Horizontals vs. verticles?

[camathome]

Any Job you can do on a VMC you can do on a HMC but the reverse is not so, and Yes gravity is a friend chips fall away much better.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

Yeah, I don't know how I'm able to get anything done with Mastercam either, crummy graphics, no graphical tolpath editor...

[Tim Johnson]

It looks like the horizontals win. Thanks for your input.

[mcpgmr]

I prefer horizontals as well. Verticals have there place for larger work that requires more table surface. Unless you have a horizontal with a table that runs the full length of the "X" axis with a flush mount rotary axis and not just a pallet on a rotary axis. Then you can mount a Knee and do everything you can do on a vertical. I ran a few machines like this. I ran a Cincinnati and K&T, and programmed some large Toshiba horizontals with full 4th axis capability that had enough table space for a Knee or large fixture. IMHO they are far more versatile than the large verticals with auxiliary rotary axis. Our Hitachi HG500's are nice but they make it difficult to do any thing larger than the tombstones or pallet.

[Scott Garrison@Weiler Engineering]

The only thing not mentioned here is space limitation on a vertical. If the 4th axis is like a tombstone then you have to worry about the clearance between the part and the machine table. Unless you are only working on 3 sides of the tombstone and do not need to rotate 360 degrees.

[mcpgmr]

quote:

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If the 4th axis is like a tombstone then you have to worry about the clearance between the part and the machine table.

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Justin (cncjb) is programming Makino VMC's with a picture frame fixture that can go 360° and allow 5 sided machining. I used to program them at Boeing and when I worked for his sister company that purchased the machines from Boeing. Not sure but I think they clear the table by less than a 1/4". Got to blow the chips out often when working with steel or they will get jammed up. Aluminum's not too bad. Justin can elaborate.

[Justin Beebe at Folsom Tool]

Paul,

 

Your right we are still using the frames on the vertical mills. Probably some of the same machines you used to program. The clearance is about a 1/4 on our bigger frames and even less on our new mini frame. They kinda push the chips out of the way when they rotate but you still have to blow chips every so often. The only issue I had with clearance was when a clamp broke off, fell into the t-slot and got wedged between the frame and the table when it rotated. It was a pain to get the frame straight again. I still like our horizontals because they are enclosed and the chips fall away from the parts. It is nice to get complete parts in one operation on our verticals.

[Müřlıń®]

That is not an easy question to answer...

 

It depends on what type of work you do and how the horizontal in question is built.

 

one word........rigidity......

 

How rigid does your machine have to be...

 

A Makino with a pallet changer is only as rigid as the 4 taper posts on the pallet changer...

 

Try putting a 10,000 pound die on a 18X18 table and stick it 40 inches in the air on an angle plate.

 

Then take a 6" face mill and actually utilize the 75 HP in the spindle with it's ceramic bearings....sorry it's not happening ...But I have seen it tried to be sure...not by me but those who have more dollars than sense....

Then chase that extra axis all over and try to keep the workpiece still and square to the world...

 

But all horizontals are not built the same...

 

so it depends...the right tool for the right job I always say..

 

Or was that Scotty who said dat