A little more info

[puzzlemaker]

I keep seeing testimonials on here about how Mastercam did the impossible,made life so much easier,and generally is God's gift to the machining world.I tend to agree based on what the sales person demonstrated to me.

Would it be too much to ask that Mastercam actually supply a manual that covers all the options that the program includes????? I received a 270 page book, of which only 85 pages apply to my version.I appologize for only buying the basic program but, that's all I really need.I thought that it would at least come with information enough to use it.When I ask how to do things,I am told you need to take this course or buy this book,or spend time in the chat room.WHY??? Am I expecting too much? I have a $700.00 program that I was able to teach myself to use because it came with an instruction book. I still use it most of the time because I can.Now I have a $5,000.00 program that sits and waits for me to make time to take a course.I wish I had that much time on my hands.This is not directed in anyway to the company who sold me the progam, they did everything in a professional mannner ,and I do not feel it is their responsability

[Toolfab]

 

 

I can hear them coming. Puzzlemaker, you should probably read the FAQs.

[Bullines]

Such is opften the case with advanced apps such as Mastercam. Driving a car is farely intuitive and after some basic tips from an experienced driver, you're cruisin'. On the other hand, to pilot a space shuttle requires training and instruction. With power comes responsibilty and stuff like that. Is that a good analogy?

[Rekd™]

In light of the recent posts reguarding attitude on this forum, I am not going to say anything to be-little you for being rude. I'm not going to tell you how stupid you're making yourself look by posting this garbage. I'm not going to mention the fact that you should have brought a sack lunch with you because you're going to be here a while trying to get ANY help now.

 

In fact, I'll throw in some advice just to show the forum members that I really can be just a little civililized when I encounter stupidity.

 

While in Mastercam, hit ALT-H. It will bring up a help file that will guide almost any monkey along the path of programming. Provided you have any programming experience, and contrary to your obvious lack of common sense, it will get you much of what you need. (except the slap upside the head)

 

'Rekd teh Civilized

 

[ 04-17-2003, 04:14 PM: Message edited by: Rekd ]

[Brendan P]

Welcome to the forum,

 

quote:

---

Is that a good analogy?

---

I think it is a very good analogy Bullines.

 

Puzzlemaker,sometimes you can only explain soo much on paper.The book doesn't always tell you

why.It only tells you to do it.

This is why it is good to take the basic classes.

They are meant to get you off and running.You will learn a lot from them.

I certainly wouldn't want to be on an airplane when all the captian ever had for training is a book!

If you choose to not take any formal training,you

can ask many questions here,and they will get answered.

One of the hardest things to do is to "get over the hump".

Once you do that,you will love your new software.

As for "not having time on your hands".

You may consider a different job.

It will take time!

[iowajim62]

Hi puzzlemaker,

You didn't say what version or mill or lathe.

I was just wondering. Anyways you said you don't have enough time to learn the software. How did you learn to run the computer your talking to us on? I'm not being a smartass, I just think you should stop and consider what you're saying before you come in here of all places and say any inflammatory stuff. I mean if you can learn to run your computer you can learn to use MC. Hope I don't make you mad but nothin comes for free in this world.

BTW Welcome to the Forum

Hope you stick around and learn some stuff.

And don't forget the ? in Toolbar Upper Left

it will help more than you think.

[Jammer™]

Probably just lost the best help you could get for learning Mastercam........

[mold100]

Man oh Man,4 posts in and BOOM, I cant wait for

the rest of this post.

 

1 Mill level 1 Im guessing?Pretty basic and straight forward.

 

2 there are aftermarket books and tutorials

 

3 If every application was in one book it would come in a set call mastercamlypedia

 

4 Stick around here any problem you could ever

have can be solved.Access to this place is worth your 5 grand

 

P.S> Welcome to the forum.

And hey he didnt ask for a basic fanuc post

[chris m]

Sir

 

While I do think you're looking for trouble (a little) with the phrasing of some of your comments I'm going to take the unpopular stance here and back you up somewhat.

