O/T California recall

[Jack Mitchell]

Over the past few months, one of America's most productive states, with the world's fifth largest economy (appr. 13% of the nation's GDP), is going to the polls to elect a new governor.

 

I don't understand American politics well enough to know how or why a tremendously expensive recall is occuring, nor why a politician that spent millions to force this issue has chose not to run for such.

 

Not to encite anything here but a polite debate as to who you might vote for and why you might think your preferance would be an improvement of the current elected official.

 

In Canada, we do not have the opportunity of such a recall - we just learn to bend over for a minimum of three years.

 

Let's try to be kind this week and appreciate everybody's viewpoint.

 

 

Regards, Jack

[kathy]

Okay Jack - I'll bite!

 

What a circus California has become. Oh - and I can’t wait for James to weight in on this one. (picture of me sitting here with a big grin on my face…Bring it on)

 

Do I dare spell it out that the Republicans engineered our state’s energy crisis that bleed most of the budget. Dick Cheney & Enron anyone?

 

If Gov. Gray Davis is removed from office - automatically Lt. Gov. Cruz Bustamant will become governor and it should be all over. Anyone want to research this for me?

 

Kathy

 

I need to write my Aunt & Uncle in Texas back - they emailed me and asked why I’m not one of the 135 running!! Do I dare tell them that I don’t want to be in New Mexico this time of year?

[SVO]

Ok Jack I’ll bite,

I haven’t been following the recall and I’m not from California, but I do have an opinion. I’ve never cared much for Gray Davis. However I will say that I don’t think any one person can single-handedly put any particular state in financial jeopardy. It’s always bad policies coupled with bad people who think their above the rest and need not answer to anyone. History shows higher or increased taxes are not the answer to their irresponsible spending practices. And it’s not just Cali, several states are in a pinch. I think it’s time for all of them to buckle down and start watching where and on what their spending our money on, and start holding people accountable who abuse the system. I don’t get it. They will prosecute people for downloading music off the internet (which I agree with), but the people draining the system of money aren’t being watched. I’m getting off the subject here…I better go….

Dan

[Jimmy Wakeford from Barefoot CNC]

California???????

Same place that let the "hug a tree" people run wild.. What? THEY are using too much electricity??? Rolling blackouts??? NO! Cut the trees.

 

Sorry. I just think if you are going to be against something you should have to back it up.

ie: If you "say" you are against cutting timber and dont live in a plastic house then you are to be dismissed as a poser. (Poser=someone who talks big but does little!)

 

If people had to back up beliefs with actions then there would be no liberals, (We'd shoot them on sight down here. Rock on G.W. Bush!!)

 

Jimmy (aka not bite, Jack, but HOOK, LINE AND SINKER EDM!)

 

[ 08-18-2003, 02:05 AM: Message edited by: Jimmy Wakeford, from Barefoot CNC ]

[Fig sign]

Hello, All !

The easiest thing to insult ,abuse and hurt people is to talk about politics .

The funniest thing is that no one is thinking that they both (he and opponent ) can be right or both wrong .

It recalls me of a story of one famous Tatarian

wise man Babakay Suduk ,who once met two people desperatly arguing (about politics, perhaps).

Here comes a wise man , he will judge us! they said .

So one of them told his version of things and Babakay said:

You are absolutly right.

The second one told his and once more he said :

You are absolutly right.

Now there was the third guy nearby who said:

But they both cannot be right and once more Babakay said:

You are absolutly right !

The message that I want to say is this :

Let`s stay away from politics here , this b@##$&*

can divide us ,abuse,insult and make the worst enemies ever !

Let`stalk about CNC, life, love, women, sport, children, jokes, sausages,whatever you wish but let us stay away from politics !

 

Iskander the pacifier :}

 

[ 08-18-2003, 05:49 AM: Message edited by: plasttav ]

[KJS]

Just some quick facts on California's recall law. According to their law if a recall election goes to the polls the ballots look like this: The first question ask if the voter wants the governor recalled and the second question ask which candidate you want. So in theory Gray Davis could survive a recall vote and still loose his job if he doesn't win the popular vote. It's kind of weird but that's fitting for California. Whoever does win will be the caption of a sinking ship, the state already has a 38billion budget deficet.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

quote:

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Do I dare spell it out that the Republicans engineered our state’s energy crisis that bleed most of the budget. Dick Cheney & Enron anyone?

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Actually, this statement is patently false. The REAL reason behind the energy crisis is that fact that the tree hugging liberald woudl not allow any new powerplants to be built ANYWHERE! So you add 50 or 60 million new people to the state over time and voila, not enough power for everybody. Enter Enron the energy broker. They sold contracts to the State of California brokered by the idiot errrr. Governor Davis, at extremely high rates and we're paying for that now. So if we really want to find out who is behind this mess, look no further than the Democraps!

