help on posts for haas sl 20 lathe

[Master Whidbey]

Good Morning all

 

Here is our problem we are using Mastercam lathe v9.1 with our Haas sl 20 with full c-axis, live tooling. Our current post works perfect for everything except c-axis work and live tooling. We are currently working with our Mastercam reseller to write a post for us. Our problem is were not sure how this process usually works. What kind of information do we need to provide the reseller and in what format? Do we provide them with examples of programs that work?

 

Thanks for the help in advance

Art

[Master Whidbey]

We know no one is going to give us a post that is why we are working with our mastercam reseller. Our problem is that we can't get on the same page as they are. They are asking for examples and we can't figure out what examples they are asking for. Sorry for the dumb questions but this is the first time we have had to modify a post and we are absoulutly clueless on how to do it...

[TeccBoxx]

I know where you are coming from Master my schoold just got the SL 20 as well and to be honest it took us a while just to get it to read the G-Code with out thousands of errors. We have been messing around trying to get a working post as well, but for some reason we cannot find anyone that knows how to work with Haas lathes. Good luck I konw that you are going to need it.

[Trevor Bailey]

I have taken a standard mplfan.pst and made a few minor changes and have driven HAAS lathes with it. No problems. What are your particular needs? HAAS' are very easy.

[Master Whidbey]

quote:

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What are your particular needs? HAAS' are very easy

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Ok here we go

 

we need the post to generate the proper g codes for live tooling c axis performing operations such as drilling and tapping holes both radial and axial as well as hexing, slotting, cutting flats. The post we are using is haasmill-turn.pst it seems to work great perfoming all other processes not related to c-axis or live tooling. Thanks again for the help we are dead in the water without this post...

[Master Whidbey]

quote:

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my schoold just got the SL 20

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What school? Bellingham Tech?

[TeccBoxx]

Nope Pueblo Community College here in Pueblo Colorado. Again good luck and I will be following this thread very closely

 

By the way when will someone wake up and write a book on creating/editing post processors. I know there was one made about three years ago but I cannot find anyone that has it.

 

[ 07-01-2003, 02:04 PM: Message edited by: Tazzer ]

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

When having the reseller do your posts here's the skinny.

 

[*]Don't assume that your reseller knows what the code is supposed to look like.

[*]Give them a sample MC file with at least a few tool changes, coolant on and off, and all the functions/operations you'll be doing. Yes I know this is a lot of work but it's your responsibility to get good accurate info to your post builder.

[*]Post out using MPLFAN or something similar with NO EDITS TO THE POST OR G-CODE!

[*]Post out the same file and make the appropriate edits to the G-Code. This is so the post builder can compare a before and after file.

[*]Machine Operation/Programming Manuals if at all possible

The reason you don't want to assume they know about your particular machine is because they deal with thousands of different machines, and just because your machine is a "popular" machine and they are "everywhere" still don't assume.

 

HTH

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

quote:

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By the way when will someone wake up and write a book on creating/editing post processors. I know there was one made about three years ago but I cannot find anyone that has it.

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There are materials available re: Post Processors available from your reseller. There's just not a "Post Processors for Idiots" type book. I personally think this is a good idea because of the catastrophic results possible from somebody that does not know what they are doing. I don't say this to "hoard" my knowledge because as anyone who's been here for any length of time knows that I am very liberal in sharing my knowledge about just about anything. But post processors are in a different category.

 

JM2C

[chris m]

Tazzer

 

The best way to learn about post editing, in my opinion, is to try to make some simple changes yourself to grasp the fundamental functions of the post. I am relatively new to this arena but with a lot of help from this forum, the Mastercam post CD, and the guys at S4A (especially Steve Biehl) I have been able to make some great strides in getting my posts to output code the way we like it.

 

I am certainly not in the same league (not even the same sport) as James, or Steve Biehl, or Dave, or Rekd, or some of the other guys you see out here; but I'm making out OK.

 

Just be sure to make one change at a time and look very carefully at the output to make sure that you did what you wanted.

