watch out!!

[Mike Freimann]

Thirteen years is a long time to use something that you don’t like.

There have been lots of versions in thirteen years.

The “brand X forum” user seems like he is somewhat loyal to Mastercam.

I would question the legitimacy of the complaint.

The new interface will come some day.

Based on other versions, I do not think it will be at the expense of current/old users.

 

[Bullines]

Note that a switch to a "Windows style" interface is not purely cosmetic. There are other advantages that aren't readily apparent to users. Most of the advantages (assuming the new interface is implemented the way I think it will be), will be directed towards the developers them selves. From a programmers point-of-view, event driven development is much simpler and easier to organize. Maybe updates will become more frequent? It also frees up CPU cycles when the user insn't doing anything. Also, a native Windows product introduces many new performance gains through things like multithreaded processes and COM/COM+.

[gstephens]

How many of you are ready to give up the F1 key for zoom?

I'm already starting to wean myself onto the right click menu.

The cpu thing is ridiculous. Windows is calling the keyboard and mouse continuously as well as Mastercam, but those calls are ignored in the system performace as long as you are in a native application.

The biggest gain we're all going to get from a Windows environment is video card compatibility.

just my 2 centavos (not worth much I know

[Bullines]

Video card compatibility is increased by using popular APIs like DirectX and OpenGL. At the moment, OpenGL is used for shading and with good reason. Implementing established shading algortihms can be a huge pain...I speak from experience. If everything relating to geometry was developed with DirectX or OpenGL, CNC Software wouldn't have to be concerned with how it ran on every video card. They could just say "get a DirectX-compatible card" or "get an OpenGL-compatible card" depending on the API they used. It would then be up to the user to select the card that handles the given API the best.

gstephens,

Actually, Windows isn't checking the keyboard and mouse for input. Windows is event driven. When something happens in Windows (Ex: left mouse click, a program generates a dialog, etc...) that is called an event. Every event fires a "message" to Windows or to another app. Other than that, Windows just sits there waiting for something to happen. You are correct though in saying that Mastercam polls the keyboard and mouse. That is the reason for the high CPU utilization. There are other factors too that were discussed in this thread:

http://www.emastercam.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/001025.html

[This message has been edited by Bullines (edited 06-12-2001).]

[Kenneth Potter]

Hummmm

I agree with Charles Davis on gettting a new interface .But if & when that day comes, I hope the New interface has the option to switch back to the classic interface.

Dynamic panning & zoom with the mouse would be nice!

 

[s0l0seven]

He is right about the mouse thing, it would be pretty sweet.

[CycleTimeCharles]

Dynamic pan and zoom is kinda of already there.

click on Dynamic rotate and press the T key for pan and or S for zoom

[s0l0seven]

It’s not the same, in AutoCAD you can use a mouse with a scroll wheel to zoom and pan weather you hold it down or roll it. It really speeds up drawing I think.

[lou]

humm,Funny how one topic can start off a bunch of different topics.

------------------

Lou Wilson

Cnc Programmer

http://www.opinc.com

[Kenneth Potter]

Cycle time you are right

Its kinda there but its kinda funky to work with & annoying. A dynamic screen pan weres a hand drags the screen around like paper on your desk. A simple cad windows function that all the other cad systems use!

One simple click & Bang ! Dynamic pan or zoom.

Kenneth Potter

 

[kathy]

And more / customizable functions on the right mouse click button.

And pull down, customizable and docking toolbars.

Those of you who are balking at a 'true windows' GUI - what other programs have you worked with where you think the mcam interface is more efficient as is instead of an interface more windows compatible??

 

Kathy

[gstephens]

Doesn't anyone just use the cursor keys for pan and the pageup/down keys for zoom?

I almost never use Gview-Dynamic anymore. Since Alt-cursor keys gives you more control as well as letting you know where you are (5 deg per push).

This is soooo far off topic it's not even funny.

[bryan.davis]

interesting topic, I did it the justice of reading the lot.

MasterCAM is apparantly very easy to hack and de-dongle much of this is down to the the fault of the programmers as it is down to the inginuity of the hacker.

To my knowledge there has been a hacked version of 7.2 doing the rounds on the web since as long as 7.2 has been released, and I know of a few websites that claim to be able to produce good, reliable dongle emulators, which means that anybody with an existing copy of MasterCAM can make as many useable seats as he wishes.

