Mastercam X

[robk]

quote:

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Maintenance is paid and i cant wait to get it.just send it im ready.

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+1

Now give it to me

[Teh Bear without Brains kinda idiot]

I never jump to anything .

When we will have Mastercam X first of all I will read all documentation ,manuals ,help ,will go through examples ,then will play with it a bit ,then start from simple things slowly going to the complex ones .

LIke I alwais did with all MC versions and all Cad-Cam programs that I had .

When I feel that it will be safe I would go with it ,but I never "jump "

I am cautious and prefer to know problems and limitations ,and they allways exist

I prefer to wait more for stable release ,rather to get a buggy ,raw one and I hope MCX will be solid -proof and stable as Rock !

 

Teh cautious

[biss03]

Rekd, who were you aiming that at?

[Tim Aydt Prototek Engineering]

+1 Rekd

[Rekd™]

That was aimed at Maddud, not you biss.

[Diablo God]

quote:

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It's called competition. It's good that you're staying with 8, and not on the Maint, because you're making your parts more expensive than I am, which means I'm prolly the guy that underbid you and got that $30,000.00 order.

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I kinda doubt it. I am still very efficient in mcam8. 99% of jobs are broken down into 3 ways of programming. Pocket, drill, and contour. Unless I missed something reading and playing with my friends shops version of mcam9, I did not see anything that would of made me that much slower. If anything I found the wcs system kinda annoying. It kept forcing wrong views on me, which just irritated me instead of speeding me up.

 

Thing is, I can still do any job with mcam8. Why I love mastercam. I can do anything with it. Now I am not saying their was not a few glitches that they fixed in mcam9 that could of helped to. I just couldnt justify the costs to upgrade it.

 

One thing I have to comment. Being I started my company oct 1997 right at the worse time possible. And outlived 8 other shops in my court. And in that time grew to 3 horizontals, 3 verticals, 1 2 axis lathe, and 1 8 axis lathe. I doubt I have been underbid or lost jobs due to running mcam 8.

 

If they fixed one certain thing about mastercam. I would most likely purchase the new version. And the one thing is to be able to move a solid, or rotate it. With out owning solids on a computer I would purchase it. I design alot of my own parts on mastercam solids. And find it so annoying I have to convert to a iges file, So the 2 other workstations we have can translate and move geo into the right spot. I dont have a need to purchase 3 seats of solids. I only need one seat.

 

Jim

[J Coulston]

I will start the rumor, I was told by a friend of a freind of a guy who knows somthing that when CNC has a recieved a certain predetermine number of "I am waiting with baited breath !!! they are going to release X.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

quote:

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...So the 2 other workstations we have can translate and move geo into the right spot...

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WCS would solve this problem if you took the time to learn how it works. It is a VERY useful tool. For me this feature alone is worth the price of admission.

 

JM2C

 

quote:

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,,,when CNC has a recieved a certain predetermine number of "I am waiting with baited breath !!! they are going to release X...

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That's funny. I started the poll, nobody told me to or asked me to, I was just wondering because some members have asked about this or that regarding X so I was curious as to what the consensus was about it. Obviously I can't speak for CNC but I would have to say that somebody is pulling your weiner!

 

JM2C

[Dan_AKA_ROY]

My company seems reluctant to get on the maint. program.

 

They feel when they purchased V.9 mill level 3 with solids mastercam assured them all updates within the same version were free. Nowhere was a maintenance update [and fees] mentioned as a possibility when they signed the dotted line.

 

My company's bosses feel maintenance - with its associated costs - should have been announced much earlier and should have been held off till version X.

 

They believe the "free version X if on the maintenance program" is a bit misleading when further analyzed.

 

Analogy given to me: no maintenance fee was ever mentioned as a possibility down the road when V.9 was bought. All subsequent updates and point versions and service packs within V.9 would be downloaded at no extra charge. Now after being told different comes "V.X comes at no extra charge if on maint." However, this is not accurate according to my company and can be misleading. In other words, yes there is a charge for V.X EVEN WITH maintenance. Their reasoning? Maintenance renewal every year. The maint. fee pays for V.X., but, next year's maintenance fee will not be covered as it will still apply to version X. And, down the line, when other versions come out, the same thing recycles again and again.

 

Summary: Maintenance is important, of course. Our company feels it would have liked to know about it BEFORE purchasing mastercam 2 years ago. This would certainly not have affected their decision to purchase MC and would have actually fostered better relations. Bottom line: Our company understands why maintenance was incorporated and agrees wholeheartedly. It was the timing of it that irked them.

