1 hour ago, rgrin said:

...

Matsuura has been doing automated 5 axis forever.

...

Matsuura has been palletizing 5-Axis machines since 1992. They (as did the majority of 5-Axis builders) left that toilet bowl design the Germans seem hell bent on using in the dust LONG ago. It's not the best design for a table/table kinematic machine. Trunion is the best for table/table.

Support should be the #1 consideration when buying a 5-Axis machine. Much like a multi-tasking lathe support will make or break that machine. You could buy "the best" (whatever that is) machine but when the good for nothing AE shows up to train you, he (or she) has no clue about cutting parameters to utilize the machine to maximize it's capability, it's going to be on YOU to figure out. Oh sure, they'll tell you "... that's the CAM system's responsibility...", and it is, but only to a certain extent. When they cannot explain to you the role of point spacing, cut distance, and tolerance, and how it relates to machine performance, you ARE in for trouble.

https://schunk.com/us/en/workpiece-clamping-technology/manual-clamping-systems/c/PUB_8334 

www.raptorworkholding.com

https://www.mate.com/pages/metalheads/

To name a few...

When I need to do this I program a contour toolpath. On the filter tab I turn off arc filtering and turn on break arcs into line segments. I use CAMplete as my Post Processing solution and in there I change it from a 3+2 Toolpath to a 5-Axis (S-TCP) Toolpath then force it to either be on the correct side to keep it in travel. There are probably easier or other ways to do it, that's just how I do it. 

I just did a fresh install of CAMplete... Fusion360 was not installed automatically.

My understanding is the same as JP's... USB Hasp is a thing of the past. Relics of a bygone era. 

I haven't had one for quite some time. 

Legal; Neither me, nor my company are responsible for any paramters yiu change. Your machine is your responsibility.  It is advisable to consult a competent Machine Tool Applications Engineer that is familiar with your machine. 

Without further adieu, some of my favorites are as follows:

#929=1, 1=Always make FTP Data in  Attribute = ASCII

#1300.1 = 1 Handle Jog OT alarm not output. (NAL)
#1401.1 =1 No dogleg rapid (LRP)

#1401.4 = 1 Rapid Stops when Feed Override is at 0% (RF0)

#1604.0 = 0 AICC not on always in Auto Mode. (SHP)

#3106.6 = 0 During TWP or WSEC, "Absolute" position display is Program Coordinate system (DAK)

#3203.6 = 0 - Do Not Delete MDI  Program after execution (MER)
#3203.7 = 0 - MDI Program not cleared by reset (MCL)
#3204.6 = 1 - Do not Automatically erase MDI program. (MKP)

#3207.5 = 1 Display #500-#549 MACRO Variable Name (VRN)
7
#3233.1 = 1 (PDM) Folders in the Dataserver can be set as the foreground and background folder

#3301.7 = 1 Screen Capture Enable (HDC) - Hold Shift for 5 sec. 

#5004.2 - 1 = Diameter, 0 = Radius for CC. (ODI)

#5013 = MAX Wear Offset Value
#5014 = MAX INC Wear Offset Input (INP.+ Method)

#5148 (VMC Boring in Z-Axis)
Z 1 = Shift X+
  -1 = Shift X-
   2 = Shift Y+
  -2 = Shift Y-
ALL other axes = 0

#5200.5 = 1 High Speed style peck tap (PCP)
#5202.0 = 1 for Spindle Orient prior to rigid tap (reboot req.) (ORI)

#5213 = Rigid Tap Backoff Dist.

#5400.5 = 1 (LV3) Rotates MACRO Variables to be read in active coordinate system - For Probing in TWP.

#6001.3 = 1 Output all MACRO Variables on punch (PV5)

#6001.6 = 1 #100-#199 not cleared on reset. (CCV)

#6005.0 = 1 In Sub Program Call use Sequence Number (SQC)

#6008.3 = 1 On reset, POPEN is closed (KOP).

#6019.0 = 1 Output all variables as decimal number (MCO)

#6019.3 = 0 File Format of output file =PRNTnnnn.DAT (OFN) non =0000-9999

#6019.7 = 1 File Format of output file =PRNTnnnn.DAT (SFN) non =0000-9999 is memorized.

#11200.3 = 1 system variable #5061- #5080 Skip Coordinates can be read - for probing with WSEC active (WSK)

#11350.1=1 Current section of program only displayed, not look ahead section (APD) (Requires Reboot)

#11351.6=1 Parameter Group Names Displayed (GTD)

#13451.1 = 1 TWP 0's ok. (ATW)

#14701.5 & .4 = 1 Maximum clipboard size. (CLP) (Reboot Req.)

