Hacked CAD/CAM

[Rekd™]

Wow, what a topic!

 

As soon as I got to James' post, I stopped, got a stiff Rum & Coke, and sat back to watch the feathers fly! Haven't seen a topic go off like this for a while.

I'm glad everyone's happy with everyone else in the end though.

 

Tough topic, Piracy. It affects all legit users, and has a more profound affect on software developers, resellers, and others. All you can do is report them. Then, if 6 months later they're still using it, report them again.

 

I understand James' frustration. I also understand Brian's position, but think some comments were a bit extreme on both sides. Of course, I'm not one to talk. (And have been asked not to concerning certain subjects on this forum..) It's kinda funny how people on the same side tend to fight each other while fighting for the same cause.

 

James, keep up the great posts here. You're a key member in this forum.

 

-Rekd

 

[ 07-25-2002, 08:01 PM: Message edited by: Rekd ]

[gcode]

Brian,

You asked Arty to turn in the pirate shops he knows. I hate to say it, but I know of more pirate shops than I do legit shops. The ratio is about 4 pirates to every legit shop.

 

Last year when I was looking for work, every shop

I interviewed with was running bootleg MC. I turned a couple of jobs down cause I didn't want to work for pirates.

I'm working at a legit shop now, but there are very few of them out there.

 

As a legal owner of Mastercam, it makes me very angry watching people use for free something I have worked very hard to buy. The simple fact is, if I ratted out every pirate shop I know, I would

be the Typhoid Mary of Southern California in very short order, so I keep my mouth shut

 

[ 07-25-2002, 11:45 PM: Message edited by: gcode ]

[David S]

quote:

---

be prepared to give me your Name, Company Name, Mastercam Dealer and their phone number.

---

Yeah! And your mother's maiden name, last four digits of your S.S.#., a copy of your finger print, your latest passport photo, your blood type....

 

Thank God I do not need NOTHING from you. I still want to keep my DNA my self.

 

Since I can not find out who is "legal/illegal" (and I do not want to find out either), I will offer my help to who ever need it in this forum because there is nothing as simple as 1+1=2. I do not play Cop, judge or lord here. Like every other forum members, I am helping and being helped here, in this MasterCam users forum.

 

Doctors help patient never ask:" Are you my friend?"

 

Again, making, selling and using illegal copy of MasterCam is wrong. MasterCam should go after it. I do not have ability to catch any one but, I do have my clean conscience as a "legal user".

 

James, I am glad you stay in the forum even though we have different point of view.

 

Thank you!

 

[ 07-26-2002, 08:13 AM: Message edited by: David S ]

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

quote:

---

Yeah! And your mother's maiden name, last four digits of your S.S.#., a copy of your finger print, your latest passport photo, your blood type....

---

Nope, just info I can use to determine the legitimacy of your software seat. I don't even necessarily need/want SIM#.

 

That's OK though David, We can agree to disagree.

 

quote:

---

As soon as I got to James' post, I stopped, got a stiff Rum & Coke, and sat back to watch the feathers fly!

---

ROFL!!!!!!!!!! That's hilarious.

 

[ 07-26-2002, 01:44 AM: Message edited by: James Meyette ]

[Charles Davis]

The music and movie industry are now trying a new tactic, which is flooding the market with bogus bootleg product. For example, a music file that just plays one line over and over.

 

The idea is to make getting a "good" working copy of a hacked product a hit or miss proposition, and such a hassle that people would rather go to legit download sites and pay rather than wade through a lot of junk hoping to get a functional product.

 

This tactic has been found legal by the court system.

 

So how about a bogus hacked version of Mastercam that plays Barry Mantilow and scrolls the mastercam license agreement, and which will only stop when you re-boot your machine.

 

p.s.

It could then detects any mastercam executables in the future, it could lock them out. That way, if they ever install another working bootleg copy, it wouldn't work. Only a program available to the dealer could remove this "sentry". So, you'd have to get legit if you ever wanted to run Mastercam on that computer.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

To do that you'd have to somehow encrypt the registry. ANybody know of this being done?

[Jim Whipple]

Software companies do NOT have the right to poke around in MY computer!!

Just as my government does NOT have the right to tap my phone with out a court order!!!

 

don't get me wrong here ... I am also against pirated software. But the end does not justify the means. When you give up freedom for security....

Jim

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

quote:

---

Software companies do NOT have the right to poke around in MY computer!!

---

Read the EULA from the latest Microsoft Windows Media Player? Do it. You'll be SHOCKED!!!!!

[Jim Whipple]

Read the EULA from the latest Microsoft Windows Media Player? Do it. You'll be SHOCKED!!!!!

 

Where would I find that James?

I'm running Win98

Jim

[Charles Davis]

Now, if you were to create a nasty virus that destroyed files, and were to imbed that in bogus bootleg software, that MIGHT be going too far

 

But installing a sentry to keep a known bootlegger (since they downloaded and installed what they thought was illegal software) from stealing your intellectual property does not seem to be over the line at all!

