"Spongy" vise

[Thad]

Has anyone ever experienced a spongy feel when tightening a vise? It feels soft and spongy when I tighten it. When I say tighten, I mean the actual clamping of the part, not just closing it. It's a Kurt vise. Also, it seems that it takes twice as much force to open it as it did to tighten it. Sometimes I have to hit it with a dead blow hammer to get it to open.

 

I've never been a guy to NOT tighten the vise enough, but I don't think I overtighten it either. I usually put all my weight into it. Maybe that's the problem. I don't use a hammer to tighten it. I'm wondering if over time, I have damaged something internal that is causing this. Any ideas?

 

Thad

[Keith Graydon]

Chips in the body of the vice. me thinks

 

quote:

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I'm wondering if over time, I have damaged something internal

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That would be best discussed in another thread

[mayday]

Thad, have you checked the gib adjustment? I mean the center set screw in the moving jaw. and or the thrust washers. I have rebuild a few and they can cause problems when full of poo

[Hardmill]

+1 to the chips and to rebuilding it.

 

PEACE

[Thad]

quote:

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That would be best discussed in another thread

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I've taken the moveable jaw off, cleaned it up, re-greased the half-round ball inside...(waiting for another comment from Keith ) and re-adjusted the gib. The hole in the back is plugged to keep chips and debris out of the threads. I'm not familiar with the thrust washers.

 

Thad

[Thad]

Forgot to mention that it has been recently lubed and is free of chips inside and underneath the moving parts.

 

Thad

[Thee Cutterman]

Had the same action on one of my vices and it ended up being the thrust washers

 

Darren

[Tim Aydt Prototek Engineering]

These things come apart relatively easy. It is possible there could have been some moisture that turned to rust. Or, like cutterman says, thrust washers. At one time I was able to call Kurt's Tech support and get schematics and part lists of the vise models. This way you can order this hardware and fix it up

[SledGeek]

Thad,

Is the back jaw an integral part of the vice body , or a bolt on piece that looks like it's one piece ? Ive actually had to take one apart and press in a couple 3/4 dowels to help strengthen the cheap-xxxx key they use to locate the jaw. This also gives a spongy feeling, though not as bad as "poo",when pushing on that key.

[Fred @ Slate Industries]

Vices...

As an apprentice I remember

Beating the Handle of a vice with a mega sized Beater because it would go 180 degrees and stop solid Good bye Handle

Ends up it was a Hydrulic vise

Don't even ask me what I did to the 90 deg head

I had never heard of Jack screws ...

[Thee Cutterman]

 

That brings back afew bad memories Tony

[Shop Wench]

Check the bolts (SHCS 5/8" x 3") on the underside of the solid jaw. They are probably weakening & will eventually snap. We had the same thing happen at our shop.

[Thad]

Darren: Thrust washers seem to be a popular cause based on your and other's experience. I'll talk to our maintenance guy about checking them out.

 

Tim: It could very possibly be some rust, based on how well our coolant is maintained.

 

Midnight: The back jaw is bolted/keyed on. I'll consider adding dowels after further inspection.

 

Shop Wench: I'll replace the bolts when I tear it apart.

 

Thank you all for your replies. I'll have to wait until I get a couple of table jobs to run. Then I'll tear into it.

 

Thad

[Maxi]

Get a real vice, get a Gerardi vice. They are the best. Trust me you won't regret it.

[Thad]

quote:

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Get a real vice, get a Gerardi vice.

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Thanks, Tampax.....I mean Maxi.

 

Thad

[Gary]

Yeah dude like who uses Kurt vises anyway.

[Maxi]

Thad.... Sorry for being so off.... key

[Hardmill]

quote:

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Thanks, Tampax.....I mean Maxi.

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DAAAAAAAAAMMMMNNNNNNN!!!

 

Talk about your welcome wagon

 

Welcome to the forum "M"

 

 

PEACE

[Maxi]

Thanks Hardmill, I guess I was rude in the way I recomended the Gerrardi vice to Thad.

 

I have used Kurt vices before and they are not too bad to work with, but I found that Gerrardi vices are more versatile and precise.