 

Side Note: My company knows nothing about cadcam/cnc stuff. But that should not be a criteria for their assessment. What they do know and know very well - multi-millions in sales, manufactured in house thus high profit margin - is how to run a business. Their analogy of the maintenance program is based off of their savvy knowhow from a business point of view.

[Rekd™]

quote:

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If anything I found the wcs system kinda annoying. It kept forcing wrong views on me, which just irritated me instead of speeding me up.

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Chalk it up to ignorance. I feel your pain. I was the same way when I didn't understand it. The WCS is still not perfect, but absolutely kicks xxxx over the old way of doing it. There's a tutorial for the WCS on the FTP site. It really does speed things up.

 

Also, the speed increases in things like verify and toolpath crunching is awsome. ( I don't have maint yet, but I've heard the toolpaths are lightning fast now!) You'll spend twice as long verifying your first operation as I'll spend verifying my 112 operations.

 

As for when you started your company, the company I'm at started almost 2 years ago. They didn't have a machine on the floor when I interviewed with them, now we have 5 VF-3's, all with 4th Axis and Gerardi tombstones. Sounds like you've got a nice setup going, but I'll still be able to underbid you.

 

I don't know how proficient you are, but I know if I were still using 8, I would NEVER be able to do the things I do as quickly as I do them with 9.1. Never. Ever.

 

Just to wet your whistle, look at some of the VBS functions I'm using in the right mouse button menu when you click on the grafix window.

 

 

Lastly, if you were using the WCS, you would NEVER need to move/rotate your geometry again. You just create a view that's reletive to the face you're machining, and when you click Top View, it orients it to the view you defined. You can also, which CNC Software left out, but somebody found a fix, rotate and move the WCS even after it's been created.

 

You really do owe it to yourself to let a dealer show you what's new. Not just looking at you're buddy's and asking him.

 

'Rekd

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

quote:

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...Our company feels it would have liked to know about it BEFORE purchasing mastercam 2 years ago...

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Maintenance was not even being discussed openly to the best of my knowledge at that point, and even if it was, it was not actually implemented until late last year (6 months ago), so at the time of the sale there was no intention of Maintenance being part of Mastercam's general practice so even though you have not outright said it, you were not intentionally decieved regardless of how you feel. I'm sure you can relate to business climates changing right?

[gcode]

quote:

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you were not intentionally decieved regardless of how you feel

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James, you've got it all wrong.

Mastercam maintenance is another devious plot

by George Bush and those horrible neocons.

Kerry has promised to correct this injustice

as soon as he takes office.

[gcode]

On the serious side;

 

Last week I was trying to talk my boss into putting another Mastercam SIM on maintenance.

He told me that he's done with Mastercam and

we're switching to CATIA V5.

Yesterday they came and installed a couple of seats. I'm #3 in line for CATIA school so it will be a while till I get to start using it.

It sure looks different from Mastercam

 

gcode teh traitor

 

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

quote:

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...he's done with Mastercam...

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What prompted this?

[gcode]

quote:

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What prompted this

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Some of our work is very complex 5X stuff.

He feels that we will be more efficient with CATIA. Almost all our customers use CATIA as well.

Associativity issues were also a factor.

Mastercam maintenance had nothing to do will it.

We've got 10 seats of MC and I'm sure we'll continue to use them. Its just going to be that much harder getting the budget to keep up to date.

If I want to use X at work, I'll have to bring my personal seat in.

[crazy^millman]

