O/T Cimitron e 5.02

[mold100]

Well as much as I tried dodging it I started Cimitron Training Saturday, I sorta underestimated it I want to know if anyone else uses it it what are your thoughts?

 

Iskander-I seen Plastiv on there website is that where you are/or were?Bottle manufacturer in Isreal.I think youver mentioned Cimitron Before.

 

Sorry to bring this up but I am curious.

[Rekd™]

It's very powerful. Great for trodes and mold work. Support sux. Posts sux even more because you have to depend on their guys to modify them. (This may have changed in the last few years since I've used it) But the salesmen are pretty ladies.

 

'Rekd

[mold100]

90% of what I do is mold and electrode work, Its

quick electrode feature is far better than any other extraction method I have used.2d looks pretty lame, prolly stick with our surfscam for that. Do you use it Matt?

[Rekd™]

Not currently. I used it a few years ago, for about a year. Was doing trodes/moldbase stuff. Never did any 2d stuff, but it did look lame in that department.

 

'Rekd

[Fig sign]

Corey .

Plastiv are not us .

But we have Cimatron too ,on every computer in production except one (guess who has not ).

This is very powerful program having it`s own good points and wishing to work on it I would have better job possibilities here ,especially in mold production .

My problem that I don`t like it ,nor Cimatron It ,nor Elite .

I like Mastercam ,and if I am still here ,this expains something ,I hope .

I think Cimatron can have a great future and may become the real competitor to the Mastercam ,but not now !

Not yet .

 

BTW ,Corey ,what are your first impressions from

their hybrid modeling ?

 

Teh renegade .

[kwolf]

quote:

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BTW ,Corey ,what are your first impressions from

their hybrid modeling ?

---

They have Hybrid modeling? Like VX Vision or ThinkDesign ?

[Anbu Lingappan - Moldplus SA]

Hi

 

Could you let me know what exactly you like about the Electrode extraction from Cimatron and their tools?

 

You can email me that information with images etc. if that helps to explain the details clearly.

 

We develop Moldplus for Mastercam and are in the process of completing a new version with improved tools for electrode extraction, insertion, copying, transforming, etc. and new electrode extensions that are an industry first with the options there.

 

If you are a current Moldplus Electrode customer and would like to start testing the new version and tools, please let me know by email.

 

Thanks in advance!

 

Anbu

[Fig sign]

quote:

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They have Hybrid modeling?

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Their modeler based on ACIS ,not Parasolid .

They changed it drastically ,

There understanding of hybrid modelling is this one :

You are working with sheet (**** ) solids ,when they are closed Cimatron works with this closed volume as a regular solid .

It has a lot of bugs currently ,but a lot of ppl like it .

I not .

But this approach may have a big future ,it helps to new ,not experienced users to work with 3d stuff ,not really understanding ,what they are doing .

I don`t want to critisize them ,they are developing fast enough ,but I think Mastercam is moving fast too and I hope that X version will

exceed any possible imagination .

We`ll see .

[Fig sign]

Anbu !

 

Check your e-mail ,please .

 

I think if your new electrode add-on will have an option to make good ,closed negative offseted model it will simply rule the market .

You know about negative offset limitation of Mastercam ,Cimatron and others (you can not mill with surface toolpath with a corner radius less then surface offset ).

This limitation I can overcome ,but it takes time and there is no existing simple solution .

What is your point of view ?!?

 

Iskander hijacking a thread

[Salahuddin]

Cimatron is harder to use than Mastercam

it took lot of time to learn it

spliting core and cavity for complev parts is very nice, but moldplus make the trik too.

nice to hear that there is new version for Moldplus

[kwolf]

Thanks Iskandar ,

 

Is it possible "to do boolean operation(union/subtract/common) between a surface(sheet) and a solid" in Cimatron-E? I saw it in VX and TD and imo it's very nice and handy as well as time saver.

 

But I've never heard a Parasolid nor an ACIS based CAD can do that. Could it be that the kernels incapable? Or maybe no CAD maker including MC/SW sees any real advantage?

[kwolf]

Oh yeah and I forgot to say Quick Reply's cool.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

Highbrid (sic).

 

All this is, is a buzzword meaning different things to different people. What it means to me and many others is that you can use wireframe, surfaces and solids together in the same model to accomplish the task. Be it modeling, machining, etc...