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

quote:

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The first question ask if the voter wants the governor recalled and the second question ask which candidate you want.

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This paprt is true. There only has to be a simple majority for Davis to get the boot.

 

quote:

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So in theory Gray Davis could survive a recall vote and still loose his job if he doesn't win the popular vote.

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This in not correct. His name is not on the ballot. In order for him to survive the recall, there can't be a majority voting to recall the governor. Now here's where it gets interesting. There are over 100 candidates (A record in modern history) running to replace him (so long as a majority vote to recall). It will come down to who gets the most votes after than. So in effect, a candidate with one more vote than the others wins.

 

Hope that clears that up.

 

In another post I wrote that before the Democrats took the Governor's office two elections ago there was a 3 billion budget surplus, I erred. I apologize. It was well over $10 Billion in budget surplus before Democrats.

 

I am a 5th generation Native Californian, and I am just sick to death at what has been done to my state by politicians. They have pillaged our paychecks to death. Not only do I pay a State Income Tax, I pay sales tax on just about everything ('cept food) of 7.75%, over $1k a year in property tax, over $100 for my Vehicle License Fee on a 1998 Saturn Wagon and over $300 on on my 2001 Astro Van. And the fools keep voting Democrat. I just don't get it. Bunch of morons they are. Bunch of stinking morons. I have to live within a budget, why can't the state? Idiots!

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

quote:

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However I will say that I don’t think any one person can single-handedly put any particular state in financial jeopardy. It’s always bad policies coupled with bad people who think their above the rest and need not answer to anyone.

---

This is true. But since Davis is the captain on a sinking ship, he's getting the axe. He shoudl ride the lightning to be made an example of but that's another topic. I blame the entire Democratic party for putting in place fiscal policies designed to drive out manufacturing and businesses. They have just decimated this place and with the Democrats in control, it's only going to get worse. We need more REAL conservatives in power to get this state back where it belongs.

[SVO]

+1

 

I was afraid to go that far in this forum. I'm glad you did James

 

Dan

[A-ron1286490684]

Arnold says he's fiscally conservative and socially liberal... -fair enough, now lets hear him articulate some positions here. Immigration works if we all pull our weight. If you haven’t paid into social security why should your extended family be entitled to these funds at the expense of those who have? Just when does feel good legislation become illogical!? -When your states credit rating is just above junk bond status?

 

My wife works for a county hospital and take it from someone who knows first hand, and this is my politically correct, nuetered version; there are numerous ways to receive free health care without paying into the system. On top of this we are already taxed to the hilt. On tobacco and gasoline we pay taxes on taxes. And if the legislators are largely responsible for the budget then Davis’ recall is the warning shot across the bow.

 

My wife and I make a combined income of over 100k and still cannot afford a nice house in a decent neighborhood in the Bay Area here unless it’s cup o’noodles, goodwill clothes and a daily ride on a bus with the pungent smell of urine and all the graffity you can stand to look at. We have a little condo and according to the number crunchers we will be right in line when they increase taxes for the "wealthy".

 

The Boston Tea Party was a revolt over a three percent tax. Is it suprising that we are recalling a governer that can’t supply us with reasonable power rates and reasonable transportation fees after we average 38 percent straight off the top of our earnings. And after this we get taxed as we spend it, save it and invest it. Of coarse this before we give what we are left with back to the government when we die.

 

Davis and our legislators raised state spending by 40 percent over the last six years! But the special interest groups scream about starving babies and lack of funding for needle exchange programs if we cut state spending by 6 percent to balance the budget. As far as the cost of this special election being a waste of money, consider the fact that it will cost every DOCUMENTED man, woman and child a little over a dollar to change a situation in which every DOCUMENTED man, woman, and child, thanks to the state deficit, now owes over a thousand dollars. The interest alone on the money we borrowed to meet California payroll costs more daily than a one-time recall election.

 

A side note for the mention of Cheney and Enron… First Enron paid no taxes between 1996 and 1999, -not one dollar. We all know who was president then. Secondly, I seem to remember shortly after the Enron fiasco that Davis had to dismiss a staff member who was ALSO an Enron board member. Maybe that had something to do with the inflated rates we now buy power at.

 

Davis and the Dems will try to tie all this in a neat little bundle and heap it on Bush’s doorstep. IMHO Iraq and oil do have everything to do with our California situation and the national economy. In any situation you have to follow the money trail. We are an energy-starved state and to an extent, an energy starved country. The environazis won’t let us drill for oil or natural gas off the coast of California or in Alaska and our utility bills are through the roof, (for another six years to come according to the contracts California signed with big energy suppliers). Maybe if we didn't have these "out of sight out of mind" or "not in my backyard" policies, we might not be in Iraq right now ensuring a steady supply of oil for the fifth largest economy in the world and the rest of the country for that matter. Oh, yeah and defending human rights violations and all that.