 

Another idea to prevent bootleggers is to get the National Association of Manufacturers to have a policy to cut off any sub contractor who gets caught using illegal software.

 

[ 07-26-2002, 02:47 PM: Message edited by: Charles Davis ]

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

Actually what would be better is for Tier 1's to require software licence copies to do business and do it on down the line.

[Jim Whipple]

Actually what would be better is for Tier 1's to require software licence copies to do business and do it on down the line.

 

Now THAT's a good idea!!

Jim

[Guest]

what they should do is hire me BIG ART. to scope out shops and bust them. and pay me 5 bucks per shop, so that i can be rich overnight. j/k. i'm not going to lie. i was givin a bootleg copy of mastercam in ver.8 i did use it for the sake of learning only. i don't own a shop. and i will never give it to anyone that has one. but when james M. told me about how bootleggers are taking away from his family and other people who has put hard earned time into this software. i felt like crap. and i started using demo's. it's the guys who own the machine shops and making big money on free software that is ripping mastercam off. and it's not only mastercam. these guys are running everything catia,solidworks,gibbs,edgecam,delcam etc. ALL FOR FREE. i have alot of respect for james and everyone else who BUYS mastercam. this is why i choose to use demo's. now, they might ban me from this form for admitting using a bootleg, and thats cool too. but i have to be honest. what they should do is give a list of all the shops that have legal copy's. and those names who are not on the list. BEWARE. just my two cents.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

I think we'd all have to be banned for using bootleg this or that one time or another. When I had bootleg Mastercam there was no such thing as Demo, not that that makes it OK, it's just you have to realize it's wrong, and you make a change in attitude AND a change in action (i.e. getting on the right side of things).

 

I'd like Mastercam to make their Demo like Surfcam's. You can do everything but post code. You can even save and you have all the functionality of the real program except for posting. The file is written in a format that only Demo will read. This would be a real solution for learning for those that are not eligible for Mastercam Apprenticeship or cannot afford it.

 

C'mon CNC, here's a real good suggestion. "I'd like Mastercam to make their Demo like Surfcam's." Please consider it. It would take away the arguement that "I can't save my work..." from the folks that want to learn but want bootleg because they can save.

[Jim Whipple]

On the other hand...Surfcam is GIVING away 2d Surfcam.

I think the reason Acad is so big today is that reason.

If I had to pay thirteen grand to learn MC I would have found something else to do for a living! There is an opportunity here to grow in the market by doing what Surfcam is doing,

The money is made in the three d stuff,

Just my humble opinion

Jim

[Rekd™]

taken from Microsoft Windows Media Player EULA:

quote:

---

* Digital Rights Management (Security).  You agree that in order to protect the integrity of content and software protected by digital rights management ("Secure Content"), Microsoft may provide security related updates to the OS Components that will be automatically downloaded onto your computer.  These security related updates may disable your ability to copy and/or play Secure Content and use other software on your computer.  If we provide such a security update, we will use reasonable efforts to post notices on a web site explaining the update.

 

---

I particularly like the part where is says 'disable your ability to copy and/or play Secure Content and use other software on your computer. If we provide such a security update, we will use reasonable efforts to post notices on a web site explaining the update.' On what web site... www.yougotownedbymircrosoft.com??

 

LMAO

 

-Rekd

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

Honestly, I don't ever see CNC doing something liek that. Talk about Big Brother. Sheesh. I downloaded that puppy, got ready to install it, read the EULA first, then BAAAAMMMMM, the above statement hit me liek a ton of bricks. No thanks. I'll continue to use Winamp to play my MP3's and use the old Media Player that works just fine.

 

SCARY!!!!!

 

JM2C

[Jack Mitchell]

To add my two cent's on a sensitive issue,

 

Acad is without a doubt the most widely used drawing package in the world today. I believe that if anybody should learn Acad, they would be easily employable since almost everybody uses the software.

 

Acad is what we would consider to be the industrial standard. I know that Solidworks is actually becoming their biggest contender - but that's another story in itself.

 

MASTERCAM IS THE INDUSTRY STANDARD, We the legitamate users and the piracy users did this. CNC Software is the best of breed - the king of beers. Their support is incredible, their patches have always been the standard of which others should be measured. This company actually employes professionals, somebody actually answers the phone.

 

Sure there are other cam solutions out there that are really great, some are even better at certain tasks - I will be the first to admit this and CNC will be the first damn Cam software developer to react with the enhancements. We have all dabbled with the contenders - but always rely on Mastercam to get the job done.

 

Do you have any idea what it feels like to purchase the software and the maintenance agreements for Smartcam & Edgecam only to be dissappointed with the garbage they call support and regular updates? Most of these panti-waste company's are bought & sold so often - that we, the registered users, have given up on wasting our time with their inferior products. (go ahead and buy these back from me - I f__king dare the saleman to crawl in for the beating).

