Mori Seiki NT vs. Okuma Multus

[Mick]

Hi there,

 

We are considering the purchase of a new Turning Centre, and we're weighing up the pro's and con's of both of the above machines.

 

I'm purely curious if there is anyone out there who has gone through the same decision process, as I am very interested in the outcome.

 

Both machines are very similarly specced, and for me personally, I prefer the Okuma control, but as is always the case, each machine has its strong points.

 

Certainly, the Multus is priced VERY well against similar machines.

 

I look forward to any responses

[mold100]

Mick I cant help you out, but do a search, this was just covered i am pretty sure same machines.

[Hardmill]

Make sure you get at least a few references if you consider the Mori.

I know first hand they had trouble with coolant leaking

into the lower turret.

 

 

PEACE

[MACHINEMASTERG]

what no haas ???

[Kyle Waters]

Mick,

Are you comparing a Multus to an NT, or a Macturn to an NT? I know that at my shop, it is very highly doubted we will buy another Mori of this type, as it has proven all but impossible to actually get an operator to fully comprehend what "two path control" means. So I keep making ultra inefficient programs so the operator need not worry about the machine doing more than one thing at a time. I went to a run off for a Multus last year, but those don't have a lower turret. The NT seems to be stomping the guts out of the competition as far as machine capacity, but again with the operator issue. The Okumas have a code to specify use of both turrets, which is nice. Control wise, I was born Fanuc, but I don't love the Mitsubishi control(the backside anyway), probably due to my start on Fanucs. The OSP P200 is great if you want to be able to do PC stuff too, we have 3 mills with the P controls, and I have just started looking at the API for the P200. I am starting to actually come to like the OSP controls more, just wish there was more "open" information.

Sorry for the ramble, hope there was something useful in there....

[Kyle Waters]

One more thing, I am not sure on how you are going to use this machine, but if I remember correctly, you can get bigger spindles on a Multus than a similar NT. I haven't looked at the current line ups though.

[Guest]

:HIJACK ALERT:

 

 

quote:

---

it is very highly doubted we will buy another Mori of this type, as it has proven all but impossible to actually get an operator to fully comprehend what "two path control" means.

---

Pardon me for saying but this is an ownership/management issue more than a knock on the machine.

 

Seems that they can't or won't get someone properly trained.

 

SAD to see a machine with SOOOOOO much ability soooo under utilized.

 

 

:HIJACK ALERT CANCELLED:

[Kyle Waters]

That's true John, I was only bringing up this point because to date it has cost us almost $70,000. Every penny of that has been since I started "full time" behind a desk. I am still dreaming of the day that someone will apply at our shop, and say "are we going to actually use this machine?" Right now all I hear are grumbles about it not being a good machine, when in fact, I think it's just plain old LAZINESS.

[Dazz]

Hey Mike, are cwf looking to sell an old one!!

[Mick]

Darryl... No . Its just pie in the sky expansion talk

[Mick]

Kyle, I'm comparing the Multus to the NT.

 

There is good information here guys I appreciate it

 

We currently have two MT's and one NT. The MT's (and the NT) are very nice machines.

 

But, Kyle is realising how nice the OSP controls are I've known that for a long time

[Kyle Waters]

Mick,

So no lower turret on the NT? Both with sub spindles? One thing that I never got from Okuma was how the coordinate rotation was formatted. That is one of my favorite things on our MT.

[Mick]

The NT we have at the moment, has no lower turret, and a NC Tailstock.

 

Unfortunately, there is some kind of tailstock barrier set, but the barrier function itself isn't enabled, which means we cant do hobbing on it, even though we have the hobbing function.

 

We currently have two MT's (a 4000 and a 253) plus a NT4250. They are nice machines.

 

I will be able to tell you more about the Okuma co-ordinate rotation next week, as I am getting ahold of the Multus programming manual (from a machine owner, with the approval of Okuma )

 

Apparently, Ihouse do a really nice post for the Multus

[Greg Williams]

Hi Mick,

 

I am back now

 

quote:

---

I will be able to tell you more about the Okuma co-ordinate rotation next week, as I am getting ahold of the Multus programming manual (from a machine owner, with the approval of Okuma )

---

Are we talking G137 Co-Ordinate conversion or G127 slant machining?

