Ramp OFF

[dannysdad]

Hello friends,

 

I am milling a 1.379”x12.688” slot with a .689 radius at both ends at .41” depth. I am using the “contour, ramp” tool path utilizing a 3° ramp. I am using a Seco 1” square-shouldered, indexable, flat-bottomed endmill.

 

I was wondering, how do I “ramp off” of the slot WITHOUT gouging the part? If I try a tangent exit, the tool path dives left into the part (screen capture 2). If I try a perpendicular exit, the tool path dives right into the part (screen capture 1). Is there a way to ramp out on the same line as the tool path is going without going left or right? At present, when the tool leaves the cut, it is leaving a ripple in the finish which is marginally unacceptable. BTW, my tool compensation is set on “control”.

 

Thanks,

Chris

[Jayson Kramer]

if you use wear instead of control you can do it.

Why are you using control.

[dannysdad]

We bought the Mazak HSN 6000 II last year and purchased MC with it to produce the programming. We had issues with “wear”, anytime we loaded it into the machine it would throw an alarm. We had the Mazak guys in here and they could not figure out the problem, but when we used “control” on the same tool paths, we had no problem. Since then, I have used control.

 

However, it makes no sense to me that I cannot control the path of the tool when I come off of the part using “control” and I can using “wear”.

[dannysdad]

We bought the Mazak HSN 6000 II last year and purchased MC with it to produce the programming. We had issues with “wear”, anytime we loaded it into the machine it would throw an alarm. We had the Mazak guys in here and they could not figure out the problem, but when we used “control” on the same tool paths, we had no problem. Since then, I have used control.

 

However, it makes no sense to me that I cannot control the path of the tool when I come off of the part using “control” and I can using “wear”.

[Bill Craven]

When you use wear, there is a G41 in the program and if you don't have the correct parameters enabled, Sometimes Mazak doesn't know what to do with it. If you are using the Mazatrol tool values, change the tool diameter to zero. If you are using EIA tool offsets you may have to add a D word to the line with the G41. Part of it will depend on how your post is set up and part of it will depend on what parameters are enabled on the Mazak, in particular F92.7

 

HTH

[djstedman]

You can do it even using control comp.. its pretty simple really.. just figure out how much you want you actual radius for the center of the tool to travel.. lets say .03 then in the percentage box add 50 percent.. then do the same thing for the straight line ie figure the actual distance you want the cutter to move in a straight line and add 50% of the cutter, then finally make sure your straight line lead in and out is set to perpendicular.

 

Now when comp is turned on in the control it will move the cutter only the amount you put in to actually have it move since you already compensated for the amount it would have moved the tool by adding 50% of the cutter to the lead in.

 

And oh yeah I also run Mazak's .. basically you have to run them using control comp unless you want to monkey with a lot of parameter changes.. its really just easier to program them the way they are intended to run which is using control comp.

[Jayson Kramer]

I have not read all of the comments but if you use revers wear then you will not get the errors as most Mazaks do not like a - value for cutter comp so you need to be able to give it a postie value., and also look at what Bill had stated.

[jfranya]

I would do what djstedman said to do when using control comp. We program almost every critcal dimension using control comp to give the guys on the floor the ability to adjust the tool radius at the machine to hit size.

[gms1]

Heres one way I would do it with wear comp

[dannysdad]

You can do it even using control comp.. its pretty simple really.. just figure out how much you want you actual radius for the center of the tool to travel.. lets say .03 then in the percentage box add 50 percent.. then do the same thing for the straight line ie figure the actual distance you want the cutter to move in a straight line and add 50% of the cutter, then finally make sure your straight line lead in and out is set to perpendicular.

 

Now when comp is turned on in the control it will move the cutter only the amount you put in to actually have it move since you already compensated for the amount it would have moved the tool by adding 50% of the cutter to the lead in.

 

And oh yeah I also run Mazak's .. basically you have to run them using control comp unless you want to monkey with a lot of parameter changes.. its really just easier to program them the way they are intended to run which is using control comp.

 

Hey djstedman,

 

Thanks for the input...but you lost me.

==============

 

Let us start here:

 

"just figure out how much you want you actual radius for the center of the tool to travel.. lets say .03 then in the percentage box add 50 percent"

 

Ok..what percentage box? Entry length? Or Exit length?

============

 

Moving on..

 

"figure the actual distance you want the cutter to move in a straight line and add 50% of the cutter"

 

Is this where the cutter is actually moving off the part? At this time is the cutter moving perpindiular to the toolpath? If so, I only have about .370" to move in that direction, doesnt seem like a whole lot of room to ramp. That is why I do not want to ramp off perpindicular to the toolpath but instead on the same vector as the toolpath. I was hoping MC could do this.

