Multi-Task Machining for X5

[gms1]

Well we know that CNC Software is a partner in THINC now which is Okuma's project. Hopefully (!) that will be a big help for CNC Software in developing software for MTM.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

To be honest, I've been pretty fortunate with the G112/G113 on Nakamuras...

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

About Esprit and Mori... Mori once had about the same relationship with Gibbs. I'm not sayin' I'm just sayin. Mori STILL has their CAPS CAM Programming Software so their relationship with Esprit is probably there to fill a void to help them sell mor eequipment. That's not a knock, it seems pretty savy to me and it's mutually beneficial. Esprit probably gets the long end of the stick as with the exception of wire, they've pretty much been a fringe CAD/CAM System. This could very well bring them bring them up a few notches in the installed base numbers game.

[mayday]

IMHO, its not that MCant do the job in MTM. Its the fact that known bugs have existed for years with no fixes. year after year maintanence money goes into the pool, and no ones seems to be listening. We personally spock with someone at CNC today about sub spindle issues and where told most everyone does it wrong. A change was made from X2 to X4...... to be continued.

sorry gotta go

[Tyler Robertson]

quote:

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About Esprit and Mori... Mori once had about the same relationship with Gibbs. I'm not sayin' I'm just sayin. Mori STILL has their CAPS CAM Programming Software so their relationship with Esprit is probably there to fill a void to help them sell mor eequipment.

---

*waits for SAIPEM to discredit based on age*

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

LOL @ Tyler.

 

I wouldn't worry about what anyone says about age. A few years after a guy told me I didn;t know $#!+ from shinola, he was my student while I was teaching Mastercam.

 

Sheeeeeeeeet.... I worked FOR Mori in the mid-90's. Any attempt at a discredit will be issued a HUGE flag. I was there when DTL(Mori's Software division) got started. I know a thing or two about Mori and software. I don't know everything but I know more than enough to be dangerous.

[dfehrman]

- Thanks Roger, I'll take your advise and give some of your solutions a try.

- I didn't think that SAIPEM discredited anyone on age but experience does mean alot. When M/C doesn't give you the code you need, you need to have enough experience to write your own code and not be so dependant on M/C.

- As far as getting off topic on the original question SAIPEM asked. I think that is not the case at all. My anger has been growing for years with MTM / Turning Centers. As M/C made a bunch of improvements to ART, us MTM guy's were pushed aside left with little improvements and very little documentation. I don't use ART on my machined parts other than engraving. SAIPEM just happened to ask the question at the right time that torqued me off. It was a very good question. If M/C had been taking care of us MTM guys with all their upgrades after paying large maintenance fees for years, then this question would have never been asked. So with the amount of response so far on this thread, it must be an issue with alot of people. I don't see these type of questions being asked about milling. Again, It's time for M/C to step up to the plate. The wait has been too long.

[Guest SAIPEM]

Tyler,

 

Age has nothing to do with it.

It's the years of seat time and shop floor time.

I learned programming the old-fashioned way.

A pad, pencil, calculator and tape punch for General Numeric controls.

This kind of work over years gives one an intimate knowledge of CNC control systems and how they work, vis a vis proper post-processors.

This kind of knowledge is woefully lacking at every CAM company, not just CNC.

 

Mori is a perfect example of a Machine Tool builder leveraging a CAM company to help both.

 

What James has stated is absolutely true.

Why? because at the time, Gibbs was the only company that had anything remotely capable of doing certain "extra-curricular" operations in a turning environment.

 

The whole point of all this is that CNC has ignored MTM despite multiple broken promises.

Every day that goes by is one more seat that goes to Mastercam's competition.

I say this as an unabashed Mastercam fanboi.

 

 

I'm not a big fan of ESPRIT as an 'all-around' CAM system.

In terms of seats worldwide, BobCAD has sold more.

However, it is light-years ahead of Mastercam in MTM and they are making HUGE leaps in market share as well as revenue.

 

I was at the ESPRIT World Conference in Long Beach.

Dan Frayssinet from DP correctly pointed out that DP Technology was the only CAM company with revenue growth over the past year.

That didn't happen by accident and MTM was the big reason why.

 

http://www.mmsonline.com/articles/cam-deve...-rd-cash-crunch

 

[ 07-16-2010, 08:26 PM: Message edited by: SAIPEM ]

[John White WLM&T]

And then

there is the poor wire edm guys. Nothing new at all since version 8.

 

John

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

Hey, we've got fArt and Router though!!! Those are real winners.

[Newbeeee™]

@dfehrman

Just 'cus it looks good in verify means nowt.

Never underestimate your post. It clearly needs customising to meet your needs.

This is one thing that is superb in mastercam - you (or someone cleverer than me) can make it do exactly what you want it to.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

^^^

 

I have to agree with that. Mastercam's Post Processors are so good, they can actually make up for some of the shortcommings in the software.

[dfehrman]

Thanks Newbeeee & CNC Apps Guy 1,

I guess what really torques me of is when I found out that there was a post available from In-House for our MX2500ST, I was told by Doosan that this post was proven out as a joint venture between Doosan & In-House for the machine. As I would expect to do some minor editing with the code as with any other lathe post I have worked with. I would have expected that after we paid the thousands of dollars for this post, it should have been right on the money with no editing. This is not the case at all and I have become an un-happy camper. How many more thousands of dollars and time I don't have will it take to get this post modified. I feel like I've been setup as a fool. I don't see this machine as being this complicated and I know what I want to do with it and I can write my own G-code. My problem is getting M/C to to do it. As using evey version of M/C since V8 and starting in 2000, I don't consider myself as entry level with M/C lathe. Do I still have alot to learn? Yes and constantly. I learn something every day since working in machine shops on turning centers since 1974. With the little documentation supplied for MTM as compared to a mill, I'm totally dis-satisfied with the support. I'm not saying that I probably shouldn't need post modification but I did expect that I didn't.

SAIPEM had an excellent very first question to ask about MTM that really fired up my cookies. Other than that, I still would have been a quiet observer of this site.

Thanks again,

Doug Fehrman

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

If you purchased a Post from In-House, they'll support it. Have you ever asked for the necessary mods to make it work?

[Ron Branch @ Verisurf]

I have a post for our Integrex and never had a problem getting something done for it. Big thing is I bug them and keep on them and it gets done. They are like anyone with a lot to do and something you just have to nudge them to help you out.

[Rob @ Target Machine]

I have to agree with Andre. Your comp issue is coming from your postprocessor. IMHO, a call to In-House Solutions for a custom post will be a wortwhile investment.

 

quote:

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How do I become a BETA tester as I feel I have alot to say.

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As far as Beta testing, your reseller can help you with the process of getting in. I'm sure Cnc and it's users would benefit from some more input regarding MTM development.

[Tyler Robertson]

quote:

---

Tyler,

 

Age has nothing to do with it.

It's the years of seat time and shop floor time.

I learned programming the old-fashioned way.

A pad, pencil, calculator and tape punch for General Numeric controls.

This kind of work over years gives one an intimate knowledge of CNC control systems and how they work, vis a vis proper post-processors.

This kind of knowledge is woefully lacking at every CAM company, not just CNC.

---

We weren't talking about cnc programming though, we were talking about business practices, no?

 

Absolutely - I wouldn't begin to imagine that I'm anywhere near the machinist of anyone here (I'm not a machinist!)

[Guest SAIPEM]

Tyler,

 

My apologies for any misunderstanding.

 

Manufacturing needs all the young guns we can get in the trade.

You're the guys we'll need for the future to get better because

the future is not simply an exptrapolation of the past.

 

[Tyler Robertson]

All good - thanks for the class