#14853.4 = 1 - Able to transfer from memory card to Dataserver. (Reboot Req.) (MDO)

#14854.6 = 1 Program Input/Output is enabled during Background Editing (BGO) 

#19746.4 = 1 (TBP) for G41.2/G42.2

So #19703-#19705 are your 1/2 offsets. Think of these as deviation from perfect alignment around the tilt axis and rotary axis intersections. The values for your table should have come with the paperwork for the rotary table inspection report.

Your machine should be a B/C kinematic so yiu would be concerned with #19704 and #19705.

An A/B would be concerned with #19703 and #19704, and an A/C machine would be concerned with #19703 and #19705. 

Unfortunately I'm away from my laptop today so I don't have all my info readily available. 

"Some" parameters are in maintenance books, some are in the connection manuals, others are in the Operation Manuals.common to Lathe Center.and Machining Center. It's a little confusing, but I kind of get it. 

I haven't found the descriptions to not be there. Some parameters are specific to builders and are not listed. 

3 hours ago, Seedy steve said:

IDK what that is... lol I am still learning g-code after 20 years!

this VCF has 3 meters of X , so if u r not close to position, it will often b out of range after g68.2 .

we r getting probing software Tuesday.

thanks again.

#5400.5 = 1 (LV3) Rotates MACRO Variables to be read in active coordinate system - For Probing while TWP is active.

Interesting about being out of range. In a few machines I've encountered over the years,  for some unexplainable reason, I've had to set #1301.7 = 0 Stroke Pre-Check Off because for some reason the control thinks it is going to overtravel while TWP was active. It's only been on certain  FANUV CNC Series and Edition Softwares. But the machine never did overtravel.  High Level Math... one of the great mysteries for me.

Interesting parameter differences.  

Why do you guys turn off LV3 off ever  @Paul Anderson? 

On 3/18/2024 at 6:05 AM, Seedy steve said:

I did need linear movement pre positioning to get within the range of motion for the offset/ angle. before g68 . (top mapped approach point)

I'm not familiar with top mapped approach point. 

I always have G54.4Pn in my code (Work Setting Error Compensation) which REQUIRES no linear position move until after G68.2

I missed you not having that function activated. My mistake.

There's different rules for different functions and different combinations of functions. 

As long as you understand what MockSim is and is not, what Vericut is and is not, what CAMplete is and is not you can make educated decisions about what fits your need.

MockSim doe NOT check G-Code. Tied to a Postability post it is a good solution for most things. Again, it's not fully simulating ALL the motion in your machine like M-Codes, etc...

Vericut... they simulate the actual G-Code that will run in your machine. As good as your control file and machine stuff is determines how good your simulation is. By and large it is the gold standard for simulation. You can create your own machines if you desire to learn or you can buy them from Vericut, or you can hire someone to build them for you. YOu have choices. Vericut is NOT an integrated post processing solution so you will need a post either from your CAM vendor or from ICAM, or somewhere else.

CAMplete... they simulate the G-Code created from their posted code. You cannot import and edited code. CAMplete IS an integrated Post Processing solution that will simulate the factory G and M-Codes. You have almost as much control over your machine as you would in a Vericut machine. You have limited machine editing capability and you cannot create your own machines. That is not an anticipated feature. The machines are factory configured meaning Matsuura, Okuma, Kern, Mazak, Haas, etc... has given their blessing on the accuracy of the models, motion, and functionality. Because CAMplete is an intagrated Post Processing solution, you have control over the code. The NC Formats are user customizable. Typically a basic NC Format is given to the customer that will run the machine well. I've got a decade and a half's experience developing NC Formats and I've got highly tuned NC Formats  that take advantage of the majority of the features and functions of the Matsuuras (since that95% of what I spend my time on) and I'm adding new stuff all the time based on customer requests.

Knowing the tools, knowing their strengths, weaknesses and capabilites os the key to getting the best solution for you. For me, nothing beats CAMplete. For you, Postability and Vericut may be best, for someone else, MockSim will do the job. Know your tools.

I figured that was going to be part of the equation. Just wanted confirmation.

Speaking of Vericut, anyone using it to post yet? 

Not knowing your machine's G/M codes, this is how I would format my programs.

