Question about the Raptor Workholding fixtures

[DavidSV]

I am trying to get a sense of the rigidity when mounting a large piece of material in a Raptor clamp. I thinking about retrofitting a 5th axis onto my horizontal mill to hold a part and let me eliminate a few operations. I would be holding onto a 11x8.5x3" piece of aluminum and was going to try to hold it with a RWP-006 clamp. Do any of you guys with experience with the Raptors have any thoughts on this? Maybe a picture of some larger parts mounted with them and opinions on the rigidity of the setup?

 

Thanks

David

[crazy^millman]

David cannot say about the raptor, but I have done a 10" x 6" x 8" Part just using a 2.5" dia dovetail on the Integrex and pushed it as hard as I want to. Might need to use more than one maybe do a 3 place holding to maximize holding?? I can't say I agree with their Slogan though never build another fixture really?

[Brando]

the 006 model is made of aluminum, i would not trust its longevity, if there is a steel model available i would get that one or just make one yourself, but ive built similar fixtures utilizing a dovetail and there is never really a issue with rigidity, and i have made similar sized parts (assuming you gripping in the 3in width and the 11" dim is hanging out of the vise) i have mounted them in the center of the horizontal table and attacking them from multiple angles with aggressive feeds and depths of cut with minimal chatter

 

as far as the retrofit 5th axis, im not entirely sure of that one, but youd think that having the b axis table only supported at one end and adding the 5th to a machine that was not originally designed for one, it would not be a smart move if rigidity is a concern

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

I use them and specify them often. Not for everything, but I've neer had one let go of a part, EVER!

 

I'm doing a couple of part run-offs right now in stainless. One part I am putting on a 001, and the other I am putting on a 002SS. There's only 2 dovetail style vises i use or specify on the market, Raptor Workholding and Techni-Grip.

 

One of them I will be turning with, maybe both.

 

I'll take some video and put it up this week.

 

JM2C

[Joe788]

I'd say the RWP-006 is too actually too much dovetail. Not that there's such a thing as too much grip or rigidity, but if you think you'll want to use it on other smaller parts in the future, you'll be happier with the RWP-001.

 

I've done 12x6x2 in and RWP-002 (.750 dovetail)

 

If you're wondering what a 2.5 inch dovetail can do:

 

 

[MLS]

Have a couple RWP-001SS for a couple years on one of our cells and ran countless parts(alum) without issue. The 006 should handle that size. We have gone considerable larger than the recommended size with the -001.

 

Just make sure you hit your prep size tolerances and the rigidity is quite good in our experience. Have yet to cut Ti or stainless but aluminum is no problem.

[Hardmill]

Raptors are great tools

Ive also used Lang, a bit pricey they they kick @ss as well

http://www.lang-technik.de/en/artikel/gruppen/51107.makro-grip-zentrierspanner.html

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

PEACE

[MLS]

I was looking at those Hardmill a while back.

Do you have the hydraulic stamper thing or just chuck up the raw stock and clamp them down?

[crazy^millman]

Steve, I have always wanted to try them out they look sweet and you do not have to prep the material before hand.

[Hardmill]

I was looking at those Hardmill a while back.

Do you have the hydraulic stamper thing or just chuck up the raw stock and clamp them down?

 

Yeah they had the stamping unit to "coin" the stock.

 

 

Steve, I have always wanted to try them out they look sweet and you do not have to prep the material before hand.

 

That was the cool part, no prep, just saw cut and coin.

Bad@ss system

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

PEACE

[DavidSV]

Thanks for the replies guys. What I am trying to do is hold the part in the center of the 8x11 area so I can mill all the features into the face at several angles and then mill a bunch of pockets and holes around the outside of the part, some at weird angles. I am trying to take the part from a 6-8 setup job down to a 2 setup job. We have a contract on these parts where we have to deliver 30 parts a month for a year. There is a 2nd part that is the same, but different that I am going to run in the same setup. I am basically just using the 5th axis to do some 3+2 milling, no true 5 axis moves.

 

Thanks

[?Mark]

We use a lot of Raptor 1.5" fixtures. They work great, but not as strong in a cross axis as many think. The little "clocking" pin sits on top of the face and is held with a wimpy little screw so if you put any significant pressure along the dovetail axis hoping to use this locator as a stop you're in for a surprise...

We actually modified it and machined c'bores in which that locator now sits. It helped, but I'm backing off on the feedrate of my drills now...

 

That Makro-grip looks sweet...

[silky_johnson]

Not sure about Raptor, but I've used this alternative with really good success.

 

http://5axisfixtures.com/

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

^^^

 

I wouldn't use theirs. They directly copied Raptors at a trade show, then showed up a month later with "their" workholding solution. Sleazy.

 

 

[cincy k]

Shh, don't tell anyone but I've got a -002 aluminum one on a fourth on my VMC and have fixtured an aluminum block 6x8x10 on it with no tail stock or end support. The dovetail was cut on the 6x10 face. No problem.

[DavidSV]

Seems like a huge piece for such a small hold Cincy. How much cutting are you doing on that part?

 

Thanks

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

It's one thing to see something somewhere, replicate it for your own in-house use, and entirely another to see it, replicate it and SELL it as your own. Here in the states it's called patent infringement.

 

Just sayin'

[specv]

I actually like the 5th axis design better. I wouldn't call it a direct copy at all.

[silky_johnson]

^^^

 

I wouldn't use theirs. They directly copied Raptors at a trade show, then showed up a month later with "their" workholding solution. Sleazy.

 

 

Happens all the time in this industry. That's why Fanuc has TCP now.

 

I've seen people use dovetails for years, way before Raptor.

 

I'm guessing 5th used/saw the Raptor design, liked it, and thought they could do better based on specific experience. Who knows/cares at this point, it's just an alternative.

[cincy k]

Yeah big piece. Finished part weighed about 1/10 of its starting weight. About a fifteen hour part by the time I got done. A bunch of surfacing work. Just start your programming furthest from the RWP holder and work your way back towards it. That definitely helps a ton.