WCS and create point relitive

[mayday]

WCS to top T/C plane to any other created plane. create point relitive throws the point out in space. this happens also when adding a chain point to a pocket path. I can create the point by create point position and it goes where it should. WTF

[mayday]

bump +1 for friday

 

things that make ya go hhhhhhmmmmmmm

 

 

HELLO ????

hello?

[Zero]

Sounds like what used to happen in earlier versions of 9 when using different wcs' and doing some creating/trimming operations...lemme see if I can duplicate it.

[crazy^millman]

Ok I have thought about this since Rekd posted this very thread about 4-6 weeks ago. I understand this is problay going to be taken the wrong way but please bare with me I think I can expalin this in a way to make sense. I use alot of the Multi Plane functions of Mastercam and use my Education in Calculus and different vectors as a bases for this explantion and hope I can be clear enough. We all know about the 8 views that come standard in Mastercam. In the views we all understand the right hand rule where as the x axis needs to be pointing to the right to be postive in the view plane we are looking at to make a program that will post out the right code. Well this seems like a simple and stragiht foward concept but I contest it is not as black and white as it seems. When we start using the WCS and T-Plane abd C-plane Together we then create vectos to coordinates systems that in them self become little unvierses in a sense. I am thinking that unless we use one WCS as a focal point of our programs we then throw all relations of the control for our x,y,z coordintes into a tail spin. I know some of you are shaking you head head like WTF but just bare with me.

 

If I create a point at x=1, y=1, z=1 form

WCS top then well feel very comfortable where that it. I then try to create this point relative to that in WCS Bottom that is x=1, y=1, z=1 well realtive to where that is from the last WCS that should be x=0, y=0 z=0 all realtive to the orignal WCS as a bases for our control. I then throw a T-Plane or C-Plane in there to create a point from then soemthing I know we most dont think about will come into play and that is the Z control for the height of our entites from what WCS is this realtive to and that is where I think we see the most odd things in Mastercam to us but if we use Math to figure the point all relative to what that control is in then they all fall into the place as we told them. I know you are all going WTF again and yeah I know seems weird but when you want to create a point or any entite on a part you need to remember to set the Z at the place you want the item drawn from to keep it all realtive to the orignal WCS which is TOP even though you may be working in WCS 117 or C-Plane 120. Even though you have used these as a control we still we drawing or creating have to keep the orignal WCS in our minds for the control of Z in making the things. I create and make points, line and controls all over a part and as long as I keep remembering to set my Z control relative to the point in space I want as the reference to work from then all is good but if I have it set for the last C-plane or WCS and then try to create something different then that point or arc or whatever shows up in my eyes really far off but in the WCS it is realtive to the orignal it is where you told it be because of that mini control that you are now working from.

 

Going back to the x=1, y=1, z=1 with the WCS top is a point from the origin at 1 from the right of the origin, 1 from the top of the origin, and 1 towards us if looking at it from the top view. I we are now in a WCS or C-plane that is 45 degree relative to the orignal WCS we then have to think about we are calling cooridnates and it reative to that point but unless we set or z to that height realtive to the orignal WCS and create it then the point will not be where we want it. It really seem confusing but as long as I think about it as 1 WCS as the base and keep all my other creations realtive to that in My Z control on the Screen and not in my logic of Creation of normal cartesian points then it works. I guess the second I look at it as what I know should be right and what it really is then get things that don't make sense when they are in essence what I told Mastercam to do. I have read the Help and the T-plane and C-plane stuff a dozen times but to be honest reads like stereo instructions. I would love to see a 3d cartesian Box with some sample commands for input and then what they look like in Mastercam how they are put in. I think if we all had a true picture to look at verse a bunch of double talk then it would be more clear.

 

Well guys I am sorry to drag that on and I am sure I have said about half if not all of it in way that does not really express my point correctly and if so sorry but just trying to give what I see as what is going on as explaintion is all. If anything Maybe somene who doe fully understand it will share soemthing about it.

 

Crazy Millman teh them 4-1/2 run times got to find soemthing to do to not go completely crazy.

 

[ 12-20-2003, 02:19 PM: Message edited by: Millman^Crazy ]

[Rick Damiani]

I encountered some issues early on when trying to use the WCS the same way I used the UCS in AutoCAD. I find that my results are more consistent if I use cplanes for drawing the way I always have and reserve the WCS for the toolpaths that require them. Working coordinate systems are real useful for toolpaths, but less so for geometry creation.

 

With that said, you can still use the view manager to retain cplanes you will be using again. Go through whatever process you are using to create a WCS, just don't actually change the current WCS.

[mayday]

I understand all you guys have said. I ran into this by accident. I generally go about the buisness of adding any extra geometry I think I'll need to toopath all around the model before I do any actual toolpathing. I changed my mind tho about doing an open pocket in any area rather than contour. So I wanted to add a chain start point for the pocket. It happened to be in the front C/plane and I thaougt nothing of it till my point kept disapearing on me until I did a fit to screen and there they were or were not

[Rick Damiani]

What I'll do in that situation depends on what geometry I'm trying to add. If it's on the same plane I am working with, I'll set my Z (I'm kinda compulsive about setting my Z) and have at it. If it's on a different plane, I'll set the WCS back to Top, do my stuff, and set it back again.

[mayday]

I guess what Im asking, with the WCS active and T/C plane set to a named view. should'nt I be able to constructe a point during a toolpath relitive to that view. I mean the toolpathing works. and if I get out of the opp manager and contructe the point using create point it works. hopefully in V10 the WSC will be a little cleaner to use. It is a great start though with V9.