 

Lets face it we are all not going to peddle our bikes to work as the politicians pass us by in their limos. Doesn’t it bother anyone else that the xxxx we buy oil off now are plotting our demise, (and bankrolling it), while they smile through their filthy beards, publish anti-American, anti-Semetic lies, and run TV ads here in America telling us what a bunch of great friends they are.

 

Something needed to be done here and if it’s the cost of the special election that is bothering some people then you might want to also look into all the social programs that take a huge bite out of your check every week. Aids Prevention Program money is now being used for classes on how to best meet gay singles. These are passed and or implemented without us even knowing it. Like when Barbara Diaz (D) passed a law making the security guards at the government buildings elligible for the same state employee retirement benefits as real peace officers -and it took 45 seconds to present and vote into law. Can you say union lobbyist vote guarantees? 10 BILLION IN 45 SECONDS OVER THE NEXT TEN YEARS. I hope this sends a message to both parties. It shouldn’t be so easy to spend OUR money!

 

As far as the cost of this election it's the best three dollars my wife, my daughter and I ever spent.

[Rick McAllister]

What started out as a legitiment effort to sack a bumbling politician has become a farce (happens in other states also). My vote is for the porn star because I feel she is a True People Person!

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

Nice A-Ron.

 

Yeah $100k up there in the Bay Area is like $40-$50k down here. I feel for you.

 

quote:

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Can you say union lobbyist vote guarantees? 10 BILLION IN 45 SECONDS OVER THE NEXT TEN YEARS. I hope this sends a message to both parties.

---

Yeah, those Union crooks.... supposed to be out there for the "Little Guy" but really they are "The Man" keeping the little guy down.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

I'm still not sure who I am going to Vote for. I'm leaning towards McClintok. Arnold is out pretty much. I know he's hiring Warren Buffet but, I want a true conservative. Because soon enough if you're a "Social" conservative, it'll bleed into your fiscal policies.

 

JM2C

[A-ron1286490684]

I'll probly watch the polls and vote for the guy or gal without a (D) after their name with the best chance of beating Bustamonte. I like McClintok myself but my second choice is Simon, third the Austrian -although he has seemed to waffle to the PC police already and I'm not crazy about a vote for a prop 13 repeal.

 

[ 08-18-2003, 03:27 PM: Message edited by: A-ron ]

[Scott Bond]

quote:

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vote for the guy or gal without a (D) after their name

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SCOTT teh' closet republican

[Surface]

Recalls can be launched to remove corrupt officials, and to remove officials whose policies and performance are found wanting. This action is taken agaist an idividual and not a party.

So what would happen if Davis were to step down? The Lieutenant Governor would step in as acting Governer, but would that also force a new election? What would that do to the current recall inititive?

 

[ 08-18-2003, 03:56 PM: Message edited by: Surface ]

[Ripper3785]

Don't put ideas into Grey Davis' head please!

[Scott Bond]

This is a great question

quote:

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So what would happen if Davis were to step down? The Lieutenant Governor would step in a acting Governer, but would that also force a new election?

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Yes

He didn't step down, the Dem's supported his ways,so now if the recall goes thru, he leave's.

 

coulda, shoulda, woulda

[CAM-mando]

CAM (lives in PA) lurks, bites tongue, takes oppurtunity to say hello to Jack and logs off.

 

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

quote:

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The Lieutenant Governor would step in a acting Governer, but would that also force a new election? What would that do to the current recall inititive?

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Great question. If the turd were to step down, the recall election would still be in effect. If he were to step down today, Bustamonte woudl be in until the election. See, what many don't understand is that the recall is waged against an office not an individual. Bustamonte is "Davis Light" IMNSHO

[A-ron1286490684]

quote:

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Don't put ideas into Grey Davis' head please!

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Why start now?

 

-And Mr. McAllister I thought you refused to talk politics?

But your right it would be interesting to see Mary Carey out on the campaign trail "pressing the meat" as they say.

 

[ 08-18-2003, 05:32 PM: Message edited by: A-ron ]

[Surface]

Artical 2 SEC. 13. says "Recall is the power of the electors to remove an elective officer."

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

Power to the people! Power to the people!

 

Send him packin'. Doens't want to fess up that his regime plunged California into financial disaster. I still think he needs to Ride the Lightning! Or get the tree! You KNOW if this was the 1800's the issue wouldn't be weather he stays in office or not, it's weather he lives or dies.

[Ripper3785]

James,

 

get my email?

 

Ripper teh Jr. Thread Hijacker