O0000
(MASTERCAM    - 2023)
(POST         - DOOSAN_VCF_FANUC_AGG)
G00 G90 G17 G20 G40 G69 G80
G100

M11 M39 (B-AXIS UNLOCK, A-AXIS UNLOCK)
G00 G17 G90 G56B49.741 A5.93 <<<< Activate work offset with Tilt and Rotary positions only. Linear positions are after TWP is active.
G68.2 X0. Y0. Z0. I275. J310. K243.109
G53.1
M10 M38 (B-AXIS LOCK, A-AXIS LOCK)
X0 Y0 <<<<<< linear positions here
G43 H35
M165 P9832
M165 P9810 Z1.0 F100. <<<< NEVER move the machine around unless the Z is home with the probe UNLESS the probe is on AND positioning in protected mode.

M165 P9810 Z-.25 F5.
M165 P9814 D2. S2. <<<<<< Decimal points don't matter.... until they do. User them always to remove all doubt.  
M165 P9810 Z1.
M165 P9833
G28 Z0.
G49
G69
M05
G200
M30

If you still encounter problems it's one of two things; parameters not set correctly, or your probing software does not support probing while in TWP.

I'm pretty sure software F-4012-0519-AA or later is good to go. F-4012-0519-AW or later is best if you can get it.

CCCS is AWESOME.  Anytime I've ever needed anything Mastercam related they've provided exceptional assistance.  

I did a video Mastercam project to CAMplete TruePath G-Code Export start to finish. There's no audio. I just created a document that explains the processes in more detail.

Keep in mind I've created a Mastercam Machine Definition, Control Definition and Post (renamed generic 5-Axis Mastercam post) - which is ONLY used for the text (Canned Cycles, Canned Text, Misc. Ints., Misc Reals, etc...) it does NOT generate good code for anything.

If anyone wants the document, DM me with your e-mail and I'll send it. Enjoy!

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/nozv0bedx807rhn4z7xkj/Mastercam-to-CAMplete-Start-to-Finish.mp4?rlkey=wu5xpoyrx5rgzeloviaaj6ofp&dl=0

2 hours ago, Leon82 said:

I made a crude video of how I dew it

 

https://youtu.be/56XpEuvwkK4?si=Pr__u0Lx2V6BcVRN

That's pretty awesome!

You may want to make sure your high speed modes (G131, G05.1, etc...) are OFF (G130, G05.1Q0, etc...)

1 hour ago, neurosis said:

I don't mean to start dropping pronouns but I don't know if we're talking to a guy or girl.

Well, there's a better than 99% chance you're right when assuming gender and programmers. I'm not a betting man, but if it came to betting on the gender of a programmer, even I'd take that bet.

58 minutes ago, Jake L said:

Agreed, this would be a good feature in optirough. There's cases where retracting would be faster, but there's definitely cases where "staying down" would be faster.

I think I may have confused 2D HST which DOES stay down exactly as shown in the Tebis clips so between two paths (2D HST and gcode's sample) it is manageable. Possibly more work that desired but, it's definitely possible.

Working on something... keep in mind it's a work in process so feedback is MUCH appreciated.

You've got mail.

1 hour ago, balnh said:

I don’t have a multi-axis liscense. I ran the parts no problem, roughed with optirough with axis sub.  My question was why does the generic 5 axis post break up the c axis motion so much with Axis sub toolpaths. My generic Haas 4 axis post posts nice short Nc code. I figured it was generic 5 axis post limitation. 

BITD (mid 1990's) I did a test between wireframe toolpaths (2D Swept) and a surface toolpath (flowline) and pretty much came up with the same results as you did. The wireframe toolpath produced far less code than the surface toolpath did.

What I never did a deep dive into was the exact reasons "why". Someone smarter than me will have to come and provide that answer.

Where is Jack Summers or @Pete Rimkus from CNC Software Inc. when we need them?

1 hour ago, bird2010 said:

I always say...sorry, I am not good at English at the end of my posts.
I'm sorry, you will see very strange English, just apologies
Why do you always distort the meaning?
Forget it, you are also very unfriendly!
What you said is right. I shouldn't have spoken. I shouldn't have come here.
I'm really sorry

I attack?
I apologize to everyone if my English is expressed like this
I don't understand the language. I shouldn't be here. I just quit and don't come in again.
Once again, I apologize to everyone!