[Kyle Waters]

Greg,

It sounds like coordinate conversion, although I am not positive. On the Mori it is G68.1.

 

Mick,

Would love to learn more, keep me filled in if you would.

[Mick]

Yes, we use the G68.1 Co-ordinate conversion on the MT's. Works great.

 

Greg, I think that the G68.1 is the same as the G137. Fred is sending me the Multus manuals, so I will be able to confirm that early this coming week.

 

I'm looking forward to seeing a Multus up close and personal

[Greg Williams]

Mick,

 

Yes that is the one. The below code cuts in X-C axis

 

G140(MAIN SPINDLE)

(PROGRAM - MULTUS-TEST.MIN)

(DATE - NOV-12-07)

(TIME - 18:07)

(MULTUS B300-W #1)

 

G50 S1600

G141 G50 S5000

G140

N1 G20 HP=4 (HOME POSITION)

(TOOL - 5 OFFSET - 5)

(CHAMFER FRONT)

MT=00501

M321

G0 X1200.0

M110

G94 SB=4000 M242 M63 M8 BA=0. G52 TL=005005

M13

G136

G17

G0 C0.

G137 C0.

G0 Z50.

X30.17 Y-51.1

Z5.

G101 Z-1.5 F600.

Y-45.1 F800.

G103 X24.17 Y-39.1 L6.

G101 X-24.17

G102 X-27.67 Y-35.6 L3.5

G101 Y-33.02

G103 X-33.02 Y-27.67 L5.35

G101 X-35.6

G102 X-39.1 Y-24.17 L3.5

G101 Y24.17

G102 X-35.6 Y27.67 L3.5

G101 X-33.02

G103 X-27.67 Y33.02 L5.35

G101 Y35.6

G102 X-24.17 Y39.1 L3.5

G101 X19.09

G102 X22.59 Y35.6 L3.5

G101 Y33.02

G103 X27.94 Y27.67 L5.35

G101 X35.6

G102 X39.1 Y24.17 L3.5

G101 Y20.75

G103 X44.5 Y15.35 L5.4

G101 X45.7

G102 X46.7 Y14.35 L1.

G101 Y-14.35

G102 X45.7 Y-15.35 L1.

G101 X44.5

G103 X39.1 Y-20.75 L5.4

G101 Y-24.17

G102 X35.6 Y-27.67 L3.5

G101 X33.02

G103 X27.67 Y-33.02 L5.35

G101 Y-35.6

G102 X24.17 Y-39.1 L3.5

G103 X18.17 Y-45.1 L6.

G101 Y-51.1

Z3.5 F500.

G0 Z50.

G136

M12 M9

M146

M109

G0 X1200.

G20 HP=4

TL=005000

M02

[mkd]

I just got done talking to the salesman about the "Multus B300W w/thinc".

Being a newbie with mill turns, simulation is high on my list. This machine seems to have an exceptionally strong Collision Avoidance System that even functions offline. I was considering how to sell a seat of Vericut to the boss in order to protect his investment just in case of any programming craziness.

With this C.A.S. it seems my paranoia may be pacified without the added expense of Vericut. Have I been drinking the Kool-Aid?

The integex 200 and mori NT3250 we are looking at also have simulation capabilities. Whose is best? Easiest to use?

 

Thanks in advance.

[Mick]

We have collision avoidance on our NT4250, but we haven't used....yet..

 

I'm going to be checking out the collision avoidance on the Multus when ours arrives (March), but there is also another one arriving locally at the end of this month, so I will be checking that out beforehand. I'll give you some feedback, although, I am sure Greg will chime in here

[chris m]

The importance of collision avoidance is paying attention to it; a local AE hammered one of their machines at a demo after ignoring the collision avoidance warnings...D'OH