mutiple toolpath groups in one file

[chipman]

For years I have have always made one MCX file for each Tool Plane, but am considering trying to keep all operations in one file.

 

I am just curious how some of you organize your toolpaths within your file, more specifically working with many Tool Planes (i.e. all six sides of a block)each Tool Planes having its own set of operations and not having conflicting tool numbers,tool libraries, conflicting stock sizes for verify,posting problems etc.

 

 

Is there a way to lock the tool plane, stock sizes,tools for each toolpath group?

 

Thanks

Chipman

[Guest John Paris @ Services 4 Automati]

quote:

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Is there a way to lock the tool plane, stock sizes,tools for each toolpath group?

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Place each toolpath group in it's own Machine group and you'll have all the control you are looking to have.

[chipman]

I have tried this and noticed that when having a tool# 1 in one machine group and then adding a tool#1 to the second machine group it warns me that there already is a tool# 1, but in fact there is not a tool# 1 in the second machine.

 

 

Chipman

[?Mark]

...and if you created all your geometry and toolpaths correctly in according planes, your stock needs to be defined only in the first machine group...

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

I create one Machine Group for my part, using a seperate Toolpath Group for each Machining Operation (i.e. OP01, OP02, OP03, etc...), then another Machine Group for Workholding/Fixturing Programming. I've kept EVERYTHING in one file for eons. I believe it is a far superior way to keep things organized. The biggest reason being if I make a change to an early operation in a part, how will i taffect the downstream operations. Now, because sometimes Mastercam's Transform Ops is hideously slow, then and only then would I create a seperate file. But I sill have everything in the same locatinos so that I can verify and check downstream changes.

 

HTH

[MLS]

+1 to Apps Guy

 

One Machine group, Toolpath group for each operation.

 

As far as Identifying planes:

 

I still think it WOULD be neat to segregate the viewing so you can have tool-planes underneath and relative to a specific WCS. Until that day comes(if ever) it appears they are sorted in the view manager in the order they are created. I will name my WCS Position #1 Position #2 etc. Then name specific tool planes Right P#1 or KellerClosedAngle P#2 so I can keep track of them.

[Guest John Paris @ Services 4 Automati]

OK, I'll bite

 

From reading I "assume" you are setting everything up under one post procesoor, since that is comtrlled through th emachine group.

 

If all ops are under one machine group but seperate toolpath groups, how do you handle different ops being done on different machine? and not affecting operations that perhaps can not be done on that machine?

 

Meh thinks I am missing something here.

 

[TS53]

I also use 1 machine group and multiple tool groups, sometimes nesting 2-3 levels deep.

 

I would on occasion like to be able to create a 2nd machine group with the ability to copy tools between machine groups. for example: I will have similar parts. On the 2nd part, I need to replace 3-4 of the tools from the 1st part, leaving 20-25 tools without change. If I could simply drag the entire tool list from machine 1 into machine 2, then simply replace the 3-4 tools, it would allieve some of the confusion of having 2 or 3 different tools identified as T1

My 2 cents

[doyleg]

TS53 Use the tool manager under the toolpaths button (at the bottom).You can choose a tool list from one pgm and import it to your current file. Then you can change whatever you want. You can also have them stay the same # if you select "search tool library when entering a tool number" in your tool settings. Then after you have that done go back into tool settings and turn off the "search '''''" switch.

[MLS]

John,

 

I forget about that piece since I never use it.

 

I output NCI or APT from Mastercam. Process the NCI with Austin NC which outputs the different flavors for the different machines. Process the APT with Machine specific posts supplied by the machine vendors.

 

I leave the Machine Wide open, no limitations and IF I need to post with another post for a different APT flavor, I have both in the control def and toggle them.

 

If I have duplicate tool #'s for different machines standard lists, I just load both and pick the correct one based on my F&S or cutter message.

 

We have 8 different kinds of 5-axis machines and it is impractical to switch things in Mastercam everytime we need to move the job from one machine to another. Now, I can output NCI and process it for 6 different machines at one time and get 6 programs machine specific. If I program something for 30000 RPM and then it moves to a 10000 RPM machine, the post detects the max exceeded and adjusts the speeds and feeds accordingly to accomodate.

