New to Horizontal Milling

[g huns]

Quick video of a VoluMill path...

 

[mkd]

^^^^ toolpaths like that, the boss is going to forget all about a new Makino :cheers:

i saw on an auction site the weight on that 500mm Okuma is 52,000, which sounds absolutely massive. Much more than a mori 633.

[Sticky]

Sounds like a money maker

[g huns]

I think that's a .037 side step at 5500/225IPM. Pretty conservative really. The operator had some bad experiences when we did some similar work in our Fadal. We're bumping it up on him slowly.

 

The truck driver who brought it said 51K and change. I heard the brand new ones are closer to 30K. That's quite a diet they put em on.

[GoetzInd]

 

 

 the boss is going to forget all about a new Makino 

You don't think you could do that on a Makino?

[g huns]

You don't think you could do that on a Makino?

It think he's referring to up thread where I mentioned we were looking at a new Makino. And yes, the boss has forgotten all about it.

 

We got very lucky. So far, this machine does exactly what need it to do. And all tooled up, for about a third of the price of any quote we got for a new one. That extra $$$ is probably going to be a down-payment on our next 5X machine.

[Sticky]

I think that's a .037 side step at 5500/225IPM. Pretty conservative really. The operator had some bad experiences when we did some similar work in our Fadal. We're bumping it up on him slowly.

 

The truck driver who brought it said 51K and change. I heard the brand new ones are closer to 30K. That's quite a diet they put em on.

 

 

I'm sure the Okuma boys can correct me, but doesn't Okuma run a heavy duty line of HMc's called the MH line or something like that, and the light duty version is the MA line? Or the opposite of that?

[GoetzInd]

 

 

It think he's referring to up thread where I mentioned we were looking at a new Makino. 

Ahhh. No doubt Okuma is a solid machine. Sounds like you got a good deal. I for one MUCH rather have a good used machine and money to tool it up right than a brand new one with nothing. Always cracks me up when I see used HMC's on the market with a T-slot right angle plate and a Kurt vise on the pallet. 

 

Mike

[GoetzInd]

 

 

I'm sure the Okuma boys can correct me, but doesn't Okuma run a heavy duty line of HMc's called the MH line or something like that, and the light duty version is the MA line? Or the opposite of that?

I was told by Okuma that one of them is the old Okuma Howa HMC. All box way and such. Personally, I'd rather have roller guides.

 

Mike

[GoetzInd]

Delete.

[YoDoug®]

I'm sure the Okuma boys can correct me, but doesn't Okuma run a heavy duty line of HMc's called the MH line or something like that, and the light duty version is the MA line? Or the opposite of that?

 

The MA500/600 are the heavy duty machines. A MA600 with a larger Matrix ATC is upper 50k lbs. The MA500 is a beast.

 

The alternative is an MB5000. Those are in the 30k lbs range.  

[YoDoug®]

This video shows a 2.0 diameter * 2.0 deep full slot cut in Ti going Y+ direction in a MA500. Not many machines have the rigidity and axis power to pull off this cut. 

 

[Sticky]

That is a very impressive cut. Interesting to see how high the Y axis load was and how low the spindle load was. I can't think of any other 500mm machines that are 50k lbs, maybe a Niigata?

[g huns]

Wait... You mean our machine used to be white on the inside?

[mkd]

That is a very impressive cut. Interesting to see how high the Y axis load was and how low the spindle load was. I can't think of any other 500mm machines that are 50k lbs, maybe a Niigata?

This bad boy Okuma has more Y but less X travel than a Mori633. And with a 120 tool Cat50 conveyor, the mori is a "paltry" 43,000lbs. Still having a hard time wrapping my head around a 9000lbs difference.

Even a Makino a81 seems to be listed at 41K.

ok, i'll stop.

[g huns]

That rather impressive program in the video I posted damn near scrapped that block.

 

In our non-MasterCam software, VoluMill programs have two feedrates, cutting and connection. Our cutting rate was around 250, connection was 787. The machine kept flashing an error message on the previous part about max feedrate, but it kept running. The operator saw the 787 in the program so he found somewhere on the control that referred to max feedrate. It was set to 400, he changed it to 800. Error went away, machine cut like a dream. Only it allowed the machine to deviate WELL beyond the programmed path. I happened to see it on the bench awaiting the heat treat pick up and about chit my pants. We were leaving +.030 stock, there are some areas that aren't going to clean up, but they aren't important areas.

 

The operator talked to the apps guy and claims to have it all under control, something about Hi-Cut being turned off and should be on. He's running the next block, but it's not nearly as fun to watch run.

[Mr. M]

You can adjust the Hi-Cut settings in the program also to allow greater speed.

G131 J1 E.015 F800 for roughing (E is the deviation allowed)

G131 J1 E.0004 F800 for finishing

[g huns]

You can adjust the Hi-Cut settings in the program also to allow greater speed.

G131 J1 E.015 F800 for roughing (E is the deviation allowed)

G131 J1 E.0004 F800 for finishing

 

I found the G131 info in the manual. That makes sense to me.

 

But what our operator "understands" after talking to the apps guy is that if the max feed is very high, it will pkuk up your part, even with a small tolerance. I think our operator misunderstood. He does that a lot, and always misunderstands to the sloooooooooooooow side of things.

 

I really don't see the point of the max feed. I want it to go as fast as it can, wherever it can, and do whatever it has to do to hold the tolerance I ask for.

[Sticky]

Keep in mind that for small pockets like the one in your video, the difference between 400ipm and 800ipm back feed in regards to cycle time is totally dependent on axis acceleration. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that in that small pocket that you machine can't get up to 500ipm. You might not save any cycle time and just cause accuracy issues. It's at least something to be aware of.

[g huns]

Keep in mind that for small pockets like the one in your video, the difference between 400ipm and 800ipm back feed in regards to cycle time is totally dependent on axis acceleration. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that in that small pocket that you machine can't get up to 500ipm. You might not save any cycle time and just cause accuracy issues. It's at least something to be aware of.

 

Yep. But the program also does some larger connection moves where I'm sure it could reach terminal velocity if we let it.  

 

I am blown away by just how fast she moves for a big girl.

[Sticky]

I hear ya, but if it's not a production part, and if it isn't going to shave much time off if you are just doing 1-4 pcs, why risk it.

 

I've never tried to shave 20min off a 8-16hr cycle and shot myself in the foot by not being able to hold tolerance from the high feed rates...

[g huns]

...why risk it.

 

 

Cause...

 

[Sticky]

[Ewood42]

Thoroughly test your post, crashes on a horizontal tend to be pretty nasty/expensive.

 

As was already stated, be aware of CG of your tombstone/workpiece set up, and make sure it is VERY solidly mounted. The way I hear it, our Mori NH6300 has mangled Z axis way covers due to the previous programmer trying to hold a quarter ton of tombstone and C axis indexer with 4 toe clamps. It is semi-permanently bolted straight to the pallet now.

 

If you have not already, look into getting dynamic work offsets set up if the machine supports it, and take the time to determine exactly where the centerpoint of rotation is. Will make programming and set up way easier later.

[g huns]

No fancy dynamic offsets on this old girl. 

 

We are currently programming each face with it's own work coordinate. It's a pain, but it's kinda nice for getting used to things. The numbers the operator is seeing on the screen make sense and can be checked with the print.

 

I can see where programming from center of rotation will make us programmers job much easier.

 

No matter how it runs, at least it looks good now. We stripped all the front panels and doors off, beat the dents out, took them to car wash and cleaned them. Then we sent them to a local sign shop and had a vinyl wrap put on them. Here's Mutt and Jeff trying to remember how to put it back together...