fillet surface to surface

[guitar]

It´s not fair to compare NX CAD with MC CAD...

 

You are correct. This is the reason I have almost, completely stopped using MC for cad. Between MC's inability to do simple tasks, it's bugs, and it's need to constantly be rebooted to accomplish simple things such as copy and pasting, I have no longer found MC CAD to be a useful tool. Yup, it's not fair at all.

[Watcher]

You are correct. This is the reason I have almost, completely stopped using MC for cad. Between MC's inability to do simple tasks, it's bugs, and it's need to constantly be rebooted to accomplish simple things such as copy and pasting, I have no longer found MC CAD to be a useful tool. Yup, it's not fair at all.

 

Don´t get me wrong... i wasn´t trying to diminish MC, just to point the differences between a high-end CAD application and a low/mid-end one. (I´d say low end because it is not suitable for assembly/drawing creation when compared to other specialized tools). As James Meyette used to say, the name is MasterCAM, not MasterCAD.

 

That being said, I find MC very proficient on the modeling side. When I used it first time, V8, 12-14 years ago, it blew my mind since I was coming from ACAD. Nearly everything I wanted in AutoCAD was there, easier and better. The last version I used was V9.1. So I believe it must be much better for modeling these days, even though it wasn´t bad in this arena.

 

So my post was just a kudos where kudos are due.

[Müřlıń®]

 

 

That being said, I find MC very proficient on the modeling side. 

+1...

 

I have modeled in ACAD, SolidWorks, Proe, Surfcam, and Mastercam...

 

I have been modeling for 20+ years and have found that Mastercam is VERY proficient in modeling now.

 

Mastercam is not an assembly program....it is used to model and machine parts.  And it does that Extremely well.

 

If you need assemblies, stress analysis, and such...get a program that is designed to do so.

[chris tobey]

to add  to the (maybe why it worked on the video and not for me) , the video was from x5 , and  I am using x9

[Müřlıń®]

  I am using x9

Really....???

 

From the icons, default paths on your config files and task bar...sure looks like a copy of just plain ol x to me....  

 

I could be wrong no offense...that is why I was asking if you were using current X9..

[Thee Rickster ™]

+1...

 

I have modeled in ACAD, SolidWorks, Proe, Surfcam, and Mastercam...

 

I have been modeling for 20+ years and have found that Mastercam is VERY proficient in modeling now.

 

Mastercam is not an assembly program....it is used to model and machine parts.  And it does that Extremely well.

 

If you need assemblies, stress analysis, and such...get a program that is designed to do so.

 

I used to do all my mold designs in MC for years.

 

No Issues at all on the CAD end of MC. for me anyways.

 

Once i bought Spaceclaim though i stopped using MC.

Its too fast of a software to compare to MC.

[crazy^millman]

You are correct. This is the reason I have almost, completely stopped using MC for cad. Between MC's inability to do simple tasks, it's bugs, and it's need to constantly be rebooted to accomplish simple things such as copy and pasting, I have no longer found MC CAD to be a useful tool. Yup, it's not fair at all.

 

Call me crazy because I can still believe I can model anything you can model in NX in Mastercam.

 

Oh yeah I am crazy so keep on dogging and others of us will keep on working.        

[crazy^millman]

i would send you my file but it wont let me, 

 

zip the file and you can do it or email it to me and I will be glad to see what can be done to help you out.

[Müřlıń®]

Guys I tried the file....

 

Surfaces do not act the same way they did in ver 9 or X....

 

I could not get it to do what he wanted either no matter what I tried...and I went all the way back to X5....

 

all i can figure out is that somewhere along the line,(prior to X5) surfaces changed and you must put that other fillet on first now to get it to work.

 

the lesson is flawed for current releases....at that is the way it appears to me....but I am not perfect...so there ya go...

 

it works the way he wants it to in solids just not surfaces...

[Watcher]

Call me crazy because I can still believe I can model anything you can model in NX in Mastercam.

 

Call you crazy would be a form of pleonasm Ron...

 

Indeed there are things you can model in NX and its competitor systems that you can´t model in Mastercam.

 

One example: The warping tools that NX offers. It´s just unavailable in most systems. The only one I know can do it as well is Pro/E.

 

But course I can be wrong about what other systems can offer the warping tools I´m talking about. But I´m bloody sure MC don´t have them. And you cannot get the same result without them. Is a very unique type of geometry.

 

Used mostly for cosmetic applications. So you´re not missing an important tool for daily metal work jobs.

[Müřlıń®]

 

 

 

But course I can be wrong about what other systems can offer the warping tools I´m talking about. But I´m bloody sure MC don´t have them. And you cannot get the same result without them. Is a very unique type of geometry.

