Okuma and Productivity Plus

[oneyankfan1]

Is anyone using the productivity plus module on an Okuma horizontal with the new OSP-300M THINC control? For that matter on any Okuma horizontal?

[YoDoug®]

I do not use the Productivity Plus module in MCX, but I do use the standalone Productivity plus on Okuma mills often, horizontals and vertical. 

[Colin Gilchrist]

Does P+ now support Horizontal Programming in Mastercam? From what I remember, it was only supported on VMC machines. They may have updated the module (finally!) to support HMC machines, but I would be hesitant until I saw it working in person...

[Matthew Hajicek - Singularity]

It does.  I was using it successfully on Kitamura horizontals a few months ago.

[Colin Gilchrist]

It does.  I was using it successfully on Kitamura horizontals a few months ago.

 

Thanks Matt. That's good to know.

 

FWIW, Prod+ has come a long way. I know they've been working on getting true Associativity to work for a while. Hopefully the new team in place for Prod+ Development will be able to accelerate the pace of development. I know they have spent years crawling along, so I think this is a good thing...

[Aaron Eberhard]

Yes, there are customers out there running this exact config.  We also have people down at the THINC center (Okuma's USA corporate HQ) in Charlotte running it, so their AEs are getting better with it as well.

Cheers,

[crazy^millman]

Verisurf has had it all along. One day maybe it will get all linked together and people will see how much having MBD probing as part of the CAM package with the ability to communicate back to the model inside of the CAM is really worth. Until then I will keep beating the drum that seems silent, but many keep wanting to hear.

 

Thanks for setting the record straight Aaron.

 

Edit the software I was talking about. Been using Vericut so much I am getting them confused.

Edited February 18, 2016 by 5th Axis Consulting

[Mick]

Vericut has had it all along. One day maybe it will get all linked together and people will see how much having MBD probing as part of the CAM package with the ability to communicate back to the model inside of the CAM is really worth. Until then I will keep beating the drum that seems silent, but many keep wanting to hear.

 

Thanks for setting the record straight Aaron.

 

 

I'm just getting into the usage of it in Vericut. It seems very capable

[obeginski]

We are currently having some issues with the productivity plus add on and our OSP controller. Basically, I have WCS as left side, tool plane as left side, so its a basic 2d probe cycle; but because its not in the top WCS, the RenMF file needs to show the machine kennematics as a 5axis machine. Our Mastercam dealer blames Renishaw, and Renishaw is blaming MAstercam. I have edited the posted program to run on the machine, and its 99% there, but having to edit it back from a mutiaxsis path seems a little annoying. Anyone have any suggestions besides going back 10 years and making a new file for every side of the part so they are all in the TOP WCS?

[crazy^millman]

We are currently having some issues with the productivity plus add on and our OSP controller. Basically, I have WCS as left side, tool plane as left side, so its a basic 2d probe cycle; but because its not in the top WCS, the RenMF file needs to show the machine kennematics as a 5axis machine. Our Mastercam dealer blames Renishaw, and Renishaw is blaming MAstercam. I have edited the posted program to run on the machine, and its 99% there, but having to edit it back from a mutiaxsis path seems a little annoying. Anyone have any suggestions besides going back 10 years and making a new file for every side of the part so they are all in the TOP WCS?

Yes it will be a blame game. Renishaw makes a competitive product to the product that offer to CAM companies. Why would they make it better for the CAM when they have their own product done that does everything a customer needs? The whole selling to CAM is just a lead generator. Get customers interested in their product and only develop it enough to peak interest and then up sell their product. Had they gone with Verisurf who specializes in inspection inside of Mastercam then a closer more customer focused product would already be on the market that would have blown anything Renishaw and Hexagon has away. Now you see the end result of working with a company that has a stake in other CAM companies that compete with Mastercam have to offer. Hopefully one day CNC Software and Verisurf will get a good relationship with this finally all developed.

 

The way Verisurf works with Mastercam is truly a mind changing method to approach today's manufacturing. The ability to program items to inspect right to the model you are programming inside of the operations manager using Verisurf not done in the operations manager using Renishaw. Have the ability to see the deviations of the manufcatured model on the screen inside of the Mastercam file again not something done with Renishaw. The ability to make 3D GD&T in the operations manager and have the inspection routine understand it and apply it to the inspection routine not something Renishaw does. The ability to read 3D GD&T or MBD(Model Based Definition) from some CAD files again not something Renishaw can do in Mastercam that Verisurf can. Verisurf saw where this was going years ago, but since they are not Renishaw not given as much attention. If more and more in this industry would push and drive this direction it would already be here. I still say for any company using Mastercam to program parts Verisurf is the best compliment to drive their Manufcaturing process. It closes the loop and gives visibility in ways along with comminucating information nothing else can do that is so integrated. When the two companies will finally work more closely together to bring it all together I don't know, but when they do everyone else in the industry better and will take notice. Many have been trying to prefect what they already have and hopefully someone else doesn't get it done before they do. I have been beating this drum for years and funny my tune is still the same as it was years ago. The more like yourself that start making the same tune maybe the more it will be understood this needs to be the method. Until then I will just keep doing what I can to better the industry.