The truth of the matter is that there is NO WAY you can protect sotware from piracy and hackers, I would have thought that after 20 years of dismal failure this lesson would be learnt!. This lesson is particularly true where the software has a high price tag on it, such high price tags only give a bigger incentive to hack the product.

Its interesting to note that Microsoft, have virtually no protection on their software, but somehow they have managed to become the worlds richest software producer, it may also be the case that they are the worlds biggest victim of software piracy, but if you had Bill Gates bank ballance SO WHAT!

The secret is in the buisness model, rather than invest a huge chunck of resource in fighting a battle that is fundamentally unwinnable they more than make up for the losses by making sure everyone in the world uses their products wheather they want to or not.

Now Im not suggesting that anybody copy the Microsoft buisness model, god forbid!, but surely its time the software industry realises the anti copying war is unwinable and look for other routs to encourage users to register their copies and pay-up!

Service strikes me as a possible starting point.... why do honest MasterCAM customers have to pay the same price for training as do those who dont even have a valid licence?, infact why pay at all? why not give all valid MasterCAM coutermers free training and refuse to give any training to anybody else at all?... was it Michale Reynolds complaining that he had people for training that hadnt bought a valid licence, and never bough one after that... well Im supprised that it isnt already policy to NEVER train anybody who cant produce a valid software licence!... OK so free training may be expensive, but how expensive would it be if you dropped the software protection and saved cash there?.... remember you are passing the cost of inconvienencing (not stopping) theives on to your honest customers.

for another example, the PC games industry has all but given up on the anti copying issue, nowadays they produce their games so its desirable (not essential) to play the game over the internet and provide each copy with a unique key that will give them access to a multiplay website, this added service dost wipe out the piracy, but it gives a big incentive to buying leagal software.

 

[This message has been edited by bryan.davis (edited 06-13-2001).]

[gcode]

I think the local community colleges are the source for a lot of the cracked Mastercam we see going around. Everytime I've taken a

MC class, there has always been somebody in the class hawking bootleg Mastercam.

I'm starting a Solids class this evening.

I'm curious to see if someone in the class will be selling cracked MC V8.

To be continued.....

[Michael Reynolds]

I teach at a community college in upstate NY, and I've never heard of anyone at our school selling bootleg copies of mcam. If I did, the person would not only be kicked out of the class, but may also be subject to getting a call from our local mcam dealers. I have heard of students selling bootleg copies of AutoCAD....but not in MY class...

Mike R.

[bryan.davis]

I think its true that courses are a major way of distributing pirate software, it stands to reason, that if person A has a bootleg copy then he will offer it to anybody else that may be interested, and a course is a natural meeting point for parties of like interests.

Often these bootleg copies are distributed freely, there is a dual psycholgy at work here...

1 "if I give the guys the software then they will like me better"

and

2 "I know what Im doing is illegal, but if all the other guys are doing the same then is isnt quite so bad is it?"

The software producers dont help themselves in the slightest in this scenario, firstly once someone has a bootleg copy of MasterCAM there are few benefits to actually paying for a legal copy, and secondly because the act of piracy is criminalised all this is untraceable and you have to take into account the criminal psychology.

As I said earlier, there is no simple solution, but you can guarantee that any software protection device will fail, for every programmer MasterCAM has there are a hundred hackers of equal or better ability that cant wait to crack the security

[Bullines]

Bryan,

Microsoft is apparently implementing anti-piracy measures by making their high-end products like Office XP subscription-based. So you have to subscribe to use the software you bought. Any one have a copy of Office XP yet to verify this?

[Kenneth Potter]

s0l0seven

Dynamic pan & zoom in a way is not off topic cause it has become clear to me that Masterecams program coding is old. It has traces of its dos legacy, & that make it a memory pig. And as someone said earlier , Easier to hack in to cracked M,C. I belive simple dynamic pan & zoom with the mouse cant be done with the current coding to this interface.,,, Pull down menus, toolbar icons" with fly outs" that you can dock just wont happen . I,v read all the past comments on High Cpu usage & video cards problems that are linked to the style of coding used gives me a clearer picture of what really going on .Future releases will solve those issues. Butttttttttttt

I,m sticking with Mastercam because it still kicks Butt !

Kenneth Potter

[Bullines]

Partly code style, partly app type.