I will however, admit that Surfcam has always fascinated me - but, they dick around with functionality and this pisses me off - so I not wasting any time with it - and, with a whopping 2% share of the market, nobody else is seriously considering it. So much for effective marketing hey guys? (Give the free copy to someone else!)

 

I personally met Bruce Gibbs at the Chicago tool show and marveled at one of the most talented & amazing saleman that I have ever seen - any salesman could take lesson's just watching this guy - No, I didn't but the software, which was the first release of Virtual Gibbs. This man could sell a freezer to an Eskimo - he is amazing beyond words.

 

Hey, it's all good - Cadmax is kick-xxxx, that's only if they still exist. Ironcad is pretty cool, Try Rhino______ (forget how to spell the rest of it)- there's that damn spell check feature that we don't have!!. Think about it for a moment - You are the last word in software development, you are the last word in efficiency, you are the Mac-Daddy of all programmers and machinists. Then you release your greatest software the world has ever seen. - it goes down in flames, get's bought and sold a dozen times, etc!, etc!. Hell, these company's are trying to gain some market share and I can sympathize with this.

 

The piracy problems will always exist - just ask Autodesk.

Basically, I believe that acad became the standard because of piracy, which also attibutes to the cost that we need to pay for the product today.

Mastercam is no different. The popularity of the BEST CAM SOLUTION can also be attributed to the piracy issue.

 

I am surprised to see the anger and passion against those who know the true ratio of legit vs licenced. Be aware that CNC Software also knows the extent of piracy and tries to deal with this continually - they are doing their best.

 

CNC Software - Please do what you do EXACTLY thay way the your doing it. Change nothing - this is working. Opps, One last thing - fix the feeds so they are inches per rev & not inches per minute as the default.

 

One other thing, - let me know if you need my new address for the free copy - just kidding.

 

I just love this forum - Don't You?

 

Regards, Jack

 

Regards, Jack

[Thad]

quote:

---

I personally met Bruce Gibbs at the Chicago tool show

---

Any relation to Bill Gibbs, the company founder?

 

Thad

[Charles Davis]

James,

 

That's the right idea for sure. Have the tier 1 company's (US Govt, Boeing, GE, etc) sign a pact that they require all sub-contractors down the line to have legal software.

 

Threaten that anyone caught purposely pirating software will have their contracts cancelled. Have one or two highly publicized busts (where someone DID have all their contacts cancelled), and you'd see some real activity.

 

That would send a tsunami through the industry. It would greatly stimulate the economy and make this recession ancient history.

 

OK SBA, or National Association of Manufacturers, where are you? Seems like a pretty simple thing to lobby for, and more effective than any other method.

 

[ 07-29-2002, 02:45 PM: Message edited by: Charles Davis ]

[Verisurf - Ernie Husted]

No backup file found!

Inside joke.....

 

Mastercam bootleg is an epidemic!

I do agree with the 4 to 1 ratio, especially in Southern California, ten thousand shops to one Mastercam Dealer, it just so happens that this Dealer is also number one in Mastercam sales in the world. See the problem?

 

Not enough Dealers!

 

It takes a customer relationship to sell expensive software.

 

Ernie

[mold100]

The only problem with making the teir ones check software,(NOT like they alredy dont have enough overhead to pay off the enron and worldcom scandals)They really dont care.There bottom line is good parts, fast, LOW cost,they are professional paper shredders.If a 15 man shop down the road is using scantless software,why should they care,they meet the delivery,cost, and quality it dont matter how they did it.REMEMBER they can take their work to any other country in the world for a fraction of our cost and not have to worry about anything,especially small shop creditability.Most teir ones have how many employees?????Hundereds of thousands world wide,They do very little legal transactions and are extremely cut throat.The bottom line is$$$$$$. Sorry for venting so long,But these are the same companies that are bring Chinas economy up and destroying ours.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

quote:

---

I do agree with the 4 to 1 ratio, especially in Southern California, ten thousand shops to one Mastercam Dealer, it just so happens that this Dealer is also number one in Mastercam sales in the world. See the problem?

---

They are #1 because of their staff. Period! Just ask Tom. They are larger than most other resellers. They have 3 offices, how many resellers have 3 offices? That's not the problem Ernie, nice try though.

[Brian Summers CNC Software Inc VP]

To Gcode:

 

________________________________________________

The simple fact is, if I ratted out every pirate shop I know, I would be the Typhoid Mary of Southern California in very short order, so I keep my mouth shut

______________________________________________

 

Regarding your comment above, BSA keeps infomants name confidential. Thanks.

 

Brian

[Bullines]

Unfortunately, Mastercam is now being traded via P2P (peer to peer) apps. A search for "Mastercam" with Kazaa yielded the following results:

 

EDIT: picture removed after bad judgment call was realized.

 

An exhaustive Gnutella network search would probably return more results.

 

[ 08-01-2002, 09:21 AM: Message edited by: Bullines ]