Haas 5 axis opinions

[Chris Rizzo]

Chime in with opinions on the Haas 5x trunnion setups. Mostly prototyping aluminum, foam, plastic, etc. Looking at the tr-210. What is the recommended size of machine? vf2 or 3? does it even fit on a vf2?>

 

Cost is a big issue, esp. considering the intermittent use it will see. even though i am not really a haas fan, if the machines are ok enough it would make sense.

[iowajim62]

Ran it on VF-4SS. Need to keep it at 50% rapid if you want it to live as the weight of this unit seems to cause issues with servos,bearings and drive boards. Of 5 units I was involved with 2 of them had the cover start leaking coolant into the RUBBER Drive belt for the rotary axis. Over time the stretch of the belt started affecting positional accuracy.

jm2c

[chris m]

If you are going strictly 5 axis and going to buy a machine I think you'd be better off buying the machine they build where they build the trunnion right into it to save weight and preserve a little more Z clearance. I'd say that a 210 would be too big for a VF-2, the VF-2 5ax machine has a 160 on it. I'd suggest buying one with Harmonic Drives in it, personally; stay away from those belts...

 

I'd be scared with an 800lb trunnion in a 7000lb machine

[Chris Rizzo]

I hear ya. Buying more haas scares me in general.

[kccadcam]

Chris,

you need to come out and see our Matsuura MAM72-63V's

 

These machines are the cat's a$$!!!!

 

I know they are way more than a Haas, but you get what you pay for.....

[HEED]

You need to look at it realistically... He is NOT going to pony up and pay the bux for a matsuura. Don't be an asshat and read the first post. I think that in a proto setup especially if your not cutting 4140 that's 60rc you will be good with a haas setup. They may not be all that great rigidity-wise but for AL and plastic, foam etc. it will be great, especially if you are having to do multiple setups now. Besides, especially when you're green at the whole 5x programming, you're gonna smack it around a bit and 35k will hurt a lot less than whatever a dedicated 5x machine will cost. I think that the haas trunion would be a good setup for you based on information you provided. You can drop them onto your table when you need them, then take it off when you don't.

[HEED]

Oh, p.s. you will need to have brushless drives if you don't already and it's just better to call your Haas Factory Outlet and let them match up the things that you will need according to service records and machine serial no.

[Jrygus]

We have a Vf7 with a TR210 and a VF6 with a TR310. Most often what we want is more y travel. When you kick A over 90, you start running out of travel fast. We mounted the 310 to the front of the VF6 and rotate backwards to get the max y tavel as possible. The VF6 also has the 8" riser on it for Z clearance. We lke being able to take off the tables if we need to have just a 3-axis machine.

[Thad]

quote:

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He is NOT going to pony up and pay the bux for a matsuura. Don't be an asshat and read the first post.

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Lighten up, Francis.

 

Thad

[crazy^millman]

Chris you ever think about a bolt on head??

 

Take a look at this: Tri-Tech It is not for hogging, but for the work you are talking about it might do what you are looking for.

 

HTH

[SydwazShawn]

Hey Chris! We just took delivery on our TR210 yesterday. It will only fit on a VF-3 or bigger, and weighs in at 800 pounds. We wanted the Matsuura 63-V, but 40,000 is a lot different than 700,000 in these times. We figured learn on this and get the work, then buy into the bigger and better machine. It’s so much less overhead when learning.

 

Anyway I just talked to Tim about the Machine def, post, and simulator. I figure I will have it up and running in the next couple of weeks. You are welcome to come over and look at it when it’s up and going.

 

Shawn.

[SydwazShawn]

quote:

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Chris,

you need to come out and see our Matsuura MAM72-63V's

 

These machines are the cat's a$$!!!!

 

I know they are way more than a Haas, but you get what you pay for.....

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Yo!!! Tell Paul that I finally got my 5th axis, so you guys better watch out!!!! I am going to put a Matsuura sticker on it! LoL!