Post a fragment of a part, or even a sample Mastercam file that is "similar" to the part you're trying to machine then we can help you, which we STILL want to do. We're ALL in the same boat regardless of what you may think. We want Mastercam to continue to develop into a better product, more efficient toolpaths, more efficient metal removal strategies, etc... it doesn't get better unless we can see examples. Many of us submit product enhancement requests to Mastercam. This could fall into that category if you'd just post up a file. Yes, it REALLY is that easy.

That fact you continue down the path you continue to go down tells ME you're not interested in getting help, you're just in here to shill for another CAM system.

As for me being very unfriendly. Fair enough. That's your (and probably some others if I'm being honest) opinion. There's a fairly large number of people I have and do help all over the world that may disagree though. I probably am a pain in the @$$ to a lot of people, but at least I bring A LOT of information and experience to the table to offset some of the negatives.

ALL of this "unfriendliness" could have been avoided though by just posting a sample file at your first or second post. It REALLY was that easy. You chose this path, not us.

11 minutes ago, JB7280 said:

This  is wild!!

Welcome to the dark underbelly of the interwebz.

And I suspect this topic is going to disappear into the ether at some point in the not too distant future.

Correction... CAMplete does not support posting the probing paths from external CAM systems that are not Fusion360.

I heard a vicious rumor from a customer when you get CAMplete you also get Fusion360. This cutomer programs their probing paths in Fusion360 then program their toolpaths in Mastercam then they merge the projects in CAMplete and simulate/collision check. I can probably help you navigate that if you want to go down that path. I've got the technology .

Vericut and ICAM also allow you to create your own machines. CAMplete does not unfortunately.

CAMplete is an integrated Post Processor. Once the code is posted, then simulation/collision check can be run. Since Autodesk purchased CAMplete the pricing has changed somewhat. Perpetual licensing is no longer available. Cost per license is around 1/3 of what it once was if you just buy it though a vendor (NexGen CAM, DSI, etc...). CAMplete maintains parterships with some machine tool builders so if your machine comes with a seat of CAMplete or is available as a option with your machine, the cost can be lower than the normal street price. As was mentioned not all machine models/builders are available. Machine builders I am aware of that are available; Doosan, FANUC Robodrill, GROB, Haas, Hermele, Hurco, Kern, Kitamura, Kiwa, Matsuura, Mazak, Okuma, and Yasda. There could be others as well. These are just the ones I'm aware of. I've been using it since 2007. It's been a great product for me and a lot of my customers. I've managed to make some machines into other machines through some features I have access to in order help customers with a posting solution. I've done this for an OKK, for an Enshu, and a Mori Seiki. The collision checking isn't really accurate for the most part, and the customers were OK with that, they just wanted good code which I was able to provide with their guidance. Normal post processor turn around times are days, weeks, months or years... I was able to get them good code in hours while they watched. YMMV

8 hours ago, bird2010 said:

...

sorry, I am not good at English

Our company makes aerospace parts, and aerospace parts have a lot of reinforcing ribs. At this time, not retracting is the most efficient thing.
I can't upload files and I can't afford it if Boeing, Airbus, Mitsubishi or Sumitomo file a lawsuit

I only express my personal opinions, not the opinions of the company! If the license leaks out and the company pursues it... I did not buy the license with personal money! This is the reason for not uploading the file, I just publish it as a fan post

As a person and enthusiast who has used Mastercam for many years, I would be happy if Mastercam can improve...I don’t need any benefits.
Isn’t this a place where Mastercam enthusiasts gather? I don’t understand why verification of legality is more important than actual discussion of the issue. ...
But it becomes an obstacle to Mastercam's progress...I don't apologize for this sentence
Because Mastercam needs more users who point out shortcomings, not more users who only praise.

sorry, I am not good at English

Hundreds, if not thousands of users here work under the same conditions as you (i.e. cannot share proprietary data), but you know what, the people GENUINELY desiring help, figure out a way to not violate NDA's AND get the help they need/desire.

If you were here to help the community you would share your findings not just your critiques. I may be the only one, I may not be, but I think you are a shill for another software brand in a Mastercam User forum.

Nobody cares if you're good at english or not. Really. There are people from all over the world here all the time and they manage to get what they are looking for most of the time.

The fact you refuse to post even a sample part makes you suspicious. We roast software pirates here for sport. Since you're allegedly a legal user, why not post a small portion of a part, or create some geometry that illustrates your contentions. Verification of legality is more important at this point because you are posting in a suspicious manner, repeatedly.

NOBODY CARES IF YOU'RE GOOD AT ENGLISH. NOBODY!