I should also add that we use a laser. Sounds like you are using a button style tool setter so maybe it doesn't apply.

Not sure if this helps but I had this issue on my Makinos. Due to the nature of the cutting tools (end mill, bottom is not flat) it would give bad results here and there with the default tolerance of .005". I went into the Renishaw setting macro and updated the default tolerance setting to .030" and it hasn't happened since. I don't recall which macro is the setting file but there is a default tolerance that can be changed. I would assume the Renishaw macros are pretty similar, if not the same for the different machine manufacturers.

+1 I am a huge fan of both the Schunk Vero system (big fixtures) and the Lang quickpoint system (small fixtures). Both are extremely well made and well designed. I'd take the Schunk system over anything else out there including the Big Kaiser system. It is a much better design.

Thanks for the response. I'll play around with the curves on the next part to see if I can get it done in one. I am controlling the tool axis from curve from start to finish so the tool angle stays pretty consistent as it goes down into the hole. This is with a .015" 3 degree tapered ball mill in a 50,000 rpm air spindle. I wish i was better at 5-axis, it is pretty cool what can be done with it. The company I make these tools for swore these features would need to be made with a sinker EDM but the 5-axis kills it.

I tried that and it fell apart when it got closer to the smaller chain. It was late and I just wanted to get the machine off and running so I didn't spend too much time on it. I'll see what I can do on the next part. I have four more of these to make.

I have some geometry that resembles a test tube (cylindrical walls with spherical bottom) with grooves on the inside and I am machining the inside geometry. I have got the morph between curves to work when there are two curves but how would I get that to machine all the way down to the bottom with one toolpath? I tried chaining the upper curve and a point for the bottom and it didn't work, needs two curves. Right now I am using two different toolpaths to get this done though i would like to get it done in one. This is for the posts on a knee mold for investment casting.

If there is ever any question about balance I will load the part at B180 on the pallet so the imbalance will be toward the pivot axis of the pallet changer. There is no way that would tip during a pallet change. Also, these can be run like a VMC and loaded into the work envelope. My machines only pallet change with an M60 so if there isn't an M60 the program will terminate like any other machine. I have never loaded this way however. If you do decide to use the angle plate shown above and you anticipate large heavy parts you might consider mounting it backwards on the pallet. It will take a few seconds longer to rotate 180 degrees every time you want to load and unload but it will solve 99% of potential tipping issues during pallet changes.

I had the same issues on my Makino HMCs. I tried and tried to fix it and never could get it right (better than .0015"). Ended up buying a tool presetter (Speroni) and never looked back. Tools repeat to .0002" and it doesn't matter if the machine is warm or cold, tool setting is completely independent AND doesn't take machine time. I do use my lasers for break checking though.

One thing I will do often is 2D HST dynamic milling (or dynamic facing) to get these regions close, then come back with opti-rest driven by a stock model. IMHO the 2D HST toolpaths are a little more efficient than optirough in areas not needing step up and it gives a little more control in these situations. Sure it takes a few more operations and a few more minutes programming time but it is usually made up at the machine.

Makino says it can do more but they will not guarantee accuracy if that weight is exceeded so I think it is partly related to the machining dynamics along with the pallet change capacity. I would assume Okuma is in a similar situation.

Another thing to consider is where the tombstone's center of gravity is once your material is loaded and what the pallet change load capacity is for the machine. If the CG is too high or offset the pallet can get dumped during the pallet change. I'm not sure my A61 could even change pallets with a 28" x 28" x 10" (2100 lb) block of steel mounted to a tombstone (600 lb) or other fixture as the rating for the machine is something like 1200 pounds. You should look into the load capabilities of the Okuma to verify. Also look into the safe working cylinder diameter of the machine. If that block exceeds this cylinder you will get one hell of a surprise when you try to change pallets or index once in the machine.

Setting up a horizontal to be efficient takes a lot of thought, work, and $$$. If done right it will be an amazing asset for the shop, if not done right it will become a boat anchor that a struggle to run. For the drilling, to me it sounds like those are pretty expensive drills so I would spend the money and buy dedicated holders for them. Do you know if the machine has probing? If not this is a must. A well set up horizontal can sit and run for hours if both pallets are loaded up and if your roughing tool breaks you can scrap a spindle or worse if the machine doesn't have break check capabilities. On my first horizontal (Makino A51nx) I think I spend $40-$50k on tombstones, fixtures, and tooling to get it set up. When I buy additional tombstones I also buy additional pallets so they are permanently mounted. It would also be good to get a gantry crane on that machine if you don't have crane capabilities currently.