 

The other two are the ones that require APT. Not as easy, but pretty close.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

quote:

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...If all ops are under one machine group but seperate toolpath groups, how do you handle different ops being done on different machine? and not affecting operations that perhaps can not be done on that machine?

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Ok, I'll bite on that one...

 

Create another Machine Group, use Transform toolpath to make a change to another machine if necessary.

[?Mark]

James,

I'm with John on this one, because that's what I found to be more convenient so far: separate machine group for separate setup/operation (nice and neat).

 

But I'm all ears here for other points of view.

Are you using separate sub-groups for separate setups? I'm leaning more towards using them for grouping separate tools, so if there is a need for transforming or sub programs it's easier that way. I know you can go few levels deep, but then when I go around switching between them too fast mc will just freeze, so I try to avoid it.

[jeff]

quote:

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I've kept EVERYTHING in one file for eons.

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Yup, what James said.

Although I have V9 I keep ops on different levels.

Someday I will master the art of different planes,but teaching myself has it's cons.

One file to rule them all.

[Ployd]

quote:

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One file to rule them all.

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That's finger lickin' funny!

 

We just use multiple Toolpath Groups as well, but beware of the red arrow. It will move on you if you don't watch it closely. Then you'll be creating toolpaths in the wrong group!

[crazy^millman]

I use toolgroups from one machine all the time with no problem. I will have my fixtures and my operations for the part with no problem. I will howver make sure I save my tool to my library if I need them for the other operation groups. You can also create sub groups inside of a main group of you like.

 

The biggest things in to make sure you right click on the machine to get main groups inside of that machine. Here is an example:

 

 

[?Mark]

One mcx file per job here as well, but still think using separate machine groups in an op manager for different ops/setups makes for a cleaner looking file.

Ron, I see what you're doing above (I've done it before), but how do you deal with multiple tools with the same number? (tool #1 in op #1 could be a face mill, but in op#2 it could be a plunger and so on...)

I you have a bunch of separate ops/setups for a single part the tool list gets crowded pretty fast and it can get messy. I'd say that's probably number one reason for using separate machine groups.

Having said that however, if you're using the same tools in separate ops/setups with the same tool numbers could be a major time saver.

I'm not saying one way is better than the other, just trying to figure out if I'm missing something here

[chipman]

The problem I see is exactly as Mark B has stated how do some of you deal with the multiple tools in the file? I always get the error "TOOL NUMBER ALREADY USED 4 #4 1/4 BALL" when adding another tool in a different set of ops. I also see that sometimes when going back and adding an op in an existing group of ops The tool library in the operations list the proper tool used in that set of op, but when you go to the tool manager you better make sure to select the proper machine from the little tab in the upper left hand corner if you want to add tools to that particular set of operations,(it seems that they are in alphabetical order and it will default to the first machine)I found myself adding tools to a different set of ops, I've tried clicking on the machine fist then adding a new operation, but it still defaults to the tools of the machine first in alphabetical order. Anyone know a way around that, where it could always default to the library of tool of that machine def.

 

 

Chipman

 

[ 09-14-2007, 11:44 AM: Message edited by: chipman ]

[crazy^millman]

I guess it really boils down to what you are comfortable with. I can have 4 number one tools it does not bother me at all. On the Integrex I may use the same tool 1 4 different ways or 6 different ways so by limiting myself to thinking I needed to have everything as only one tool number in my library would really hamper me with that regard. I can just keep track in my head if I got 70 tools or if I got 10 tools I can remember them all and their speeds and feeds and for what group they are for with no problem, but that is just what I have got use to.

[MLS]

+1 Ron

 

We have standard tool lists for a few different machines and it is common to have 2 or 3 tool #20's or #16's...etc. Sometimes they are the exact same tool except for holder differences or speeds/feeds.

 

Mastercam does warn you, but you can create them anyway. Just need to make sure you pick the correct tool for the correct toolpath on the correct operation. Not a big deal when it becomes habit.