 

Later, Shawn.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

quote:

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...I am going to put a Matsuura sticker on it!

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I'm gonna tell Kyle...

[Kevangel]

I just got a Haas "sale flyer" that said "buy a VMC and we will throw in a rotary table for free- up to 14K value" or something like that...

 

I also got a Hurco flyer for hassle free 5-axis starting at $99,995...they said its a true 5 axis.

 

Spend too much on a machine thats gonna sit some while you learn and it will kill ya. just like smaller shops that "look ahead" and buy a big building thinking they will grow into it...taxes alone kill them every year..

[67 Yankee]

Chris,

 

I would definitely look at a machine built as a 5 axis machine since you know it will have the travels you need and you know everything will work together as a package etc. With the VF5/40TR you can always mount a 6" Kurt vise on the table and use it just like any other three axis mill, so there's no down time waiting to get used to the setup, changing or storing trunnion tables or waiting for the right jobs to come along.

 

Lots of Haas bashing goes on around here but ours have made $$millions for us and have taken their share of abuse (physical and verbal )

[SydwazShawn]

quote:

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I'm gonna tell Kyle...

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Who do you think I am getting the sticker from!!

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

I'm gonna tell him what you're gonna do with it....

 

BTW, Rizzo that's a decent Rotary Table. If you are going to be doing with it what I looked at last time I was in your shop, it should work out fine. I've got a good idea for common workholding for you too if you're interested.

[SydwazShawn]

quote:

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I've got a good idea for common workholding for you too if you're interested.

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Actually since you mentioned it, and not to highjack this thread!! I was looking at how I should hold my parts on this thing. Just for ref. it has an 8 inch platter. I was thinking some sort of universal dovetail system, and I also need a vice system that would be universal as well. So any help would be appreciated.

 

Shawn.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

Stay tuned for some pictures...

[Chris Rizzo]

Thanks much for all the input fellas. Sounds like the haas product would be ok for this application, which is really no particular application at all...prototyping.

 

how is the 160 trunion? As bad as the 160 4th axis?

 

Heck yeah Shawn I'd love to come out and check out your setup (and shoot the breeze in general). Let's keep in touch.

 

On a somewhat related sidebar, we've been converting our 4th axi' to this Big Kaiser Unilock quick change setup. It is absolutely worth is weight in gold, and pretty inexpensive.. I'd be happy to show you it and what I've figured out with it.

 

oh, I did see that Mat. running out at a Selway demo in Wilsonville. That thing looks hella robust. I really like the Matsurra full machine verification setup they had with it.

[MotorCityMinion]

The Big Kaiser link takes me back to the main page at emastercam?

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

How's this look???

 

[Chris Rizzo]

Whoops sorry here is the Unilock link

 

http://www.bigkaiser.com/frm.htm?unlck.htm

 

 

Those are sweet looking little guys James. Do they bolt onto a machine/tombstone or is there a quick connect thingy on the bottom?

[SydwazShawn]

Those look simple and easy to use. Do you use different sizes, for different size material? Also what do you do if you want to throw a part in that’s machined already, and just need to do one side real quick? I think you would need a vice setup also for times when you cant use a dovetail clamp.

 

Oh and Kyle was the one who gave me the idea of the sticker!! He new I wanted a Matsuura really bad.

 

Chris anytime you want to come over would be cool, once we get it up and going. I would really like to stop in at your shop sometime also.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

There's a spud on the bottom. They are designed to bolt straight onto a Matsuura MAM72-35V Pallet but with an adapter plate, they could EASILY mount on another rotary type device.

 

As far as using them for mounting already machined work-pieces... it's not really designed for that. But I've seen them used them for large parts. They are pretty reasonably priced. I believe they are under $500 (don't quote me on that). One edge is fixed, the other is movable. You can remove a part and put it back on and it will repeat within whatever your slot witdth cut is. The clamps are spring loaded and slide in the channel with a very nice slip fit.