 

C

 

[ 07-01-2003, 02:42 PM: Message edited by: chris m ]

[Reece L Gibson]

When I set up posts for people, I ask for good "G" code file and a .MC9 file thats pretty close to what the "G" code does and start changing from there.If they can not provide the "G" code program, I go out to the Company or where the Machine is and get it running from there. Most programmer's like their code in a certain order, tool changes,Coolant on, etc.

Most Posts for Millturn MachinesI have worked with Polar interpolation is handled thru the post,using Misc reals and Inter.

Keep trying, you get there.

[Trevor Bailey]

How is your "help" going? I am very curious as to why the basic fanuc post supplied on the install cd did not/will not work for you. Maybe there needed to be a few mod's, but I am very curious as to your solution.

[Master Whidbey]

Still working on it with my reseller. Thanks so far, for all the help. Will let you all know once it becomes edit free.

[McRae]

quote:

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When I set up posts for people, I ask for good "G" code file and a .MC9 file thats pretty close to what the "G" code does and start changing from there.If they can not provide the "G" code program, I go out to the Company or where the Machine is and get it running from there. Most programmer's like their code in a certain order, tool changes,Coolant on, etc.

Most Posts for Millturn MachinesI have worked with Polar interpolation is handled thru the post,using Misc reals and Inter.

Keep trying, you get there.

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This is the best Idea yet - give them a sample MasterCAM file of something that you are required to do, make sure that it has all the features that you require. The machine specific functions, make copies of the list, and then supply this.

 

Is your dealer "Making a Post" or "Customizing a Post" Make this distinction and run the some code proving its validity before paying the bill.

 

Advice on things to watch for include - tool planes, Position convention for C-Zero, Cutter Compensations for Milling Paths, Circular Interpolations if the X values are doubled (It will also efffect the I's), If there are any other axis requirements (Y, B, Subspindles) then then make sure you verify all of these features.

 

It is my personal belief that a post processor should support ALL of the functions available in the software, AND to post them to GCode correctly. This however isn't practicle when it is your own money that you are spending and so there has to be a few decisions made.

 

In general the dealer network is decent and there are resources they can draw on - but at the end of the day, you have to cut the chips so rely on your own judgement and it is the Enduser's Responsibility to specify the scope and ensure that the supplier meets those objectives. Don't rely on your dealer to "Teach" you how to use the machine, that is the Machine Builder's Job, and it is then your responsibility to instruct your dealer in how to process the parts.

 

Also remember that the more complex the post is, the more it will cost to update with each successive version of Mastercam.

 

These suggestions come from my experience and I offer them only as a guide in the things that I have learned in commissioning Software, and Equipment. Please don't interpret a condesending tone, it is not my intention to indoctrinate, only to share.

[Go Navy]

Good Morning All

 

Please don't take this as Mastercam bashing or Reseller bashing but, How many man hours should we expect to expend working with a reseller writing a post. We have 80+ man hours in this post with no end in sight. Our reseller continues to promise and promise but has yet to show us anything that even comes close to working. When if ever should they come out to our facility and finish the job they started?

 

Thanks for all the input

Have a great day

Al

[Steve Kidd Cimtech]

As we are woking on this - an update for all concerned. As CNC SOftware DOES not have a post for the Haas SL20 caxis a custom post has to be generated. These are the items required to write any post

1. mastercam test file using toolpaths desired

2. someone available to comment on how code should look like

 

Neither of these items have been submitted to date from the customer, I have no idea where the 80 hours came from that is not true.

 

We have engaged the post writing services of Dave Thompson from Emastercam ( who is the best) who also had access to a haas dealer willing to comment to the output code. The local haas dealer is not willing to assist.

 

In a perfect world CNC Software would have every machine post written and supplied on the production fully tested.

 

This post is available from the La dealer Cad-cam Consulting at $850, not an option for a group but worth mentioning for the individual.

 

Post writing requires accurate data to work from and the co-oporation from the person that needs it. There are no short cuts.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

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How many man hours should we expect to expend working with a reseller writing a post.

