1-2 seconds.

Can I reduce this and if so how?

 

Here is my program:

N1100(1/2-13 TAP 2 PLCS)

T07

/M08

G00G40G80G90

G56H06X-1.562Y0.Z2.S520M03

G71Z3.

G284X-1.562Y0.Z-1.4R.3F40.M53

X1.562Y0.

G80M54

M09

G30P1

M01

M06

[chris m]

I think [don't know, but THINK] that if you drop the M3 it'll go quicker. I've always meant to test this on my machines but never have.

 

C

[jeff]

I just tried that and there was no difference.

The delay is after it moves to the next hole and it sits there for a second before it cycles the tap.

Seems like it's an orientation thing.

[Rick Henrickson 65]

try changing your G71 to .3 to match your R plane return in your cycle

or remove your G71 and M53 all together and just use your R value

 

G17 G40 G80 G90 G94

G15 H1

G00 X0 Y0 G56 H1 S1200

Z0.1 M08

G95 F0.05

G284 Z-1.0 R0.1

G80 G94 M09

G00 Z50

Y50

M02

[chris m]

I'm assuming that you're using the G71 to jump a clamp or come up out of a pocket, but if you don't need it definitely dump it, as Rick said.

 

Does the spindle rotate during this pause?

 

You might try adding an E0. on the G284 line without the M3 to force spindle oriention to zero. This will probably make it worse [or have no effect] but anything is worth a try.

 

C

[jeff]

quote:

---

Does the spindle rotate during this pause?

---

No, it just sits there.

I'll dump the retract and see what happens.

Right after I enjoy my Cottage Inn pizza!! MMM Yummy!

[Rick Henrickson 65]

If it is a clamp issue you can type your G71 line in and bounce between M53 and M54

If it still doesnt work when you try the latest let me know I will see if I can find a parameter on that

[jeff]

Removing the G71 and M53 didn't make a difference.

What is the "In-Position Check Value"?

Mine is set to 100

 

In-Position check range is set to 15000

[Rick Henrickson 65]

Hey Jeff I will look at my manuals when I get home and see if I can find that.

[Sambo]

From "SPECIAL FUNCTIONS MANUAL No.1" for OSP-P200M

 

quote:

---

Dwell Period at the Point R Level in Return Cycle (Q)

The command specifies the length of time the tool dwells at the point R level. The length of time may be specified in the same manner as a P command explained in item (7) above.

Designation of the dwell period may be omitted. If you omit this command, the dwell period is

determined according to the general rule for a fixed cycle.

---

So you could try a Q0.

We just got a MC-V4020. I have a few question also, but I'm hesitant to hi-jack the thread. Oh well, first can someone explain G30 a little and how I can define more positions for it. Secondly ... the tool change sends the table to the right ... I want it to leave the table alone. How?

[jeff]

Sambo, thanks for the info...

G30 is the reference point return.

For example when I do an M06 my program looks like this

M09

G30P1

M01

M06

The G30P1 sends the tool to the tool change position.So does the M06,but I like the M01 option before that actual toolchange in case I need to run that tool again.

As for your table going right, it's defined by your Home Position parameter (G30P1 thru P32)

Hit the Parameter button and Item up or down and you will see that screen.

 

EDIT: DO NOT change the Y or Z value, or your tool arm will crash!

If your arm is hitting hard, you can move this Z up or down SLIGHTLY to adjust it though.

[jeff]

The Q didn't work, that dwells at the end of each hole before moving to the next,

Mine "dwells" at the start of the hole before tapping.

[Rick Henrickson 65]

Jeff I completely forgot to look this up last night

I am sure there is a parameter of some sort that controls this have you called your local okuma applications engineer?

[jeff]

No I haven't.

I was hoping to avoid that.

But I will if it comes to that.

Thanks!

[Rick Henrickson 65]

I am thinking it is something to do with the in position time check over or something along that line

[jeff]

Me too, but I don't know anything about that stuff.

[Sambo]

Ok ... that was just a guess .... try this one.

First off, it sounds almost terrifying.

From "SPECIAL FUNCTIONS MANUAL No.1" for OSP-P200M

quote:

---

SECTION 9 CYCLE TIME REDUCTION FUNCTION

Ignoring Spindle Rotation Answer M300 (1 Block)

If M300 is executed, program advances to the next block without waiting for the answer signal for the specified spindle operation command such as spindle start, stop, and orientation.

---

Supplement: An alarm occurs if M300 is specified in the fixed cycle mode.

Can't find if it's modal or one shot.

I don't have much faith in this one but it might be worth a shot.

[Alter Ego]

quote:

---

An alarm occurs if M300 is specified in the fixed cycle mode.

---

Tapping is a fixed cycle

 

"Don't wait for spindle answer" is typically a lathe thing, I believe, and all "Cycle Time Reduction" functions disable features that keep the machine from being thumped. If the difference between and 32 second part and a 27 second part will put you out of business then exploring these options may be necessary, but otherwise they are an unnecessary danger IMO.

 

C

[Sambo]

I'm in the mood to be a jerk. So here we go.

 

Tapping is a fixed cycle? OMG!! Really?? Are you sure?? Next you'll tell me the world is round!!

 

Ok, done. The operative word there is "in"... An alarm occurs if M300 is specified IN the fixed cycle mode. So put it before, or after the tapping block.

Finally, I wouldn't say out of business, but how many holes do you tap in a year? Even if it's one second a hole, I could probably take a week off with that time.

[mig]

Hi Jeff,

I would use next format:

T1 M06 ( D0.3125 " | R0.0000 )

(MAX - Z.5)

(MIN - Z-1.25)

N1 G00 G90 X-1.4581 Y1.829 S108 M3

G94 G56 H1 Z2.5

G71 Z.5

G95 M327

G284 Z-1.25 R.1 F.0556 E0 M53

X.767 Y.7586

G0

G94

I am not using G80 , i am not 100% sure but it could create your problem, use G0

 

 

Look, if it work for you

good luck

[mig]

Also delay could be generated because spindle changing direction and machine not start move until speed of rotation equal programmed .

Regards

[jeff]

mig, I'll give that a try tomorrow thanks.

 

quote:

---

Also delay could be generated because spindle changing direction and machine not start move until speed of rotation equal programmed .

Regards

---

If this was the case, then there should be a delay when it reverses and backs out of the hole.

It's almost instantaneous.

If my table moves 40" between tapped holes, even at 10% rapid (allowing time enough for the spindle to change directions) there is still a delay when it reaches the position before tapping.

I need to call Okuma I guess.

Does anyone else have this problem that has the same machine and or control?

Normally this isn't a big deal, but when tapping alot of holes, my cycle time is increased by at least a minute and with a big production run, that's too much.

[chris m]

I have a couple of 3016s with the U10M which do 'hesitate' during tapping but I have more problems with the guys being in the sh!thouse when the part's done than with an extra 20 seconds on my cycles so I haven't really delved into it. I'll be more than happy to ride your coat-tails, though, when you figure it out!

 

Did you ever try the E0. ? I'm 99% sure it won't help but you've tried a ton of stuff so far; what's one more?

 

C

[jeff]

Chris,

Just tried the E0. and all that seems to do is orient the spindle before it starts to tap.

I watched the spindle closely and it orients, then it moves a tiny bit ccw then back to orient position before it taps.

It looks like it's trying to determine where it is.

Maybe that's because it's syncro tapping?

[chris m]

Yeah; E0. just forces the orientation to zero degrees which may or may not be where the machine ordinarily does it. I didn't think that was the answer, but WTF.

 

Please keep us informed on how you make out

 

C