That seems funny to me Madbub. If you have an 8 axis machine and only do pocket work why have an 8 axis machine. If you have hortizonal machines and only do holes and pockets again why even have a cam program could wrtie macros for all of it and could have saved the three seat if that is all you do. Now if you are doing Multiaxis work and 3d machining alot more than you want to lead on then think you need to take Matt aka Rekd's advice and have a dealer show you what V9 can do head and shoulders above V8. The multiaxis toolpaths for doing 4th axis work alone kick V8 in the head as fas as I am concerned. I have to also agree that VB is a tool you are not using and I can see a 50% reduction in time on some things just using the scripts verse's the old method. The ATP scripting that Mick is getting fine tuned woud ltkae alot of your 2d bring it and write toolpaths automatically from paramters you have set-up in minutes with only a few mouse clicks if all you are doing is 2d work. Again may be getting you by but you have no idea how good it is to have 6 sessions of Mastercam up and cruching toopaths on 2 and flipping between the others doing work and showing employees things about others that I can on the Xeon I got here. I am doing a Scallop toolpath cruch in one program doing a surface rough poeckt crunch in another doing modeling in yet another as I also type this response. You own your own business good for you but to say you are fine where you are and not need V9 then might need to open your eyes little bit and see what si out there. BTW X so rocks that you will do alot of a favor if we are your competion by never going past V8. Good luck and much repsect to your accomplishment but did you start the buisness to be the best at what you do or just able to get by. Do you only get junk to endmills to cut parts with or do you spedn that extra few dollars to get the good stuff that last 10 times longer. Mastercam toolpath cruches alone and others things you need if trying to expand your market share are what it gives you. I know you would not get alot of our work just in the fact you said 2D work is your bread and butter.

 

God spead and Peace.

[Dan_AKA_ROY]

I love mastercam and my company is very impressed with what it can do. Let me expound on this further...

 

They do NOT feel they were deceived. They just feel when it was announced it should have been implemented with the start of version X.

 

An analogy: We make a spoiler for a 2003 Dodge Neon. We make modifications, improvements as we go along. The 'updated' spoilers are still for 2003 models. And the cost that goes into improvements does not get passed down to the consumer. However, we do charge more when the 2004 Neon spoilers - with the improvements, enhancements, etc., come out. We make sure our customers are aware of this with a proper advanced warning, so to speak. And they really appreciate that and keep coming back.

 

I know a spoiler is not a cadcam software and this analogy is not fullproof, but you get the jest of what I'm trying to bring forth. But, yes, apples are not oranges.

 

quote:

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Maintenance was not even being discussed openly to the best of my knowledge at that point, and even if it was, it was not actually implemented until late last year (6 months ago), so at the time of the sale there was no intention of Maintenance being part of Mastercam's general practice

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Ergo! It should have been implemented with the start of version X. It would have been a nice jesture to MC's loyal, paying customers, to finish updating V9 to full maturity and start maint. beginning with X.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

OIC.....

 

Boy, wait till he see's his annual maintenance bill. I hope he brought extra diapers!!!!

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

Yeah, I would have to agree implementing that in the middle of a release was pretty cheezy! Though I believe that with the additional stuff that you have in V9.1 It's almost a new release.

 

Starting with X would have been the more prudent thing, then again, the resellers probably could not afford to wait another year without a new release, which would have brought the total to 3+ years between V9 and X.

[Dan_AKA_ROY]

Good point made concerning the resellers having to wait 3+ years for a new release. They also have to put food on their tables. Didn'tthink along those terms. Makes sense to me.

 

IF I owned our company, maint. would have been purchased from its inception.

 

I also think some companies, mine included, have had subpar years. When the economy gets back to full swing, we will update. At least, thats what I've been harping on them to do.

 

Considering what MC can do, the associated costs are minor in retrospect.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

CNC does have to look out for their resellers. The Mastercam reseller network is the envy of the entire CAD/CAM industry. Because by and large they take very good care of their customers, and very knowledgeable, and last but not least, they help make CNC Software as successful as they are.

 

JM2C

[Teh Bear without Brains kinda idiot]

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If they fixed one certain thing about mastercam. I would most likely purchase the new version. And the one thing is to be able to move a solid, or rotate it. With out owning solids on a computer I would purchase it.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

There is a way ,but you would never know ,you do not read O/T

And I am serious

[Diablo God]

Millman Ill try to respond tonight, not ignoring your post.

 

Winnie I didnt say I dont read the ot. I actualy enjoy them. It is actualy kinda refreshing to see people with the same thought process about politics or what ever. I merely suggest a seperate forum :/

 

But I myself do not necesarily have time to read through them all.

 

Anyhow, when reading my post you have to imagine me smiling. or people might seem to think I am just bitter and angry, which I am not.

 

Jim

[Müřlıń®]

roflmao>>>>>>gCODE!!!

 

 

mURLIN TEH lolo...that messed me up

[Teh Bear without Brains kinda idiot]

Madbub !

Being a p**ck I can say only this :

This is o/T thread without O/T mark which I wrote been actually not myself ,or rather someone else wrote beeng actually related very close to me .

It is rather funny and simple and legal too

Look on this thead

http://***.********.***/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=******;p=*

 

Hope that helps

Well ,what ever you can expect from *****