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OT/3 axis to 5 axis

DavidB

By DavidB,
in Industrial Forum

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DavidB Apprentice

DavidB

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Hi all,I have been offered a new job by a large engineering company who manufacture aircraft components.Im a toolmaker by trade and have been programing 3 axis machines for about 9 years.They have around 6 four axis nc machines and a Makino A66 5 axis machine with pallet change.Im not to worried about the learning curve of the 4 axis machine,but the 5 axis is all new.How big is the learning curve to make the transition over to 5 axis's machining?They also run Vericut witch i no off but also have not used.

 

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crazy^millman Veteran

crazy^millman

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Well DavidB I will tel you this if you have condifence in yourself and your abilities should be no problem if you feel it is something you really want to do. I will say this I have done the same and I loved doing 5 axis work. It is something that you have to play with work with and do to be good juts like anything. I would also say be honest with them and honest with yourself that it is not going to happen over night but also not going to take years to do either. I will tell you that The thing about 5th axis works is you need to think of it as alot of 3 axis work just wit hthe ability to d othing without moving the part. I think a big idea everyone has and that sees it is that you only use the 5 axis toolpaths t odo 5 axis work this is not so. You can use just every toolpath that you use in 3 axis. The key here is going to be a good post. I would find that I had better control doing facing toolpaths surface rough and pocket just by working in different plane and then machining from there. I know it sound simple but if you think you can you will if you think you cant you never will. I can send you soem smaples files of 5th work I have do to give you an idea what I have did and you can see a majority of the work was using 3 axis toolpaths for roughing and semi roughing then I would do the 5axflow to do alot of my finishing. I think you will find alot of people on here who know alot more than me I just hope I have helped in some way. I can tell you this I was looking at Vericut for its power and think you will love it and how it will help you from what I could see of the program.

 

I wish you luck on your new adventure and glad to see one of the ranks getting a good oppurinty.

 

Crazy Millman

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DavidB Apprentice

DavidB

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They no i haven't done any any 5 axis programing,so we both no there will b a learning curve.Im looking forward to the new job and are egar to lurn.Can i get this books you guys are talking about down under?

 

Crazy id love to see any 5 axis work u have done thx [email protected]

 

thx for all the replys i guess i'll be using this great forum more often now.

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Harryman Newbie

Harryman

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In general terms, the key to 5 axis machining is the ability to comprehend coordinate system shifting and rotating. You need a good grasp of standard three dimentional rectangular and polar coordinates. Don't hesitate to take advanced math classes. The more natural it is for you to think in vectors, the better. Up, down, left, and right are fairly meaningless terms in 5 axis. You have some basic world coordinate system that the machine is built on, and all part features are described in coordinates of that world system, or combinations of coordinate rotations and shifts from that world system.

 

Sophomore level Engineering Statics is a particularly applicable class for a five axis machinist / programmer. It combines a level of mathematical rigor, that will allow you to deal with any conceivable real world 5 axis shop math issue, with enough accademic practice to make 5 axis thinking second nature. The ability to undestand forces in a loaded, static system are also very valuable for advanced milling setups. I'm not saying that one must study this level of math, but one should, IMHO.

 

The success of applying Mastercam to a 5 axis machine will depend greatly on machine resident capabilities and post processor sophistication.

 

Since you already have a solid understanding of Mastercam, I think, the biggest change in going 5 axis will be the coordinate system issues.

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Harryman Newbie

Harryman

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In general terms, the key to 5 axis machining is the ability to comprehend coordinate system shifting and rotating. You need a good grasp of standard three dimentional rectangular and polar coordinates. Don't hesitate to take advanced math classes. The more natural it is for you to think in vectors, the better. Up, down, left, and right are fairly meaningless terms in 5 axis. You have some basic world coordinate system that the machine is built on, and all part features are described in coordinates of that world system, or combinations of coordinate rotations and shifts from that world system.

 

Sophomore level Engineering Statics is a particularly applicable class for a five axis machinist / programmer. It combines a level of mathematical rigor, that will allow you to deal with any conceivable real world 5 axis shop math issue, with enough accademic practice to make 5 axis thinking second nature. The ability to undestand forces in a loaded, static system are also very valuable for advanced milling setups. I'm not saying that one must study this level of math, but one should, IMHO.

 

The success of applying Mastercam to a 5 axis machine will depend greatly on machine resident capabilities and post processor sophistication.

 

Since you already have a solid understanding of Mastercam, I think, the biggest change in going 5 axis will be the coordinate system issues.

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crazy^millman Veteran

crazy^millman

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Well I would recommend geometry classes more that say something like Calculus. I have had Calculus and I have yet to have a need to do any systical analysis for 5th axis toolpaths. I think if you understand the 3 axis world as well as I think you do then the 5th axis is going to be so much fun. All those times when you wanted get to those other operations or things done without having to move the part now can be done. I would tell you to think that risers will be come your best friend. I worked in a place where we doing some Rails that were out of 5" x 5" HRS and had to be machinined down into L-shape that were 120" in length. Oh did I forget that had to be straight within .01 and we only had a 66" travel 3 axis machine. Been real nice to have done 3 sides of that on a machine capable of doing it.

 

Well I think if you get in touch with your reseller they can get them if not I ship stuff all over the world and would be more than glad to help you. Again good luck have fun relax and take it one day at a time and it will all be good.

 

Crazy Millman

 

[ 10-05-2003, 04:28 PM: Message edited by: Millman^Crazy ]

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gcode Experienced

gcode

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A proven post you can trust is essential,

especially if you new to 5X.

You said you would have access to Vericut.

This will be a huge help to you. Get it set up to

verify GCODE not mastercam NCI filies.

 

Mastercam 5X toolpaths can verify and backplot correctly, but be totaly wrong when posted. An incorrectly defined toolplane can be fatal.

NCI verification will not catch it!!!

Its is much easier,cheaper and SAFER to find this out in Vericut or Predator gcode verification.

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DavidB Apprentice

DavidB

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quote:
Well I think if you get in touch with your reseller they can get them if not I ship stuff all over the world and would be more than glad to help you. Again good luck have fun relax and take it one day at a time and it will all be good.

 

Crazy Millman

Millman i would really like to my hands on the 4-5 axis book from M|C.I want to buy it myself so its mine,should i go threw a reseller wich i dare say would take a while as im in Australia.I start new job in 2 weeks,really looking forward to it

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Guest CNC Apps Guy 1

Guest CNC Apps Guy 1

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To me, the most difficult thing about 5 Axis work when I was first starting with it was understanding the relationship between tool/holder/head to part. Once I could visualize the motion, the rest was easy. The toolpaths are not especially difficult, it's just understanding which one to use and when. Also what to do when you're not exactly getting what you want and how you want it.

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