 

Used mostly for cosmetic applications. So you´re not missing an important tool for daily metal work jobs.

could you give an example of these types of surfaces?

[Watcher]

This is warping in Pro/E

 

https://www.google.com.br/url?q=https://pdcommunicationskills.wikispaces.com/file/view/Fundamentals-of-warp-WF3.pdf&sa=U&ved=0ahUKEwi2xKDfsO_KAhWGS5AKHcW8CKIQFggOMAE&usg=AFQjCNEin_2geFb_oiYg_9XinpbL254Vgg

 

I forgot the name of this tool on UG. A peer at GE showed it to me a few years ago.

 

But here goes another geometry Mastercam can't handle: a variable helix with variations in pitch, o.d, and trajectory. I know MC can create custom curves through formulas but that's not enough for what I mean. I wish I had a high end tool available to design and share the geo I have in mind.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Watcher]

Not sure about NX but in Pro/E you can combine the 7 possible warping types.

 

Depending on the types you combine, in the second set you already have something impossible for MC to design.

[Müřlıń®]

This is warping in Pro/E https://www.google.com.br/url?q=https://pdcommunicationskills.wikispaces.com/file/view/Fundamentals-of-warp-WF3.pdf&sa=U&ved=0ahUKEwi2xKDfsO_KAhWGS5AKHcW8CKIQFggOMAE&usg=AFQjCNEin_2geFb_oiYg_9XinpbL254Vgg I forgot the name of this tool on UG. A peer at GE showed it to me a few years ago. But here goes another geometry Mastercam can't handle: a variable helix with variations in pitch, o.d, and trajectory. I know MC can create custom curves through formulas but that's not enough for what I mean. I wish I had a high end tool available to design and share the geo I have in mind.

Ahhh...yes the free hand tools....Forgot about those.

 

Never in 20 years have I ever needed to use those tools...

 

 

Mastercam has no need or ever will have a need for those tools.....

[#Rekd™]

I got the same results as Murlin. Making a solid first (if possible) is always the best method. If you need or want surfaces after for toolpaths just create them from the solid.

 

Daniel the tool in NX is Global Shaping (deform).

[crazy^millman]

This is warping in Pro/E https://www.google.com.br/url?q=https://pdcommunicationskills.wikispaces.com/file/view/Fundamentals-of-warp-WF3.pdf&sa=U&ved=0ahUKEwi2xKDfsO_KAhWGS5AKHcW8CKIQFggOMAE&usg=AFQjCNEin_2geFb_oiYg_9XinpbL254Vgg I forgot the name of this tool on UG. A peer at GE showed it to me a few years ago. But here goes another geometry Mastercam can't handle: a variable helix with variations in pitch, o.d, and trajectory. I know MC can create custom curves through formulas but that's not enough for what I mean. I wish I had a high end tool available to design and share the geo I have in mind.

 

Okay might be very difficult to do if not impossible, but don't count me out. I was able to do things back in 2001 that Pro-E couldn't do that Mastercam could. Free Form shapes are done with the Verisurf add-on point clouds and meshing along with surface creation. Also can make water tight solids from surfaces using Verisurf so don't be to sure. I helped one of the re-sellers reverse an Aztec mask that was over a 1000 years old.

[crazy^millman]

Guys I tried the file....

 

Surfaces do not act the same way they did in ver 9 or X....

 

I could not get it to do what he wanted either no matter what I tried...and I went all the way back to X5....

 

all i can figure out is that somewhere along the line,(prior to X5) surfaces changed and you must put that other fillet on first now to get it to work.

 

the lesson is flawed for current releases....at that is the way it appears to me....but I am not perfect...so there ya go...

 

it works the way he wants it to in solids just not surfaces...

 

 

Capture.PNG

 

Yes I am seeing the same thing. I would call this a regression in the software's ability.

[Machineguy]

What about Rhino? Its all free form.

[Watcher]

I was able to do things back in 2001 that Pro-E couldn't do that Mastercam could.

 

Mind to share an example?

[Müřlıń®]

Watcher....back around 2001 I went to a seminar.

 

It was the premier of a brand new software.

 

You could take a little multi axis pen and sculpt in cyber space.

 

They did an example of putting little leaves on a vine that was spiraled around a glass.

 

A top manufacturing company using ProE took 400 hrs to model up this glass..

 

This tool did it in under 20 hrs....

 

Using Mastercam I probably could have done it is less than 50...

 

Because of the way Mastercam used NURBS surfaces and the fact that you didn't have to create all those planes,  it could blow ProE out of the water on just about anything....

 

And Manufacturing....well I could have my dies machined and in my customers door before a similar job they were doing in house could even make it out of engineering...

