which controller? Hust CNC Motion or Thermwood

[deckard]

Hello All

This is a question for all the experts here in emastercam .com. We have a 1990 model 70 Thermwood that needs to be updated with a 9100 SuperController. In addition to updating the controller we have been told that the machine needs to be completely rewired. My question is which is the better controller? Are there any users out there who have experience with CNC Motion in PA.? They have been great to deal with so far but my own CNC experience is limited to using a Thermwood 91000 SuperController. Both Thermwood and CNC Motion have both recommended the same thing. Complete rewiring and new controller. Anyone out there have any thoughts?

We're on the fence right now as to what to do. Restore our current machine to today's standards with new state of the art controllers or trade in and get a new or previously enjoyed machine that's a couple of years old?

Thanks in advance

[MATT Q]

Have you talked to Jeff Harke at Thermwood yet? He did our rebuild here and they did a great job and the machine was completly rewired.

[deckard]

Yes, I did speak with Jeff and he was able to supply me with a quote for the whole job but I'm not sure if my boss going to pull the trigger and get the updates done. He has asked me to look at any alternatives that may be available.

[crazy^millman]

Personally I like the Supercontroller. I know nothing about the other one you mentioned and if the Machine Thermwood I would think stciming with them will pay dividends down the road with service and quality. I have seen tons of retrofits and talk about some terrible looking and running machines if not done by the OEM. I am not saying non OEM can not do a good job, just this Machine is made by them I would want to look to them do the work.

 

HTH

[Westgate Hardwoods]

Deckard,

 

We have a Router that was built by CNC Motion. I can vouch for their quality. We have been running this Router for 6 years with very few issues. I don't know what they use for controllers now, but We have a Centroid Controller with 2 heads. I have always had good response from them if I did have any issues.

[Thee Starry™]

I am currently "blessed" to be programming for 4- 5 axis Thermwoods and 1 - 3 axis Thermwood. Though I have not used CNC Motion controls, I have looked into them. They are much closer to standard Fanuc controls, which I tend to prefer. I would rather have Milltronics controls, or Fanuc controls than anything, but such is not the case.

There is something nice about sticking with a control you are at least somewhat familier with, so as to avoid any un-needed training of operators, set up guys and totally new posts.

If I ran the company, I would switch over to KOMO 3 and 5 axis routers in a minute, and toss the flimsy Thermwoods, but we have to play the cards we were dealt.

[deckard]

Thermwoods are flimsy?

What do you mean exactly?

Are they unreliable, weak, fragile, problematic?

Please explain because as you know CNC Routers aren't cheap and I don't want to make a big dollar mistake. Just so you know we vacuum form or thermoform plastic parts and were looking to use the machine to create our molds. We have been told that REN board and MDF were ideal materials for moldmaking and even aluminum. Any thoughts? Anyone?

Thanks in advance

[ERIC14779]

he means that they are not rigid both static and dynamically. At A show once I grabed ahold of the spindle on one ( on display) and gave it a tug the sales guy in the booth about had a heart attack and the whole machine shook.

 

How are you to cut anything with that ???

 

you want to cut Aluminum on a 5 axis thermwood ???

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

If you're trimming/drilling aluminum you should be ok.

 

[ 03-13-2007, 01:55 PM: Message edited by: CNC Apps Guy ]

[Zoober]

Puleeeze tell me you don't actually need ALL 1" of that indicator!!

I know I don't do routers, but STILL!

[Travis_Buchanan]

Anyone is welcome to tug on our spindles....no pun intended.... ..... with the indicator test. We build very rigid cnc routers. Even at 41" of Z stroke on our 5-axis machines.

[ERIC14779]

That is no lie !!!!!

 

Motionmaster and Thermwood both

 

 

[Zoober]

Think I'll stick to horizontal MC's, thank you....

 

Shoot, I guess working with tight tolerance metal makes you a tad anal.

I found myself using my Starrett precision machine level this summer when I added on and leveled up my kitchen cabinets for granite. But they do look sweet!

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

ROFLMAO @ Robert.

 

Those cabinets... they square to within .0005 in 18" ?

[Zoober]

Square, flat and parallel. Yes Sir!

'Cept I only had a carpenter's square, so not too sure of square. I guess I could have trigged it out.......

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

I edited my comments at the request of Thermwood.

 

Seems as though they do not appreciate unfavorable testamonials about their product from moderators.

[ERIC14779]

So they want you to not tell the truth ???

 

 

I thought this forum was to help people ??

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

The only thing I am sure of is they did not appreciate my opinion(s).

 

The ODD (IMHO) thing about it is they did not bring it to me directly. They went through a few people.

[ERIC14779]

All they got to do is build a better product and stop with the marketing method of giving large discounts to intice people to buy. At least that was they did to me in 2000.

 

I bought a Quintax... IN MY OPINION the best machine for the $$$$$

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

By editing my comments, I feels as though I've compromised my integrity in some way which is why I sent Webby my resigation as Moderator for the Mastercam Forum. I'll still moderate O/T but I feel it's my duty to give you folks on the forum an honest opinion and if I can't do that... well, what good am I then?

 

So Thermwod, if you don't like the FACT that the column on your 5-Axis machines are so weak that you NEED a 1" Travel indicator to measure the deflection, then MAKE A BETTER PRODUCT!!!!!

[Thee Starry™]

"he means that they are not rigid both static and dynamically."

 

That is exactly what I mean. We even have a standard 3 axis with only 10" of Z travel, and with that I have some deflection and lack of rigidity. But our 5 axis machines are really bad, and have been since day one.

My boss tells me that my problem is that I spent too much time in metals and the aerospace sector and not enough time in the plastics end of manufacturing.

Which may be true, but in my eyes, it should be very simple with a decent cnc router to achieve semi tight tolerances and decent finish quality, no matter the material. Frankly, If I can achieve aerospace tolerances with a KOMO or Shoda, I should be able to all but eliminate any signs of chatter in materials as soft and light as Polyethylene with nearly any other router. But such is not the case in my experience with Thermwood.

[Zoober]

+100000 for your ethics, James!!

[ERIC14779]

Starry69

 

You are not out of line... How can you trim at any respectfull feedrate when the machine acts like it is made of rubber !!!!

 

 

KUDOS to you CNC Apps Guy for standing up for your convictions

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

quote:

---

...my problem is that I spent too much time in metals and the aerospace sector and not enough time in the plastics end of manufacturing...

---

Horsefeathers!!! MANY CNC Router Mfr's make very good, rigid equipemnt at reasonable prices. Jst because you're cutting plastics does not mean you don't need a rigid piece of equipemnt.

 

Thanks for your encouragement guys! I appreciate it.

[Thee Starry™]

CNC Apps Guy, Hooray for you! I have nothing but true respect for anyone who will stand up for what they know is right!

 

Also, I had the same response as yours to my bosses gripe about me. Though I replaced "horsefeathers" with some slightly more colorful terminology!

I don't care if you are cutting butter with a hot knife, I at least want the knife to be rigid and well built, so the butter cuts smoothly! If I am going to do it, I want it done as well as physically possible and will not stand for mediocrity.