Smoking a toolmaker

[Kenneth Potter]

Simply put !!!!!!!!!!!

 

Dont burn your bridges....You will need them to cross back over again!

[Jack K]

Excuse me who is the prima donna here?

 

jk

[Scott Bond]

quote:

---

Excuse me who is the prima donna here?

---

ME AT 24 YEARS OLD.

[Jack Mitchell]

Smoking and wishing that I never started.

 

To make a long story short, I destroyed the senior toolmaker.

 

I produced the exact same job the that he had made in 9 and 1/2 hours. - he took five weeks and was too busy throwing in my face all along the way. I essentially have been on a slow burn for that long period of time.

I regret misusing this forum as a vent - but hey, don't we all?

 

As others had suggested, he doesn't comprehend what it is that I did to him, - only now does he realize the magnitude. How could anybody possibly know the pain & shame of him hiding the third set of material within the stockroom.

I am ashamed of myself for attacking this man - if you can imagine, I am hurt more by this than even him. - he doesn't know what the hell hit him - but I know he is hurt.

I have to tell the supervisor to backoff - this will happen immediately.

 

Here is what I have learned from the entire ordeal.

Never, ever, consider yourself above another person.

Never, ever, condone another man for his race or culture.

Treat all cnc operators or toolmakers with dignity - otherwise somebody somewhere will always better you.

Work together in harmony it will only make you stronger.

There is nothing wrong with earning your paycheck - so hang in there, enjoy your job, your family, and your peers.

 

I do not want this man to quit his job, nor do I wish to see him abused or fired. He needs to learn a healthier value system if he is to remain within it. I am likely the only person that would welcome him back into our department, but I'm afraid it's not my decision - but that of my co-workers. Can you imagine having your bench moved right in front of the supervisors office?

 

What really brought this home to me was his attempt to hide the material for the third set.

How could he possibly proceed to spend anymore time on this particular job when he knows that I smoked him in one day?

 

The pain I feel inside is almost unbearable.

How could I do this to another person?

This is the cheapest and sleaziest of things that I have ever done.

I just don't know how to cope with this - I expected to become noticed as a good toolmaker, but not at the expense of another persons dignity or self worth.

 

Abuse me, I know that I have it coming.

 

Regards, Jack

[rottncf]

Live and Learn.

 

Les.

[David S]

quote:

---

To make a long story short, I destroyed the senior toolmaker.

 

I produced the exact same job the that he had made in 9 and 1/2 hours. - he took five weeks and was too busy throwing in my face all along the way

---

"the exact same job": Making the very first piece of this job, You (toolmaker/cnc machinist)have to deal with those messy blue prints we, the engineers, gave to you; have to go back and forth with desingers and project managers to clear up many questions; then planing the best way to build the project, finding right material and setting up all the tools.... When you make the second piece of the "the exact same job", the only thing you have to do is making it with the "first piece set up". Question: without his FIRST PIECE EXPERIENCES, can you make the second piece in 9 and 1/2 hours?

 

I would not say you "destroyed the senior toolmaker". It has just proven you are not "monkeys and button pushers". It is a very good beginning.

 

You are nice person with a good heart. You people will get along fine. Just give each other some time.

 

"Live and Learn" is a great line.

 

[ 07-24-2002, 11:05 PM: Message edited by: David S ]

[JOVATO8]

I agree to a point.

I trained mainly under European Tool & Die makers

as A kid in Chicago.I was taught how to run manual lathes,mills,edm and anything related to machining I can do most everything on these machines.

But I also know things change,so I changed.

While I still have the skills which have been very useful even now.I grab at any knowledge

I can get.

Not all tool-makers are the same,some bad some good.

Just like some cnc guys out there who can talk it but not do it.

I make a pretty good living at this and have always tried to help and train everyone I hire

and push them to learn as much as possible.

If and when they move on I am very HAPPY for them.

Oh yes, I have met many prima donas who learn how to set-up and program conversational machines come in and fall flat on their face.I do not get in their face about their attitude or bring up what they said when they first came to work for me .I just try tp help them.

I hope this trade is as good to all as it has been to me.

Over the years I have had MAZAKS, FADALS,HASS,MORIES,DAEWOOS,PUMAS,OKUMAS,ETC. AND ENJOYED THEM ALL.