[guitar]

Call me crazy because I can still believe I can model anything you can model in NX in Mastercam.

 

Oh yeah I am crazy so keep on dogging and others of us will keep on working.      

Well, just the other day a fellow asked about creating a line of specific point, at an angle. Mastercam could not directly draw this feature without creating additional geometry, whereas, NX could. 

NX has a much better ability to manipulate geometry easily and effectively where Mastercam continually fails. Here is an example. Try to use the push/pull method to change the diameter of a small hole in a solid. 98% of the time you cannot grab the stupid @SS red arrow to change the size. Half of the time I try to copy/rotate, scale an Item I have to reboot MC in order to get it to do it right. In NX when I create an object I can use formulas that stay intact. In NX EVERY feature has an identity that can be used in equations to simplify modeling. You are correct though. If you have enough time and patience with MC, eventually you can get it to do most things. I am very impatient, as you may have noticed. That is why I prefer NX. But, I will say that out of almost all top end CAM systems, modeling in MC is towards the top. I have used others, such as Surfscam and Giibs, that are just f'in pathetic when it comes to drawing.

[Müřlıń®]

Well, just the other day a fellow asked about creating a line of specific point, at an angle. Mastercam could not directly draw this feature without creating additional geometry, whereas, NX could. 

NX has a much better ability to manipulate geometry easily and effectively where Mastercam continually fails. Here is an example. Try to use the push/pull method to change the diameter of a small hole in a solid. 98% of the time you cannot grab the stupid @SS red arrow to change the size. Half of the time I try to copy/rotate, scale an Item I have to reboot MC in order to get it to do it right. In NX when I create an object I can use formulas that stay intact. In NX EVERY feature has an identity that can be used in equations to simplify modeling. You are correct though. If you have enough time and patience with MC, eventually you can get it to do most things. I am very impatient, as you may have noticed. That is why I prefer NX. But, I will say that out of almost all top end CAM systems, modeling in MC is towards the top. I have used others, such as Surfscam and Giibs, that are just f'in pathetic when it comes to drawing.

 

Maybe you aren't using Mastercam correctly...

 

This is just the first item you are having trouble with...

 

 

 

 

 

[Watcher]

Well,

 

My thoughts are that sometimes it gets "almost" personnel when with comes to discuss MC abilities/limitations. I´ve been there before and I can say that I was myself a huge fanboi - Nothing whatsoever seemed to be better for me - And I new back then 0.05% of the software world, against the 2% of these days. What a shame on me. I´m not pointing fingers with this statement, just saying how the inability to see the beauty of other tools was affecting my own ability to have a broader vision.

 

Yes, with some effort you can do nearly everything in almost any software. Does it yield the same result? Sometimes yes, sometimes hell no. Obtain the same surface/model quality from meshing/cloud/digitized data you get on a from scratch true solid, using a warp/deform tool from a high end software? Not much easy from what´ve see so far. Doable: Yes, depending on the level of effort and the knowledge the CAD jockey put into it. We have to know how and take this path to workaround stuff to get it done, and no discussion that sometimes this is the best, legal, profitable and only possible path. But depending on what you´re doing, and in this topic we´re partially discussing about higher end functionalities to surface and geometry manipulation, the result is that you cannot match the same level of quality/time because the option you have is flawed from its inception: you don´t have the right tool to get it done. Period. How many people know or have access to 3D sculpturing software or Verisurf add-on. I´ll go further: How many MC users do even know what Verisurf is or are willing to pay for it?

 

There are tons of people that don´t value less famous tools or don´t see the value of a nice add-on like Verisurf - In brief: They don´t value intellectual property. Show the quote to the owner and he says "Why should I pay for something Mastercam or [Write company CAD tool here] is supposed to do for the maintenance I pay?" - It´s a shame, indeed. But it is the world we live in.

 

I really find weird when we start discussions that end up in competitions - "Can be done / No, no way" - Like Ron said before, and I assimilated that one very well, "Nothing can be everything for everyone." MC has it´s limitations and cannot achieve the level of speed, quality and easiness that some of its competitors can. The opposite is also VERY true.

 

It is what it is. For good and for bad.

 

MC is a decent tool for day to day modeling. Period. But I think we have to see it as a tool in our toolbox, and not a "Does everything depending on who´s using it" solution. If all tools were the same we would not have the myriad of  CAx tools we see out there.

 

But of course I should not expect anything else from an "official" Mastercam forum.

[Müřlıń®]

Daniel...I am not a Fanboi.

 

I own my own seat of Mastercam and it is all I have to make money with.

 

Everyone knows the limitations of their software.  I have no desire to be Tim the Toolman Taylor...  