[Mark Baker CNC Software]

Anyone have any suggestions besides going back 10 years and making a new file for every side of the part so they are all in the TOP WCS?

 

I do have a work around so you don't have to have your geometry in the "Top" plane. The only down side is that backplot won't be in the correct position.

 

I'll try to add the video clip, right now its to big to post

 

Mark Baker

Edited April 28, 2016 by Mark Baker CNC Software

[Mark Baker CNC Software]

https://youtu.be/6TZ6KT5YEeo

[oneyankfan1]

We are currently having some issues with the productivity plus add on and our OSP controller. Basically, I have WCS as left side, tool plane as left side, so its a basic 2d probe cycle; but because its not in the top WCS, the RenMF file needs to show the machine kennematics as a 5axis machine. Our Mastercam dealer blames Renishaw, and Renishaw is blaming MAstercam. I have edited the posted program to run on the machine, and its 99% there, but having to edit it back from a mutiaxsis path seems a little annoying. Anyone have any suggestions besides going back 10 years and making a new file for every side of the part so they are all in the TOP WCS?

I have been working on this exact problem with CNC Software, Renishaw, my reseller, and our Okuma apps guy for like 6 months now. We have two MB 5000 H machine centers hooked to a Fastems. Right now we have the productivity plus module, but we arent using it because of the WCS association problem.

The post I have works for g code perfectly, its basicly a standard 4 axis post tweeked to an okuma, and you program it the same way as the stock post, with the rotation axis of the tombstone aligned with the z axis in the "TOP" view and then the rotations are handled with WCS that I create anywhere I choose. I use H1 - H48 on one of the parts I currently run. They are castings and we do 24 parts at a time, and each part has 2ea. probed offsets. Not all parts use this many offsets but there are often multiple offsets on each project.

I am currently long handing my probing cycles using the okuma code. I go into mastercam and create a wcs that represents the location of G15 H0 (machine home) and create points at locations on the model that I am trying to reference in the okuma code, analyze the location of that point relevant to the G15 H0 wcs and use those values (x,y,z) as an offset to drive the okuma probing cycle. I which takes a long time and some back and forth on the machine. Not to mention it just sucks.

I have worked with Steve Kerr at Renishaw in conjunction with our resller and CNC. Your right, it is a big blame game. 

I have wondered if it was the renmf file, but it looks pretty straight forward, as to how they work together - the post and the renmf - well........ Thats about how good CNC and Renishaw currently work together. 

Partners in Thinc in Charlotte swear up and down they are doing it, but of course they arent in a big hurry to send that post and renmf to me, if it indeed works and they arent using something else.

I do know Im at my wits end with this whole thing, I am in the middle of one last ditch effort with Reece from QTE, who has been great as I drag him through the trench with me. 

[crazy^millman]

I have been working on this exact problem with CNC Software, Renishaw, my reseller, and our Okuma apps guy for like 6 months now. We have two MB 5000 H machine centers hooked to a Fastems. Right now we have the productivity plus module, but we arent using it because of the WCS association problem.

The post I have works for g code perfectly, its basicly a standard 4 axis post tweeked to an okuma, and you program it the same way as the stock post, with the rotation axis of the tombstone aligned with the z axis in the "TOP" view and then the rotations are handled with WCS that I create anywhere I choose. I use H1 - H48 on one of the parts I currently run. They are castings and we do 24 parts at a time, and each part has 2ea. probed offsets. Not all parts use this many offsets but there are often multiple offsets on each project.

I am currently long handing my probing cycles using the okuma code. I go into mastercam and create a wcs that represents the location of G15 H0 (machine home) and create points at locations on the model that I am trying to reference in the okuma code, analyze the location of that point relevant to the G15 H0 wcs and use those values (x,y,z) as an offset to drive the okuma probing cycle. I which takes a long time and some back and forth on the machine. Not to mention it just sucks.

I have worked with Steve Kerr at Renishaw in conjunction with our resller and CNC. Your right, it is a big blame game. 

I have wondered if it was the renmf file, but it looks pretty straight forward, as to how they work together - the post and the renmf - well........ Thats about how good CNC and Renishaw currently work together. 

Partners in Thinc in Charlotte swear up and down they are doing it, but of course they arent in a big hurry to send that post and renmf to me, if it indeed works and they arent using something else.

I do know Im at my wits end with this whole thing, I am in the middle of one last ditch effort with Reece from QTE, who has been great as I drag him through the trench with me. 

 

Have you looked at doing this old school with Drill Cycles? I know QTE has a excellent group of people and Reece is a great resource. We were programming machines like this and doing some very facny stuff over 10 years ago using what was already in the software. In your case maybe going backwards will help you go forward. Shoot me and email and I will send Reece one with the post that has all of this logic done and sorted out for Fanuc. Will take a little bit of work sorting it out for the Okuma, but not that much.