One of my guys did that, once... Luckily it was a larger tool (1/2") and we were able to insert a steel shaft through the pull stud hole and press it out on the hydraulic press. It took about 8 tons to get it to move.

The big thing with Imco is they use top grade carbide and they are very consistent from lot to lot. We have some production jobs where we are pushing the tools to 99% and they last 30 minutes with about 5% breakage. We were getting the same results with another brand but there was a lot where the carbide quality was toward the bottom of their tolerance (but still within their spec) and we had to slow the entire project down 30% because the breakage was 80% at 30 minutes. We are running a shop rate of $275 per hour on this project so the crappy lot cost us $82 per hour. I wouldn't save $15 per tool to cost myself $82 per hour in productivity. Economics 101. I try to buy the best, run them hard, and get my money's worth.

I had a project where I ran Hanita cutters and in a pinch I would substitute Garr because the supplier was really close. They were crap and had about 60% of the tool life of Hanita. We switched to Imco and they made Hanita look like crap and that makes Garr crappier than crap. I would only use them to bore out a broken tap...

Sorry to scrap your $25k spindle. We must have fudged up the heat treat on those guys. My bad, we'll get it right next time...

Ugh, Command... I will no longer buy anything from those guys as their quality is plain $hit! I bought a spindle test bar from them and specifically requested the calibration cert with it. Well when I got it I put it in the spindle of my NEW Makino and it said the spindle was out of spec (.001" @ 12"). The Makino tech's test bar said the spindle was in spec (.0002" @ 12") so the bar went back to Command and I gave them a piece of my mind. They asked if I wanted a replacement, LOL! Nope, just a refund. Unbelievable. They must have forged the cert... ZERO respect for those guys and that brand after that. There have been a number of other quality issues with them but that was the last straw.

Where are you located? What skills do you have? I assume programming with Mastercam? What machines have you programmed for? Any CAD skills? Multi-axis skills? In which industries have you worked?

If I understand correctly this is an existing pin that is being modified. With that said, you could try building a reservoir around the pin and fill with low melting point alloy, then finish with the alloy supporting the pin. When complete, melt away the rest of the alloy. I have modified pin heat sinks (1/16" dia pins, 1" tall) using this method and the results were PERFECT.

I just hired his replacement, whom he gets to train so he can move into programming full time. He has been around the machines enough and seen the ups and downs that he will do a great job in programming at this point. He has programmed in the past and he has a real spark but he just didn't get to do it more because the demands of keeping the spindles turning. At this point I think he will have more of an impact as a programmer and if all goes well his pay will go well also. I wouldn't say I'm generous, I pay guys what they are worth to the shop. I do this to prevent them from going elsewhere and it is a huge savings in the long run. If you do $12/hr work that is what you would get paid here until you got fired. I'm not looking for $12/hr guys that stay at $12/hr. I'm looking for guys that start at $12/hr and quickly learn and grow into more productive employees and end up getting paid $30+ per hour. It is easy to justify because they are rainmakers.

Bingo! My 19 year old runs a Makino cell and two Makino horizontals and he does it well. He can get better spindle utilization (10%+) than guys that have 20 years experience running VMCs because he has been trained in this environment. Would this guy be that valuable if he was running VMCs? Nope. Anyone who has been around cell systems and HMCs knows what +10% spindle utilization is worth. He is a good multi-tasker but not an expert machinist by any means. His skill set is very valuable, to me.

Yep, its paid for several times over by his performance... I'd be crazy NOT to pay him that...

I have a 19 year old machine operator with three years experience making $30/hr. He is good and worth every penny. He got a $12/hr raise a month ago and about fell over . I should add that this guy almost didn't get hired because I didn't have the time to train him. He came to the shop for a week straight (8:00am-5:00pm) during Christmas break on his own time to see how things were done and that is why I went ahead with the hire. That is his approach to most things and it is no accident his pay is where it is. He could be over $100k in a few years...

Back from the dead...

LOL, wasn't an accident. OLDEST POST ON THE FORUM!