Stock Model

[Colin Gilchrist]

For those that are using the new Stock Model feature: make sure you are adjusting your tolerances.

 

There are three different settings that may affect your Stock Model.

 

1. Initial Stock Shape Tolerance. This control is located on the 'Stock Definition' Page. It sets the tolerance for your initial stock definition. (This is not as important if you are creating a 'Rectangle' as your initial stock shape, but has a huge effect if you use Cylinder, Model, or Stock Model to define the initial stock shape.

 

2. Path Tolerance - I'll do some more investigating, but I'm pretty sure this is tolerance effects the lower limit of the triangle size being generated. For now, I would treat this like the 'STL Tolerance' in Verify.

 

3. Tool Shape - This tolerance value is just like the 'Tool' setting in Verify. It determines how accurately the tool is represented when creating the Stock Model.

 

 

 

So what does all this mean? For Roughing Toolpaths I would use much larger values that for Finishing toolpaths when using this feature. I took a simple rectangular block and put a curved surface on it. Then I created a Flowline toolpath on that surface using a 1" ball endmill as a test.

 

- With a .1 Path Tolerance, and a .05 Tool Shape tolerance, the resulting Stock Model size was 69.7K.

- With a .001 Path Tolerance and a .003 Tool Shape tolerance, the size was 665.5K.

 

Here are some recommended settings:

 

For Roughing: Initial stock shape tolerance: .05-.25 Inches, Path Tolerance: .01-.1, Tool Shape: .01-.05

For Semi-Finishing: Initial shape: .01-.05, Path Tolerance: .003-.03, Tool Shape: .003-.03

For Finishing: Initial shape: .005-.025, Path Tolerance: .002-.01, Tool Shape: .002-.01

 

These are just general guidelines, but it should help users that have had problems with long generation times. The looser you can set the tolerances, the faster the models will generate, and the less bloated your MCX file will be.

 

Hope that helps,

[mayday]

Thanks Colin, but thats not the real world i rough within .01 and you want me to use .05 tolerance? Wow just wow

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

Dude.. he said "These are just general guidelines". Sheesh!!! Slam a guy for trying to help. DAMN!!! :rant:

[Thee Rickster ™]

The whole time I thought this was a verify feature???

I thought it was verify as you go.....

So this creates geometry or . Stl files left over from the paths

Over top of the original data.

 

So now I think i finally get why the stl files created in verify

Are used or needed for. Creating an stl skin that mc uses

Over top of the geometry that should work but doesent.

And this is recommended for roughing and some semi

Finishing

 

Head hurts just thinking how many more issues in even

X5 I may have if I start using this hopefully failsafe method.

[mayday]

What ever James

I'm a tad fed up the the work arounds and new features that are sub par. As far as I'm concerned "new features" should not be in a release unless the work as they should.

dont like it? to efin bad

[mayday]

Rick, it is a skin. It's the old Verify with an atempt to make it worthy

again, wanna bet on the version it works? same as the machine def and coolant working

[Thee Rickster ™]

Wes is there a video on how to use stock model, or the (old X5) stl verify method?

I do have the roll out X6 disc if they happen to be on there....

 

Being self taught and working with softwares that dont need this

feature to get a path to work as it should havnt even made an stl file in verify to

know how to use it.

 

WEll my rush jobs are done ...for now and I am gonna do two things

figure out how to use an stl from verify to to make paths with and then

try to figure out how to use stock model in my X6 install at home....this weekend

 

James..... arent these stls and stock model supposed to help MC create a path properly

because MC has issues using regular geometry?....workaround as we call somany other things.

 

I will get it if figured out to maybe take the argument out of my concerns with using these method

 

I just hope the X5 verify method isn't file size related to the success of it working for me.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

These are just general guidelines, ...Hope that helps...

What ever James...

 

Slam a guy for just trying to be helpful. Don't like the advice, DON'T TAKE IT!!!! It's real simple Wes. No wonder CNC doesn't spend a whole lot of time in here, try to be helpful and you get slammed. Pathetic.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

James..... arent these stls and stock model supposed to help MC create a path properly because MC has issues using regular geometry?....workaround as we call somany other things.

I suppose. The kind of work I find myself doing mot often does not benefit from this particular feature. Maybe I've just been using MC for too long and I'm used to workarounds when something doesn't work as I think it should. I honestly dunno. What I do know is that for Wes to slam Colin (who is probably the most helpful guy for us at CNC next to Pete) like that was pretty up.

[Thee Rickster ™]

You can always ignore his posts.( a feature i believe you were screaming for in this old forum)

 

If he is as frustrated as me with MC issues then I understand his frustration and replys, but don't necessarily

condone his reactions to ppl....... but the software i understand 1000%

 

same here, verify/stl, and stock model are two features i may not benefit from at all,

but I would like to understand its use more of

 

I have always in any software just designed a mold then programmed the mold.

