This is our New Machine.

[Del.]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rkMBFotrPxo

[Josh Kinney -Elite Engineering]

That's a sweetheart. Can the MT product do B-Axis turning? Or are you going with NX or Esprit?

 

-Josh

[Joe788]

That's a sweetheart. Can the MT product do B-Axis turning? Or are you going with NX or Esprit?

 

-Josh

 

Del is the wire guy. So his only involvement will be the occasional venture out of his little air conditioned fish bowl.

[Del.]

Del is the wire guy. So his only involvement will be the occasional venture out of his little air conditioned fish bowl.

 

 

That's true. LOL

That's a sweetheart. Can the MT product do B-Axis turning? Or are you going with NX or Esprit?

 

-Josh

 

 

I think they are deciding still on what to use Josh. They just set it up last week. I believe that it can do the B-Axis turning from what I was told.

[Del.]

Yes it has BAxis Josh. They went out to California and bought it. Machine has 500 hours on it only.

[Josh Kinney -Elite Engineering]

My question was can the MasterCam MT Product do B Axis turning like the video. I know the other packages can.

 

-Josh

[Del.]

My question was can the MasterCam MT Product do B Axis turning like the video. I know the other packages can.

 

-Josh

 

 

Sorry Josh, I misunderstood the question. I know our reseller came in to discuss it and that they are looking at other packages to run it other than MC. In other words I really don't know yet.

[mig]

are you going to program this babe by MC?

[Del.]

are you going to program this babe by MC?

 

 

 

I was just told they are most likely going to use Esprit since it's ready to roll right now.

[jeff]

Sweet machine!

[Chris Rizzo]

Wow. Find out what they used to program that demo. That's what ya get.

 

Also ask if it comes with the speakers and soundtrack

[Watcher]

My question was can the MasterCam MT Product do B Axis turning like the video. I know the other packages can.

 

-Josh

 

MT in Mastercam cannot output for continuous B-Axis turning yet. They think it will be a future functionality.

 

I heard this from a big fish from CNC Software not so long ago.

[crazy^millman]

I can confirm right now B axis Turning is not in the MT product as of yet, but I could program that part all day long in Mastercam MT. The B axis turning was not needed on the part IMHO, but I know how to achieve a B axis turning toolpath using Mastercam currently.

 

Nice Looking Machine and be cool to program parts for that. Del if they have some projects they would like some outside help on I would be glad to look at them.

[Watcher]

I know how to achieve a B axis turning toolpath using Mastercam currently.

 

Just curious - Would that be:

 

A: Program a turning toolpath using the center of the insert as control point and add angles using canned text or something similar (Collision checking is usually turned off if the back angle interferes with the profile)

B: A 5 axis curve toolpath with the output set to 4 axis and the tool as a ball mill with the control point in the center of the ball (This is a point-to-point toolpath and CUTCOM can't be used)

C: A variation of the above?

 

Either way, manual edits will be necessary I guess.

[Watcher]

I was just told they are most likely going to use Esprit since it's ready to roll right now.

 

ESPRIT owns the MTM market. They're were smart detecting this trend 14 years ago.

[Watcher]

Some examples of native functionality to program a MTM machine:

 

Nice moments: 2'10",2'50",3'40",4'30",6'10" and U-Axis programming at 7'10" (Someone asked me here about U-Axis on a WFL a few days ago - This is how we program them)

 

This video was presented to me at EMO 2011, when I made my decision for a new system. It comes from the company who sold us the post.

 

Better watched in HD!

 

http://youtu.be/mhGWHlKfHXg

[Newbeeee™]

Very cool Daniel. Makes the stuff we make look like 1st grade work!

[Watcher]

Very cool Daniel. Makes the stuff we make look like 1st grade work!

 

Not at all. I admire a lot of things you guys do with the tools you've got and very often I port the solutions I see here to the systems I work with. The problems are the same everywhere, just in different addresses...

 

Software is merely a tool, the brain is what makes a good job. But of course it's easier to program a CTX or a WFL machine if you have a software that is tailored to them. Mastercam MT is the first step towards this, but it needs a lot more mileage since it entered in the game a bit late I'm afraid.

 

Competitivity is something you lose a bit everyday, and you have to replace it everyday too in order to survive and profit.

[Del.]

I wonder why MC is so far behind on a state of the art machine. It has to be costing them new seats . I suspect we will probably end maintenance on MC.

[Guest]

My question was can the MasterCam MT Product do B Axis turning like the video. I know the other packages can.

 

-Josh

No... But, curve 5-Axis code can be hand edited to do it.

[Guest]

I wonder why MC is so far behind on a state of the art machine. It has to be costing them new seats . I suspect we will probably end maintenance on MC.

Delay to market has cost millions in revenue.

[MIL-TFP-41]

No... But, curve 5-Axis code can be hand edited to do it.

 

Too bad Mcam is so far behind....at MANY places hand edits are a no no....making this a deal breaker. The big time cheat to get around the no-hand edit, "post & go" would be to post out your curve 5ax, hand edit, manual entry, ect. Very cheesy at best. Soon I see Mcam with this functionality, albeit many years too late.

[Joe788]

It's easy to look at the mill-turn market segment and say, "WTF were these guys thinking? How could they not see this coming?" But my guess is that it was a more calculated move, that simply ended up biting a little worse than they expected.

 

The B axis machine class comes with a virtually infinite number of machine configurations, builder specific codes, builder specific capabilities, etc. I don't really blame them for chasing the low hanging fruit.

[Newbeeee™]

Talking over the pond here, this is how I see the market.

The VAST majority of subbies (job shops) are 3axis (milling) and 2axis (turning).

Some of these with indexers/nc 4ths (milling) and C (driven tool) on a lathe.

 

You then go up a notch of company who then has a 5axis (bolt on table), and perhaps a cy lathe or small integrex.

 

Then up again for a hori twin pallet.

 

To get to a company with a hori pallet pool and to have large integrex's or large mill-turn (as in cy) is usually an OEM, or a high level integrator to the big boys (say airbus or boeing).

 

So I can understand why CNC may have concentrated on the 'main' market, rather than mill-turn.

If you have a Mazak, you have integral verification within mazatrol. And there must be more Integrex's out there than anything else?

If you have a Siemens, same again with Shopturn.

So it's only machines with Fanuc's that require verification I would have thought, which then narrows the market even more?

[Watcher]

...at MANY places hand edits are a no no....

 

The main problem with B-Axis turning in systems that do not support it is not the workaround with 5 axis curve, which is smelly IMHO but possible. (Although I believe you should not have to own a 5 axis seat to program a lathe operation) - This approach renders tiny point-to-point moves on arcs that cause accel/de-accel issues in the B axis unit, thus causing poor surface finish and even dimensional problems depending on what you need to do. Let alone the fact that CUTCOM does not work because of the tiny point-to-point moves and you have to preset the turning insert in the center of the nose radius rather than in its tangencies.

 

The main issue IMHO is the lack of realistic simulation for the turning tool holder, which is greatly exposed to interference with the part in these operations, specially in grooves. Some workarounds are possible in systems that allow you to use 3D models from tool vendors as your tool geometry, but in the end, it's more and more workarounds... it can take a serious time to circumvent all limitations, if possible.

 

We dropped Pro/NC not because something was not possible or workaroundable, but because we realized we were spending more time circumventing things than doing parts.