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This depends on many factors. If you are having it customized to output a bunch of stuff like safe toolchanges when certain conditions exist. So without knowing EXACTLY to the last crossed "t" and dotted "i" I can't say for certain how long it should take. Also if yo uhave not provided everything that the post writer needs (Manuals, sample code generated from a file and the edited code, etc...) then that drags out the process substantially. Also if you are getting it for free, I would not expect it over night either because chances are the post writer ahas at least a dozen projects on the burner at any given time.

 

HTH

 

JM2C

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

Whew! If Steve Kidd is working on it, I'd suspect the the problem lies with the customer. I've seen Steve's work in the past and it is top notch IMHO.

 

Machine tool dealers can be a real pain in the tookus especially if they are pimping another CAM System.

 

JM2C

[Go Navy]

quote:

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Please don't take this as Mastercam bashing or Reseller bashing but

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As I said before we are not unhappy with Mastercam or the reseller! Steve Kidd is working with us and is doing a great job. A lot of the problem does lie with us because as you can see by the questions that we have been asking we have never been through this process before and have no idea what information they need. It has been very difficult because we are trying to get this post written while supporting our fleet. We do have a lot of hours in getting this post correct. Hence the question of how many hours this process usually takes.

 

Again not a complaint just a question.

 

Thanks again for all the help and your comments

Have a great day

AL

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

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Hence the question of how many hours this process usually takes.

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Depends ENTIRELY on the changes that need to be made. Some changes take a few seconds, some take weeks. It just depends on what you are trying to accomplish and how you are trying to accomplish it.

 

James teh "Need more input..."

[TeccBoxx]

I just wanted to give a little bump for this thread as it is very important to myself as well. As stated before we have a SL20 as well and my reseller doesn't have a good access to any Haas machines for writing of the post. So if I can be of any help as well please let me know.

[Rick Damiani]

quote:

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I just wanted to give a little bump for this thread as it is very important to myself as well. As stated before we have a SL20 as well and my reseller doesn't have a good access to any Haas machines for writing of the post. So if I can be of any help as well please let me know.

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Tazzer: If it's not a C-Axis jobbie, I have a post for an SL-20 that I'd be happy to send to your reseller. Or you could fiddle with the MPLFAN.PST post a bit until it works the way you want it to. The code output from it works fine on the SL-20 I have at school.

[TeccBoxx]

Hi Rick thanks for the offer. Unfortunatly it is a Live tooling lathe so the C-axis programming is needed. The big problem now is that the shop is going through some remodelling, so I can't even test out a post on any machines. However it is a great time to catch up on orgainization and everything. Thanks again Rick I really appreciate it. Again if anyone needs anything from my side please ask, I am as anxious to get a post for the SL-20 as it will really make life a lot easier machining some of these new parts I am working on.

 

Thanks again

Chris

[TeccBoxx]

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This post is available from the La dealer Cad-cam Consulting at $850, not an option for a group but worth mentioning for the individual.

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Being a little bored today I thought I would catch up on any missed threads (I am learning a great tons thanks everyone) Anyway I came upon this as I must of missed it. According to Steve a reseller has the post for $850. Now this is something I hardly understand with companies. In my situation it is different since I am using the apprentice package, but people like Master and Go Navy are in away in the drain. Maybe I am looking at it worng but shouln't a person who has paid thousands for a cad/cam package have full access to any post that he needs. I can see a reseller/firm charge $60+ dollars an hour for changing a post so it has a particular G-code output. However I don't see why anyone should have to pay for a post that has already been created and is sitting collecting dust. Like I said I might be looking at it in a wrong way but I thought I would voice my opinion.

[Rick Damiani]

quote:

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I can see a reseller/firm charge $60+ dollars an hour for changing a post so it has a particular G-code output. However I don't see why anyone should have to pay for a post that has already been created and is sitting collecting dust. Like I said I might be looking at it in a wrong way but I thought I would voice my opinion.

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If I charge you $60.00/hr for 16 hours of work to customize and test a post for your mill/turn machine, how would you feel about me then giving it to James (who happens to have the same mill/turn machine) a couple of months later at no charge? If James needed some additonal customizing beyond what you required, should I discount the $960.00 you paid for work that is gonna show up in James' post?