All these extra things , steps, workarounds or what ever may only just slow my productivity

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

You can always ignore his posts.( a feature i believe you were screaming for in this old forum)

I don't recall screaming for it, I do recall requesting it... often

 

Funny though, there's only 2 people on my ignore list. They are two completly unreasonable d-bags. Wes isn't quite there, but he's getting close lately. I wonder how the Mod discussions go if you have another mod ignored.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

If he is as frustrated as me with MC issues then I understand his frustration and replys, but don't necessarily condone his reactions to ppl....... but the software i understand 1000%

I don't too easily get frustrated to the point I see people getting frustrated here. I've always been a position that I just had to get the job done come hell or highwater and letting my blood boil while I'm trying to function in a stressful environment runs counter to what I need to do to accomplish said task. I guess being a Beta Tester and the fact that Murphy lives in my house rent free it feels like sometimes has conditioned me to expect hiccups so I just go with it. Maybe that's a bad trait. Maybe not.

[Thee Rickster ™]

After re reading his post it is not a slam at Colin.... IMO

You are defending the software's inadequacies through Colin.... IMO

 

Colin is one of my favorite helpers for sure!

 

he makes a good point actually I rough with .015 stock and

go right to finishing( i cut graphite molds) but regardless

i am in the understanding it is a feature that CNC is trying to

replace verify with??? sort of

[neurosis]

After re reading his post it is not a slam at Colin.... IMO

You are defending the software's inadequacies through Colin.... IMO

 

Colin is one of my favorite helpers for sure!

 

he makes a good point actually I rough with .015 stock and

go right to finishing( i cut graphite molds) but regardless

i am in the understanding it is a feature that CNC is trying to

replace verify with??? sort of

 

 

The stock model is not here to replace verify. My view (I cant speak for CNC) is that they are here to make using stl for rest roughing and for stock use more convenient.

 

The old method you had to create stl files and then find a way to manage/organize them outside of the system. This way you can see them, use them easily for verification, select them for rest roughing all from right inside of the part file.

 

 

I really like this idea if it is implemented properly. As of now it is not working so well. Partly due to growing pains and partly due system bugs.

 

It would be nice if in the future they allowed you to use the system stock for the initial stock and then add your previous operations. Once you are certain that this is going to be the stock that you want, break the association with the previous operations. Especially if they are not going to fix the issues that we have with operations becoming dirty because of (insert your issue here).

 

I use stl for stock and rest roughing quite a bit so this is definitely an option that I will appreciate once it gets fine tuned. But honestly, I can live without it for a while if they would just take care of all of the quirks.

[gcode]

how many of you have tried the new 5X curve feature "Trim to stock"??

 

In the right conditions it is really sweet

 

This is where I see stock model going.

Once fully implemented I can see 2D tool paths trimming themselves to stock on command

kicking the federate to F300 during air cuts, screaming at you if you set an R plane wrong and rapid

a drill into your stock. This is years away, but I think that's where stock model will end up.

[Newbeeee™]

WEll my rush jobs are done ...for now and I am gonna do two things

figure out how to use an stl from verify to to make paths with and then

try to figure out how to use stock model in my X6 install at home....this weekend

Rick,

Please can you 'report back' on how you get on with this. I haven't installed X6 yet (will do in the next couple of weeks) and this feature sounds good.

But it also sounds worrying to use at the moment because of all the issues. So feedback will be appreciated.

 

Colin - as always thanks for the input

 

[Tony35]

thanks for the input and trying to help Colin

[Thee Rickster ™]

Newbee, I am having trouble figuring out how to use the stl from (X5) verify.

 

Here is a nice easy cor insrert about 6" x 6" x 3" that i am testing the old verify stl

and then the new X6 stock model

.

.

 

.

 

 

I have a finish job

I go to the first cor rougher and verify that path

After an hour(lol) I figure out how to create the stl

So I did not have a rest ruf path next(it was waterline rest) so I make one

 

The only thin I can find in the rest material parameters is (compute from remaining stock)

which is what I always have ever used, and Cad file....But there is no way to pick the cad file or stl or

what ever the hell I am supposed to do to use the stl for rest roughing????? HELP PLEASE , any body???

 

So as for X6 I am not even attempting it till I can figure out how to use the verify method fist

Every body is saying I will be wasting my time as it boggs your system using 2-d cuts on a 3-d model.

 

But i gotta give it a shot...

 

Any help will be greatly appreciated, i suppose I could get help from

my reseller if I cant getter figured out

 

one last thing when you verify to make the stl can you use turbo.

 

when I use WSC right, left of bottom side, or a compound angled WCS

i wont be able to and it could take a 1/2 hour just to verify!

 

Cheers

Rick

[gcode]

In the geometry selection area, select "CAD model" and pick your STL file

 

Then on the Rest Material page select Cad Model..

 

 

 

 

[Thee Rickster ™]

do I un-select the drive surfaces?

[gcode]

no... the drive surfaces remain the same...

the CAD Model ( your stl file) is stock

 

 

[Jeremy Herron@DBS Solutions™]

I do not.HTH

[Chris Rizzo]

keep them selected. It looks at the stl for the stock left to machine, then it looks at the drive surfs to machine to.

[Ocean Lacky™]

Verify a roughing operation- Do NOT use Turbo mode

Save Verify as STL

HSM Rest Rough

Select Drive Surfs

Select Containment Boundaries

Do not select CAD file at this time

Set toolpath parameters

When you Green Check out of parameters another window will open for you to select STL.

Pick your STL and OK

Toolpath will begin crunching

[Thee Rickster ™]

Done, (had to restart because it wouldn't regenerate the first time)

 

looks just like a water line path cept it missed a few sections of z levels, same complaint I have using rest roughing

without an stl.

 

So the waterline rest is the better path without stl,

,