 

The tutorial books that come with the software are, in my opinion, somewhat weak. The parts that are used are already created geometry (which is worthless as a training tool) in many cases and tell you "make the parameters look like this screen shot" but don't tell you much about what the parameters are and what they do. If you start playing around on your own with stuff and regen the toolpaths you can learn quite a bit about what things do but I think it would be nice to include a page or two of descriptions for the basic parameter options and suggested tips for where to set them instead of just "do this". I am not bashing CNC Software but stating my opinion; they may feel that what I (and many people that use the software for the first time) would like goes beyond the scope of tutorials and into the realm of training. Thats fine, it is their product and they can do whatever they like but I don't think anyone can claim to be suprised when told that the tutorial books are by no means a comprehensive resource.

 

On the topic of training, NOBODY is too busy to take a 3 day training course; I don't care who you are. The company wouldn't fall into a black hole if you took a couple days off for training. If you are so indispensable you could always go to work after class and catch up at night for a few hours. It is incredible how much you can learn in a couple of days from a good trainer.

 

Now I'm gonna duck because I know a storm is brewing.

 

C

 

[ 04-17-2003, 04:54 PM: Message edited by: chris m ]

[Nominal]

I'm wondering what the last cad/cam package you were using was, and did it have such spectacular documentation that any idiot could read a book and be a CNC programmer? If you read the machinery handbook will you be a tool and die maker? Probably not. Yeah if you are green to NC and CAD/CAM I don't think there's any book out there thats going to give you all the skills and knowledge you're going to need to do this job. Even taking the classes is only going to get you started, depending on your background you may still be useless for years. But thanks for venting, it was entertaining. Good luck in all your future endevors.

[Michael Reynolds]

I'm just chiming in here to say that I miss the manuals that came with V7 and earlier. They were VERY good at explaining most all details in Mcam.

 

I'm out...

 

Mike R.

[Trevor Bailey]

I am going out on a limb here also and say that agree to some degree. The only MC orientated manual that I have seen that actually gives you the how to's and the why's, is MC V1 & V2. These books should be shipped with every seat sold in my opinion.

 

Also, don't get frustrated. If you are totally stuck AFTER using the on-line help and your book, then take a minute and get up and walk away from the computer. Read all prompt screens thoroughly. Pay close attention to all menu's you are clicking so that you can take the time to "relate" to the wording. This software was created by machinist for machinist. As far as I can tell thus far in my career, the terms are all the same that we use.

 

Good luck and stick around. Nobody rides a bike on the first try .

[Guest]

Puzzlemaker:

 

Do a search on this site for training manuals. This basic topic has been discussed before. There are many books and or training cd on this software. I do agree with you and Chris some what. I do miss the manuals. I still have and use the V7 manuals. Welcome to the forum. Tread lightly with the negative attitude.

[ssibiski]

Puzzelmaker I can understand how you feel about the amount of information in the manual. But the manual can't show how all applications work in all situations. That is only going to come through experience or shared experience ( ie through this site and its members). What you payed for was software. What you are looking for is knowledge and that is not,and has never been cheap.

Rek gave a good point for you to try.

quote:

---

hit ALT-H. It will bring up a help file

---

Also you can use the search option here in this site.

 

HTH

 

Regards

Steve Sibiski

[puzzlemaker]

Some of you are missing the point of what I said. I said, and I still maintain that the manual should show what OPTIONS ARE INCLUDED in the program i have purchased and how to use them.I didn't ask how to apply it to what ever I am programming.That I understand is my problem and welcome the challenge.

I sell furniture that is ready to assemble.If I shipped things to my clients without assembly instructions and told them they needed to buy a video in order to be able to put it together,guess what they would tell me.

You can insult me , you can belittle me, and run me out of Mastercam on a rail. Doesn't change my opinion, and it is just that my opinion.

Three years ago I had never seen a CNC in action, I bought a machine(used) taught myself how to use it and produce what I need.I know only what I have learned on my own.I have been in business for 20 years . I work an average of 65 hours a week doing what i like.

[Brendan P]

quote:

---

and I still maintain that the manual should show what OPTIONS ARE INCLUDED in the program

---

If I were spending $5,000.00 for software on myself,I can guarantee I would know EVERY option

that I was getting.

quote:

---

If I shipped things to my clients without assembly instructions and told them they needed to buy a video in order to be able to put it together,guess what they would tell me.