 

I am just one guy, supporting his family the most efficient way possible.  Mastercam handles this nicely.

[crazy^millman]

Well,

 

My thoughts are that sometimes it gets "almost" personnel when with comes to discuss MC abilities/limitations. I´ve been there before and I can say that I was myself a huge fanboi - Nothing whatsoever seemed to be better for me - And I new back then 0.05% of the software world, against the 2% of these days. What a shame on me. I´m not pointing fingers with this statement, just saying how the inability to see the beauty of other tools was affecting my own ability to have a broader vision.

 

Yes, with some effort you can do nearly everything in almost any software. Does it yield the same result? Sometimes yes, sometimes hell no. Obtain the same surface/model quality from meshing/cloud/digitized data you get on a from scratch true solid, using a warp/deform tool from a high end software? Not much easy from what´ve see so far. Doable: Yes, depending on the level of effort and the knowledge the CAD jockey put into it. We have to know how and take this path to workaround stuff to get it done, and no discussion that sometimes this is the best, legal, profitable and only possible path. But depending on what you´re doing, and in this topic we´re partially discussing about higher end functionalities to surface and geometry manipulation, the result is that you cannot match the same level of quality/time because the option you have is flawed from its inception: you don´t have the right tool to get it done. Period. How many people know or have access to 3D sculpturing software or Verisurf add-on. I´ll go further: How many MC users do even know what Verisurf is or are willing to pay for it?

 

There are tons of people that don´t value less famous tools or don´t see the value of a nice add-on like Verisurf - In brief: They don´t value intellectual property. Show the quote to the owner and he says "Why should I pay for something Mastercam or [Write company CAD tool here] is supposed to do for the maintenance I pay?" - It´s a shame, indeed. But it is the world we live in.

 

I really find weird when we start discussions that end up in competitions - "Can be done / No, no way" - Like Ron said before, and I assimilated that one very well, "Nothing can be everything for everyone." MC has it´s limitations and cannot achieve the level of speed, quality and easiness that some of its competitors can. The opposite is also VERY true.

 

It is what it is. For good and for bad.

 

MC is a decent tool for day to day modeling. Period. But I think we have to see it as a tool in our toolbox, and not a "Does everything depending on who´s using it" solution. If all tools were the same we would not have the myriad of  CAx tools we see out there.

 

But of course I should not expect anything else from an "official" Mastercam forum.

 

That is a different discussion all together. I never said it was the best or the end all of tools to do this job. I said I can get the job done and have experience in other areas that many don't that help me in certain ways to accomplish that task. Was not trying to make it into a NX verses Mastercam debate, but sick and tired of having NX shoved down everyone’s throat around here. Glad others like yourself have something else to use. People like myself and many others have Mastercam to use and are very glad and happy to use it day in and day out. The comments lately always seem to learn towards we are stupid for doing so (not from you), but from others like I or users of Mastercam are idiotic for using Mastercam to earn a living.

 

I have done the fringe type of work almost all of my life and have no problem trying crazy never before done things. Tools are just that and Mastercam is the tool I and many others on the emastercam forum use (Yes it is a Mastercam Forum). Sorry some have such a bad taste in their mouth using Mastercam, but really need to get over it. No one is my enemy and do my best to help anyone I can, but the constant negative beating on people has got to stop. We are all professionals in our fields. I am doing my very best to feed my family and help others feed their families.

 

Results may vary from person to person, but most of the time it does comes down to effort. Sorry, but to many times the effort it not there and it seems to be easier to blame the software. I have worked very hard always have probably always will. I don't give up without exploring every possible, way, method and/or concept I or anyone else can come up with to get a job done. That is my biggest issue is with all the bashing is I am no one special or different than anyone else. If I can figure things out sorry if I am dumb to think everybody else can. Mastercam is a tool and to openly discount it and think I am going to just agree with someone is not going to happen. I am not saying it is perfect and I am not saying it is better or worse than any other software. What I am saying is I have always been able to get the job done I have needed to using Mastercam. Does that mean I am the best or better than anyone else? No it sure does not, but it does mean I do my very best to do the best job possible. Sorry if I think anyone can work and do their job using the tool that is Mastercam, but again if I can do what I have done using Mastercam then I really think anyone can as well.

 

It was my job to educate as many people as I could what Verisurf is and what it can do. Because of those efforts many more people do know what it is and can do for their companies.

 

We were tying to help a Mastercam user with a Mastercam problem. People want to be funny okay great, but why does it always have to turn into bashing of Mastercam? Again sorry about how life has treated everyone that feels the need to rip on me and others for using it, but I do and if someone not part of the solution then IMHO they are part of the problem.

 

Again not directed personally at you Daniel as I have tons of respect for you and your proven abilities/effort.