 

Have a GREAT DAY!

Your old GEEZER

Joe

[Michael Reynolds]

Ok, I haven't posted in a while, but I gotta ring in on this one. I started as a toolmaker, became a programmer, then a professor of machine tool tech. I know that some toolmakers are arrogant (some without warrent). I regard myself as an excellent toolmaker who has a lifetime of learning ahead. Does that make me a "primadonna"? I don't think so. Don't get me wrong, I'm not ranting.

 

How about the other side of the coin? I've seen quite a few "primadonna" engineers/programmers who couldn't program themselves out of a wet cardboard box. Are all engineers like that? NO.

 

In my opinion, more than half of the job of a programmer is knowing HOW to machine a part efficiently, and THAT is where a toolmaker's knowledge and experience shines.

 

Additionally, I see the role of machinist/toolmakers shifting into the cadcam/programmer's arena (which makes perfect sense to me).

 

Humbly stated by:

 

Mike R.

[JOVATO8]

Thanks! Mike

 

Have to learn to walk before you run.

I think you know what I mean.

 

GOD BLESS ALL

JOE

[Andy]

What I've learned during the 40 years in the trade:

The most important thing is the knowledge of the trade.

Learn from everyone, friend or foe.

Dont let emotions and ego interfere with learning.

Humility, patience and discipline will succeed.

Trust your abilities, ignore insults show respect to all.

If you really work at it, you can make the aholes like you.

Get paid, its tough work! If your really lucky, like me, you love the trade.

[Jayson Kramer]

Andy I follow some of your thoughts myself.

I try and get along with every body.

 

JM2C

[Greg Williams]

There is an old saying that fits perfectly here,

 

YOU MEET THE SAME PEOPLE ON THE WAY UP, AS YOU DO ON THE WAY DOWN.

 

Don't burn your bridges

[mold100]

Sorry to bring it back top but,ive been M.I.A. for a few weeks.I to like many others started in a pattern like this-Radial Drill,Bridgeport(with a volstro&Turntable),Lathe,grinder,Manual E.D.M..As equipment came in most were leary of it but I will step up to any challange.The fisrt CNC I ran I didnt know a g-code

from an area code.NO CAM just a book for a completely differant machine,The old guys laughed,the

machine wasnt used for 9 years,I had to re-wire myself on my own time,just so they wouldnt get me fired for F______g off while I could have been laying my print over my block roughing in a die cast runner.

Low and behold within a week I fumbled it around and it was running,2 weeks I was making parts,less than year the shop bought a brand new FADAL and a seat of smartscam,out with the old in with the new.The old guys werent happy,they would call me names get me in trouble,But I still respected theyre knowledge.Some people are set in their ways,Besides I was only 20 years old and already a journeyman.I went through the same thing where I work now,when I started they had 2 old cnc burners and four manuals,guess why the cncs were old?They didnt know how to use them.2 years later I was running the department and now have two Makino ednc 65s.And 3 Makino mills.The toolmakers still

complain we need more manuals,(BUT THE BOSS KNOWS WHOSE MAKING THE $$$$$$$$$$$).So

keep your head up,If you humiliate him,you can never ask him anything,and the man up stairs forgive you if you cant figure something out,the toolmaker will be the first to show your failures.Sorry so long but hey,Smoke him

[Jack Mitchell]

Administrator - please kill this thread.

 

I do not wish to hurt anybody any more.

I am no longer angry at this person.

 

The senior toolmakers bench is directly in front of the supervisors office.

Even though I asked the supervisor to back-off on this issue - he still remains there, like a dunce in the corner of the schoolroom.

 

This is one extremly pissed-off toolmaker, If looks could kill - I would be a blood spot and nothing more; I actually fear he might attack me, or worse, he might bring along some kind of automatic weapon.

 

In retrospect, I'm glad that I served him up - I am however, disturbed by the abrupt or vicious result.

 

Regards, Jack (Your humble production machinist)

[Kenneth Potter]

I feel your pain,But keep in mind that he was out to dog you out& it back fired on him.

 

This guy in what I call MR TERRITORIALIST.Scared for his job he will play mind games costing you & your company wasted profits.How many times have this guy pulled this crap & gotten away with it? You Exposed him & ya find yourself in a one on one war That he started so dont feel bad.

 

Live & learn