---

Actually this would be a good idea,because those

stupid little so called cartoons they supply are never right!

Every person DOES NOT always buy the same OPTIONS!

Mastercam has many,many diferent option packages

(add on's)if you will.

Now what are they supposed to create a special little book for everyones needs??

Think about what you are saying here.....

[iowajim62]

Hi Puzzlemaker,

Glad you hung around. I see you have your own answer,

quote:

---

taught myself how to use it

---

did you get much out of the manual that came with the machine or was it more like playin' around with the machine and figuring it out yourself ? The same is true for MC. It just depends on how badly you want to succeed with it.

Personally I have spent over 1000 hours the last 3 years playing with and learning MC at home on my own time. Not everybody is willing to pay the price of time(very valuable) to learn new software but with a little investment on your part you'll be flyin' in no time.

 

Don't worry about the remarks made here, they're only words and luckily not 1-2-3 Blocks and Surface Plates!

Words can encourage or discourage but you can't get a bloody nose from them.

[Scott Bond]

Hi puzzlemaker

I read your posts,and I understand your point.

You are in the right place for the info you seek.

You do not have to take a course.But you would be better off,, and sooner if you did .Just use the book to get familiar with the buzz words, then sit in your seat and figure it out.

[puzzlemaker]

I should add, that the reason I have not taken a course to make my life easier,is not because i don't want to.There is simply no money left in the budget to do so. I have successfully programmed several parts on MC but only basic ones.Using my old program I have written about 2,000 programs or more.As much as I would like to I have not been able to achieve the same results with MC.

I am using the program called "router entry 8.1"

[BlueBeard]

I'm always lurking but rarely post. However, I thought I'd chime in this time.

 

I feel the training is a must. What worked for me was playing with Mastercam for a month PRIOR to taking the class. Doing this allowed me to ask specific questions of the instructor.

[gcode]

puzzlemaker,

If you did a default install, you have

a Mill/Design tutorial at C:/MCAM9/Tutorial.

You also have 12 meg worth of sample files at

C:/Mcam9/Mill/MC9/Samples. I think that many of these sample files are demoed step by step in the user manual that came with your purchase.

There are also sample 3D, highspeed, and mulitaxis sample files, but they will not work in a Level 1 seat.

 

If you are not sure what level you bought, open Mastercam and hit ALT V. That will tell you your SIM level. (Entry , 1 2 or 3)

You can get a more detailed view of your SIM

by doubleclicking C:/MCAM9/hasp9.exe

 

Once you know that, you can find out what features you do or don't have at www.mastercam.com.

Have fun and welcome to the forum

[Doug]

All the Manuals are on line just hit alt H.

[Trevor Bailey]

Puzzle....,

 

One thing you may want to do is contact other wood workers directly and ask them your questions that are particular to your application.

[chris m]

I'm suprised I didn't take a bigger beating after I went home last night, whew!

 

Mr. Puzzlemaker, I read in one of your posts that you are using a Router product, which I have never seen or used so I don't know much about it. That being said, I think you would greatly benefit from at least one of the introductory training courses that should be offered by your reseller. I don't know how long of a trip that is for you; I am lucky to be only about an hour from my reseller (Services 4 Automation, plug, plug) and have taken one course there so far (signed up for 2 more). You would be amazed at how much stuff there is in the software that you wouldn't find on your own. I took a V9 mill course and for 3 days all you could hear was guys saying "Wow, that's really a time-saver" and "Geez, I wish I'd known about that before now"; these were, for the most part, people who had used an earlier version of MC or another package and all of us had been in the trade for several years at the minimum.

 

If it is your company, it is well worth the $1,000 or whatever to get properly acquainted with the product; the hours you'll save and the things you'll be able to do will pay you back in short order.

 

C

 

[ 04-18-2003, 02:45 PM: Message edited by: chris m ]

[Toolfab]

You see Puzzle,

 

You can get all the help you need right here (Lord knows I need it and get it here) if you phrase your questions directly and politely. The classes are a huge asset and a great help, but EVERYONE understands budget crunches. So hang around, and keep posting!

 

Welcome to the forum...