 

I will just have to manually enter these values. Or write a macro.

 

Thanks

[djstedman]

you want to add 50% of the tool to your entry and your exit on both the line and the arc percentages, and set your line to perpendicular

 

as for figuring the amount of movement .. what I meant is it will arc off the part using the value you put in for the radius value.. the thing is you need to add that 50 percent of the cutter.

 

In your eaxmple your using a 1 inch cutter cutting a slot 1.379 wide.. I figure the bigger lead in lead out radius you use the better your blend will look.. so lets say we make it a lead in/out of 90 degrees of arc..

 

The largest arc you could turn inside the slot would be Slot width minus cutter diameter or .379

 

Dividing that in half to get the radius of our arc would give actual movement at the center of the cutter.. of .1895

 

I figure we give a bit of room for clearance so lets call it a radius value of .150 (really this is what I came up with but you could use any value between 0 and .1895 on a 90 degree arc and get away with it)

 

Now we take that and plug it into the radius value on the lead in and the lead out.. so once you do that you will see that it should now show the value in the percentage box of 15% since .15 is 15% of an inch..

 

Now we just add 50% to the percentage value.. this could also be accomplished by adding .5 (the radius of the cutter) to the .15.. I jsut find it more convenient to just add 50 to 15 and change my percentage value to 65 on both entry and exit..

 

All your really doing is adding half the cutter to your lead ins and lead outs

[dannysdad]

you want to add 50% of the tool to your entry and your exit on both the line and the arc percentages, and set your line to perpendicular

 

as for figuring the amount of movement .. what I meant is it will arc off the part using the value you put in for the radius value.. the thing is you need to add that 50 percent of the cutter.

 

In your eaxmple your using a 1 inch cutter cutting a slot 1.379 wide.. I figure the bigger lead in lead out radius you use the better your blend will look.. so lets say we make it a lead in/out of 90 degrees of arc..

 

The largest arc you could turn inside the slot would be Slot width minus cutter diameter or .379

 

Dividing that in half to get the radius of our arc would give actual movement at the center of the cutter.. of .1895

 

I figure we give a bit of room for clearance so lets call it a radius value of .150 (really this is what I came up with but you could use any value between 0 and .1895 on a 90 degree arc and get away with it)

 

Now we take that and plug it into the radius value on the lead in and the lead out.. so once you do that you will see that it should now show the value in the percentage box of 15% since .15 is 15% of an inch..

 

Now we just add 50% to the percentage value.. this could also be accomplished by adding .5 (the radius of the cutter) to the .15.. I jsut find it more convenient to just add 50 to 15 and change my percentage value to 65 on both entry and exit..

 

All your really doing is adding half the cutter to your lead ins and lead outs

 

Ok man,

 

I have got it to where I believe it will arc off with a nice blend and without gouging. Thanks a bunch.

 

I was thinking that there was a way to ramp off, I just looked right pass the possibility to arc off.

[Jayson Kramer]

make sure there is a leaner move after the arc of to turn off the cutter comp.

[BrianP.]

Ok for some one simple like me I think of it as this. In wear lead in lead out 0%=0 in control 50%=0. So with a 1/2" endmill .050 in wear is a .05 lead in/out and .300 in control is the same .050 lead in lead out. Always in control you need to be over 50%. Looks to me like you were under on the 2 examples.

 

We program almost every critcal dimension using control comp to give the guys on the floor the ability to adjust the tool radius at the machine to hit size.

 

You have the same ability using wear.

[djstedman]

really doesnt matter if its wear or if its control comp.. just depends on the control and what you have to work with.. theres no point in fighting with a mazak and jumping through hoops to get it to run wear comp just like there would be no point in messing with something that only ran wear comp easily like our makinos.. they run control or wear comp.. but with control comp they slow way down in corners.. so we use wear..

 

Its really just a slightly different method of programming.. I dont think one is 'better' or 'worse' than another .. just different.. only advantage to control comp though is you enter the diameter value.. so you can adjust .0001 on diameter which gives you .00005 on the radius where as on wear your stuck moving a minimum of .0001 on a radius or .0002 on diameter.. generally not an issue but it is nice to have that extra .00005 resolution on the radius.. kind of moot on our newer machines though since they go out 5 places..

[Machineguy]

Hey GMS1,

 

Does the comp even turn on without both a "lead in & rad" at the begining?

 

Machineguy

[BrianP.]

Does the comp even turn on without both a "lead in & rad" at the begining?

 

Yes. But you will probably come down on the part if there is any extra material there.