VF8 with Probing option

[TwinCam88]

I searched and seems most threads are from 08

any insight on using it as basic inspection on parts after machining. What does it take to do it? Can I check 3d surface machined parts?

This will be an important option as we are running large aircraft repair tooling

 

The machine is equiped with glass scales

[Jayson Kramer]

you can program it doing macros for the prob to check parts on the machine.

[TwinCam88]

Jay, Whats it take to get there? custom post? and any hardware? can I get the data out of the machine?

[Guest]

Twincam88 :cough:

 

Check out Verisurf.

 

We had then along for demos them at our X4 Rollouts.

 

Very nice stuff

[Ron Branch @ 5th Axis]

Yes please check us out. I will ask this question once you check your part using whatever how will you be able to quickly be able to tell if the part is right or wrong? With Verisurf we can write the probing routine for your machine with a V9 product. Not in our X product yet. So you have all the points sent back from the machine now you need to know something about them. Using our software you can then bring the points back into the software. Then you can have an idea where you are on any 3d surface. Here is a screen shot from something we did this on at my other job.

 

The 1st screen shot shows the information brought in from our CMM, but this could be a machine tool probing program no problem:

 

 

Here I changed the acceptable tolerance of .01 to .005 so you can see how our software can show you the problem areas with the probe radius represented by the spheres:

 

 

Then here is the same analysis done with a different setting to show text with shading on:

 

 

Here is the same screen shot with shading off. You can see again the colors show the problem with the text.

 

 

Here is a video showing our V9 probing product for CMM's or for machine tools.

 

Linky:

 

Any questions please email [email protected] and one of our regional sales mangers will be glad to get back to you. John thanks for the plug.

[MultiAxGod]

To answer your specific question,"What does it take to get there?" Custom Definitions and Posts on the software side. A control, capable of doing what you need it to (hardware, can I get the data out, etc.).

 

You have to make points to inspect and you have to have the macro calls in your post for the particular type of feature your trying to inspect for the proper probe (Renishaw, Blum, etc.). Usually in Mcam it is done through custom drill cycles that tie into the definitions and post through variable and integers to make the calls correct. Once you have some of that figured out, it's not too hard to get it to adjust the machine on it's own. Just be careful with your math. That's where most common failures occur.

 

For getting the data out of your machine, that depends on the control and how it's hooked up (usually not properly to get your print commands to work correctly). If you have a dataserver that is hooked up correctly and a decent control, spend some time going through the documentation. Learn how the macro calls, variables, calculations and actions take place. YOU will generally be the one to figure it out. Study it or try to find someone in your area who has done many different types. Or listen to a slew of ways that others have done it and try to pick things out that will work on your particular combination of equipment. No one way works on all applications. Study the macro variables and where it parks and calculates the numbers from. I have seen ding dongs write over necessary variables in the control for the probs own math and really screw things up (crash, boom, bam, oops, there goes your probe!).

 

ALSO, remember, in aerospace, unless your machine is certified, you really can't count on the numbers for parts that are spec'd fracture, maintenance, durability or safety critical. There are things you can do, but it's a very, very fine line when it comes to true inspection to try to use the same device that made it to check it. You can attach standards to the machine for the probe to check first to verify itself and the machines accuracy, however, we all know that changes throughout the day and night. Plus, never forget, your part is under stress from clamping when your checking it (usually, but depends on what and where you're checking).

 

Ok Ron, here's another free plug for you guys! LOL! Yes Verisurf is great, but it is only one piece of the pie! And before anybody chimes in crying, this isn't a slam to IT guys, software guys, machine tools guys or probe guys. I am just trying to make you aware that there are many steps to make it work correctly and flawlessly.! Great for SPC also. Take your time, your the one that needs it working! Not to slam Haas, because they are good machines for what they are, but there IT department has a very hard time making this type of stuff work correctly depending on the version of the control. Don't get too frustrated! Hope you don't have that new junk probe system they are using now instead of Renishaw.

 

Have fun. Getting this kind of stuff running properly is what makes this trade interesting!

[MLS]

quote:

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ALSO, remember, in aerospace, unless your machine is certified, you really can't count on the numbers

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Speaking about aerospace specifically, this is probably the biggest snag that I am aware of.

 

Depending on the customer requirements, you may have to define a procedure for probe calibration and machine certification on an inspection level.

 

As far as restraint is concerned, hypothetically the part is supposed to be checked in a free state or with the allowable weight restraint. As an option to this many are checked in a restrained condition with a more manual approach taken in the FAI to ensure the datums are not distorted after the part is off restraint.

 

Another variable to keep in mind is temperature control. You will have to be able to verify that the part is at 68 degrees for most aerospace work that I am aware of. Not to say it doesn't happen otherwise... but in the cases of audits you might find yourself in a bad dream if you don't have a plan going into it on the front end.

[TwinCam88]

thanks guys, I beleive this is more for in shop verification of what was just cut. It does have the renishaw probe, and may only get used for hole positions at the least. I'll look deeper into thigs monday and see what the machine came with. I'm only on board right now as a Mcam trainer for there crew of grammers but also attempting to sell myself to them at the same time

[Tim Simmermon]

I have the VF3SS with the probe and I contacted Renishaw about it's capabilities. It has the abilityto do a lot of inspection routines (hole locations, hole sizes, etc). Mostly simpler stuff. It does have the capability to check a hole size and if it sees that it is small it can open the wear offset and recut the hole (if you are using an endmill). At Renishaw here in Hoffman Estates they offer training in their facility with Haas Machines(pretty cheap too). If you are looking for anything beyond that I'd look into Verisurf.

[MultiAxGod]

All the macro's for the Renishaw are free. The probe routines are already in the Haas when you buy it that way, or are supposed to be, but it's very simple to put them in. It's the calls in your program that are necessary.

MLS, your exactly right when it comes to inspection. Most parts lists, models or drawings give a specific weight control, or refer to a spec, that is allowed to hold the part for measurement.

YOU MEAN MOST SHOPS DON'T CHECK IT THAT WAY OR AT 68!!!!! ROFL!!!! I almost fell over when I read that. Most shops out here don't do much of anything the correct way anymore and it seems a miracle to me that the U.S. Military stuff even works. There is so little experience left in this area as to be appaling. Oh yeah, there is some guys who learned how to make a machine move, but have zero experience as to what it really needs to do to make a part correctly and/or why!

[TwinCam88]

quote:

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It does have the capability to check a hole size and if it sees that it is small it can open the wear offset and recut the hole

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THAT, wont be needed. Im dealing with HIGHLY skilled toolmakers with 25 to 40 years in the trade. including myself. Most guys in the shop run everything from Bridgeports/Lathes/Wire EDM/Sinker EDM/ CNC VMC's,Devlieg's and Brooms

full of talent,

they just need my Mcam skills

[TwinCam88]

MultiAxGod ,

say Hi to my wife's Uncle when you see him,

He has a house on the hill east of town

thanks

[MultiAxGod]

Oh yeah! I know just which one it is! LOL!

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

Better than 90% of the time I see stuff inspected incorrectly. I think things work because they are so overtoleranced to start with it't not even funny.