[This message has been edited by Bullines (edited 06-14-2001).]

[Albion]

It's sad that there are so many dishonest people out there. Although I don't agree with the 75% to 80% number I do agree that a lot of companies are using software illegally.

Since piracy is so high these companies start to spend more time working on security. Not only does this take away from software development it also creates problems with the software. The old saying goes "The more complex a system the more chance it has to break down." Do you know how frustrating it is to not have a piece of software work, not because it's advertised function doesn't work, but because it's security system doesn't work with your setup.

We run a CAM package called AcuCarv. Our network is set up so that many different people can log into any machine on our shop floor. Since AcuCarv's security works on a Current User basis and can only be installed as Administrator you can see the problem. I install the software and it works great as Administrator but as soon as I try to run it as another use I get "System Security has been violated". So now I can't use their software, not because it's functionality is flawed but because it's security is.

Like I said, it's to bad there are so many dishonest people out there. But "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone." How many of you are running some shareware software outside of it's limit? How many of you run WinZIP without registering it? How many of you have that 10 year old piece of software who's company is gone hence no way to register it. You know this is still copyright infringement. How many of you people have taken a copy of Microsoft Office, Windows 2000, etc... home to use even though you never use it at work, claiming the 20/80 rule? I bet if half of you checked all your computers at home and work for illegal software 90% of you would find at least one violation. So before you go threatening to turn someone in you'd better make sure you're 100% legal.

 

[Kenneth Potter]

Quote from Kathyric

--------------

Those of you who are balking at a 'true windows' GUI - what other programs have you worked with where you think the mcam interface is more efficient as is instead of an interface more windows compatible??

--------------------------------------------

I venture to say None. As i work with M,C style of interface i find myselef counting the large number of mouse clicks to access certain funtions compared to others with a true windows Gui.

Kenneth Potter

 

 

[cadcam]

Mouse clicks.

Oh I use the keyboard so I never have a problem with trying to mouse click every thing.

My problem is waiting for the computer to catch up to my keystrokes.

I use the mouse only when I need to pick things.

Really try using the keys instead it is much faster and easer.

Just my lousy .002 cents.

------------------

jay/ aka cadcam

Precision Programming

cnc programming &

Predator reseller

email: [email protected]

web: www.ppcadcam.com

Mastercam forum FTP free file support

ftp://www.ppcadcam.com

User: mastercam

Pass: forum

[kathy]

Alright - Do any of you remember the days pre Autocad 2000?? (for those of you who have had the pleasure..) The only way to be really efficient was to use hot keys. Now, there is so much functionality built into the mouse driven interface, hot keys are a thing of the past.

Personally, I hate hot key because I go between so many applications, I have to keep the straight.

Hey, mcam development people - how about multiple mastercam files available in a single session - al la Autocad 2000.??? Right now I run 2 mcam sessions, but after a couple of hours, mcam gets lost in the file directory (can't find the nci file). I have to bomb out and start all over!!

Kathy

[Bullines]

Indeed. MDIs (Mlutiple Document Interface) come in handy

[Kenneth Potter]

To stay on topic Kathy its the codeing that mastercam uses that makes it so easy to Crack & its tied to the old dossie days of keyboard input, I,m a autocad 11 thru 2000,""""I remember those days"" cadkey, Surfcam ,Alias wavefront, solid works,Rhinocerous,Cimatron user to start.I can access most things with one or two mouse clicks. Kathy start counting your clicks in MC and you will get my point. Most of these tools you should normaly be able to access with one click. But on this interface you cant.

line endpoint

main menu/create/line/endpoint =4 clicks

line multi main menu/create/line/ multi

arc tan to 2 main menu/create/arc/tan 2

arc 3pt main menu/create/arc /3pt

= 4 clicks

 

mainmenu/create/drafting/dimenstion/horiz

/vertical

/parallel

/baseline

=5 clicks

I could go on.

 

I tryed out Mc version of dynamic pan & its Kinda really a drag. Sorry Cycle Time Charles,, Its really bad . Dynamic pan & zoom "one click mouse access" is a common function that all other system have, plus hotkeys to boot. BTW i hate hot keys too .I had to make a keybord template with hot key lables so i can remember them all.

I realise that the current app style & coding in M,C makes it tough to modernize.But i hope future releases show improvement.