[Thad]

quote:

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Thad.... Sorry for being so off.... key

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Maxi, don't sweat it. Your reply just came across like many other forums I've been to. When someone comes in with a hidden email, no real name, no home page, no interests, and no real solution/suggestion to the problem, other than a percieved smartazz remark on their first post....I lash out. Now, I see your honest intentions. Thanks for your recommendation for Gerardi vices, but it's just not going to happen.

 

Oh, and welcome to the forum, my Canadian friend!

 

Thad

[Gary]

+1000 to Thad I just get Pizzed off when someone comes in with a reply like that and it is because so many other boards thats all the guys do. They don't no what there talking about but love to chime in just to stir the pot. Sorry for being sarcastic and WELCOME TO THE FORUM.

[Thad]

OK, group hug!

 

Thad

[crazy^millman]

I would think that if a majority of the place I have worked and seen use Kurt vices there is a reason for it. Thad this may sound completly crazy but do a NDT on the vice. I have had 2 vices have cracks in them and One I found real easy the vice was in 2 pieces the others was not so easy and we had NDT as the placed I workd with the DYE and sure enough you would not believe the spider cracks that vice had. We checked the other 14 vices and did not see this but was very supried and thought how in the world. Then I got to thinking there are wasting and with any casting there is always the area of margin. Metal is like anything it does fatiuge and it does get stress in it every time we use it. The best vices I have seen are ones that people hand made out of chunks of steel and ground in and spent a but load of time on but they still spring if not used right and they still fatigue over time even if ued correctly. Metal to Metal contact wears anything and since a vice is always Metal to Metal we in the profession have to expect and accpet a cetain amount of thing that are going to happen to tolling, vices, machine and so forth that we just sometimes do not think should happen. If you go down the lis and rule out eh logical then the unlogical will most times show it ugly head. I have see threaded shaft look just fine then under load act like a big rubber band, I have seen carbide endmill bend like they should pop in half at certain rpms and never have a problem, I think we have all seen our share of things thatmake us scratch our head and go what the ..... Do all you know, fix all you can and if you are not happy set it to the side order or use another one and go on is about all you can do.

 

Good Luck

[Thad]

quote:

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do a NDT on the vice

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Ron, thanks for the input, but I'm afraid that 'simple' repairs are all that I have at my disposal. Replacing thrust washers seems like a challenge at times. I'm sure if it costs more than 99 cents, I'll have to perform a 6 month study on how other shops have coped with 'spongy vise' syndrome, turn in a 16 page report on the advantages and disadvantages on the proper recycling of old thrust washers, calculate a complete ROI schedule on the whole repair, fill out Corrective Action forms (in triplicate) on how to never, ever, ever, ever, cause such damage to a piece of equipment again, attend a 6 week class on how to properly use and maintain clamping devices, and write a complete thesis on how vises helped shape the manufacturing industry during the Industrial Revolution. And you should see what I have to do to spend $5!!!

 

Thad

[crazy^millman]

Yeah I nkwo the idea I always called it penny wise and in your case $1,000 dumb. We wonder why we lose work over seas. I am not saying get away from quality I am saying get away from waste. It was m understanding that ISO or producers of the such where suppose to make America able to compete in the world market yet the companies by stuff from China and give a good care less about if they follw ISO or any other quality standards aslong as their bottom line is better and they get to retire with a little more. I see the need for quality systemsn and for quality control as well as documation but it should help the Manufacturing world not hinder and in your case if you have to spend more than 30 seconds fixing a prolem of this nature soemone really needs to get their head out of their a$$ and wake up and smell the roses. You need thrust washers I will buy you some and send them for Pete's sake. Sorry but people are always pointing to work going overseas that we as a country have gotten lazy and the Chinese are so decited to they work. I see you giving anyone a way to cut corners, do it with less hassle, and just get the job done as always having the advantage. I know you are not being serious but I wanted to show the way your possilbe problem is really a tru problem in alot of shop in people I have talked to over the years and auctions of comapines I have been to becuase these same type of problems are what made them not able to compete and have to close thier doors.

 

Ok off the box

 

Peace out fellow and Good Luck to My friend Thad!!!