 

JM2C

[kwolf]

So in this case virtually any CAD is a hybrid modeler, isn't it ?

[Fig sign]

James .

Cimatron Hybrid modeller (spec ) idea is different .

There are no surfaces or solids ,there are something ,that behaves as both of them (at least ,they try to present this so ).

As I said before there are no surfaces in Cimatron E.

quote:

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Is it possible "to do boolean operation(union/subtract/common) between a surface(sheet) and a solid" in Cimatron-E? I saw it in VX and TD and imo it's very nice and handy as well as time saver.

 

But I've never heard a Parasolid nor an ACIS based CAD can do that. Could it be that the kernels incapable? Or maybe no CAD maker including MC/SW sees any real advantage?

---

Who told tyou Parasolid- based Mastercom can not cut solid with surface.

There are some limitations ,but they exists for every 3d Cad-Cam

[kwolf]

quote:

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There are no surfaces or solids ,there are something ,that behaves as both of them (at least ,they try to present this so ).

---

Exactly, in TD or VX a surface is a solid with infinite material on one of its side. So you can do any possible solid operation (fillet, shell...) as well as surface special operations. I hope next versions of MC support it.

 

And thanks for letting me know that this is the case in Cimatron-E too.

 

[ 03-02-2004, 06:36 PM: Message edited by: kwolf ]

[Phil Orenstein]

While on the subject of eletrode extraction I thought I would ask out of curiosity about Cimitron's comparable capabilities in this regard. Having used the electrode extraction capabilities in MC Solids I can find none that surpasses it in my mind. I love the superb method of removing faces, creating sheet solids, then boolean subtraction to produce disjoint non-associatice "bricks" as they're called, to create the electrode. All this before even touching Moldplus!

 

Phil

[Fig sign]

I would stay aware from the discussion of both programs weak points .

 

I like Mastercam more ,and that`s enough .

I do not wish no harm to both software vendors

[mold100]

I like the feature Cimatron offers it is similar to the way you pull trodes in MC Solids, and I used moldplus Version 7 or 8 and it was also a good product, but here is my main dilema, I no longer work in a Mastercam enviroment, however of the Numerous CAM packages I have tried Mastercam by far is my prefered seat choice but where I work I am forced to use Cimitron now, my only other option is Surfcam 2001 and that sucks bad.

 

Back to cimitrons electrode feature, it allows you to manipulate more options than MC especially for cclearing details and extensions , but I

still like MC solids because it doesnt get much easier than that.The tool and target body method.

[Phil Orenstein]

That's what I was driving at. The ease at which you can extract electrodes using Mastercams sheet solid method. It's a snap!

 

Phil

[Anbu Lingappan - Moldplus SA]

Hi

 

A few quick comments:

 

Creating electrodes with negative offsets taken into consideration is not an easy task - especially on surface models! We will review this again in the future when we enter fully into the world of Solids. Currently there are other tools that are more important that we need to provide. Since you can apply negative machining stock using Mastercam, that is the best and proven method for now.

 

We have additonal extension options for electrode extensions now. I will detail this more later.

 

Creating extensions to extracted electrode geometry is important to build strong electrodes. Moldplus offers those tools and a lot more to get your electrode projects done.

 

In the last installation of Moldplus, we have included a DLL (ELECTOUT.DLL) that will output the burn-hole locations, angles, comments, etc. to generate an NC program that contains this data. You can then load this file to your electrode burning machine (ones with a CNC controller) and not have to enter this data manually. You will need to ensure that you have a post processor customized for these machines.

 

Thanks again for your comments on the products. We will continue to improve our solution.

 

Regards

 

Anbu

[Teh Bear without Brains kinda idiot]

Anbu !

 

Creating models offseted in negative direction in Mastercam is not trivial ,not easy and SOMETIMES very time consuming task !

I know that the task is not easy ,but ...

Please consider about it once more .

[mold100]

Why neg offset geometry????????

[Teh Bear without Brains kinda idiot]

Because you can not mill surface toolpathes with surface offset negative greater then corner radius !

Most drastic example is an end mill without corner radius ,you can not mill any surface offset negative .

All models for electrodes must be milled with surface offset negative to the spark value .

HTH

[mold100]

Oh boy youve been dupped IMO.There are several ways to handle this with exellent results it has been well covered, try some searches.