Rotating part WCS Mastercam2017

[mezzer]

I just starting using 2017. It was easy to rotate and setup a part in X7 

I just dont get how to rotate and setup the 3D part in 2017 .

I press right WCS tpo rotate part flat and it spins 90 I want it flat

 

[jlw™]

To rotate the part use dynamic xform. To rotate WCS, you will have to create one and rotate it. You can not modify TOP or any preset planes. If you need to edit a plane open plane manager and right click it.

[BrianP.]

To rotate the part use dynamic xform. To rotate WCS, you will have to create one and rotate it. You can not modify TOP or any preset planes. If you need to edit a plane open plane manager and right click it.

 

Realistically you can modify top by orienting the part the way you want op1 to be before you start. I use 3D translate and move part to origin. Unless your part comes in at some weird angle couple of clicks all done. Used to be able to have 6 ops and never have to create a plane. Now after first op have to copy everything so you can pick a part origin. Instead of a nice clean planes manager you now will have 8-12 planes for simple parts. Drives me nuts.

[Guest]

Realistically you can modify top by orienting the part the way you want op1 to be before you start. I use 3D translate and move part to origin. Couple of clicks all done. Used to be able to have 6 ops and never have to create a plane. Now after first op have to copy everything so you can pick a part origin. Instead of a nice clean planes manager you now will have 8-12 planes for simple parts. Drives me nuts.

 

Realistically, that's more of an OCD problem than a problem  

[BrianP.]

Realistically, that's more of an OCD problem than a problem  

 

Well kinda. Aren't all machinist borderline OCD lol.

[jeff]

Realistically you can modify top by orienting the part the way you want op1 to be before you start. I use 3D translate and move part to origin. Unless your part comes in at some weird angle couple of clicks all done. Used to be able to have 6 ops and never have to create a plane. Now after first op have to copy everything so you can pick a part origin. Instead of a nice clean planes manager you now will have 8-12 planes for simple parts. Drives me nuts.

This is the habit I'm trying REALLY hard to break, since I've been doing it this way since V9.

Most of my parts are 1-2pcs so i try to spend as little time as I can on Mastercam for each part.

[gcode]

A simple solution to this is make a template of standard viewsheets with editable copies and import it

into your new file

[BrianP.]

This is the habit I'm trying REALLY hard to break, since I've been doing it this way since V9.

Most of my parts are 1-2pcs so i try to spend as little time as I can on Mastercam for each part.

 

 

I don't understand. Break this habit why? I can import a file orient it move it to origin and be programming in less than a minute. In many cases maybe 30 seconds and I am programming away.

[Guest]

I don't understand. Break this habit why? I can import a file orient it move it to origin and be programming in less than a minute. In many cases maybe 30 seconds and I am programming away.

 

Sheesh, it can take me a week just come up with a fixture method and then get it designed

 

 

It's all about what we do...it's not often I see work as described above

[JoshC]

Mezzer, I don't know if you have already solved your problem that you were having but on a side note you can use Dynamic Xform like JLM mentioned above.

 

I listed the steps in detail below but its extremely simple to do

 

1. Go to transform --> Dynamic

2. select a position of your part (origin position if you would like)

3. There is a button next to the gnomen (controls if you are moving the Geometry selected or moving the Gnomen)

4. after the gnomen is positioned the way you would like hit that button once more to put you back into geometry manipulation.

5. then you can simply hit the WCS button under origin, the part should shoot over to the origin

6. then hit WCS button under axes and the part should rotate the model until the part and gnomen match your Current WCS

​

 

Another quick and easy method to rotate parts in 3D space is a tool called Translate 3D, only requirement to use that is to setup a plane first and then translate 3d can rotate geometry from one plane or view to another.

[BrianP.]

Sheesh, it can take me a week just come up with a fixture method and then get it designed

 

 

It's all about what we do...it's not often I see work as described above

 

 

Braggart.  

 

Job shops are usually vise or fixture held parts ( plate work ) most of the time. Do get some trickier parts that take a while to fixture but nothing that complicated. If I took a week to figure out a part I would be looking for a new job fast. It is all about what we do.

[Guest]

Braggart.

 

Job shops are usually vise or fixture held parts ( plate work ) most of the time. Do get some trickier parts that take a while to fixture but nothing that complicated. If I took a week to figure out a part I would be looking for a new job fast. It is all about what we do.

 

The first project they gave me when I started here

 

6 weeks from design to program completion...the nature of the beast here

 

5 separate Palletech Lines, each with a 50 pallet pool, things are set up to run for the long haul

 

Edit: Oh and it's still running today for a year plus, 24/7, well, almost more like 22/6

[jeff]

I don't understand. Break this habit why? I can import a file orient it move it to origin and be programming in less than a minute. In many cases maybe 30 seconds and I am programming away.

Because I want to verify all ops at once to make sure I have everything correct.

If i have every op on their own level using TOP as the WCS, I can't do that.  Unless I'm missing something.

[BrianP.]

Because I want to verify all ops at once to make sure I have everything correct.

If i have every op on their own level using TOP as the WCS, I can't do that.  Unless I'm missing something.

 

Yup your missing something lol. Only first op is top. After that I would use bottom, left, right, front and back. Was always able to select work origin in each with a mouse click. Now you have to copy the view to be able to select something other than Mastercam origin. All ops verify to make a complete part.

[BrianP.]

The first project they gave me when I started here

 

6 weeks from design to program completion...the nature of the beast here

 

5 separate Palletech Lines, each with a 50 pallet pool, things are set up to run for the long haul

 

Edit: Oh and it's still running today for a year plus, 24/7, well, almost more like 22/6

 

If I was closer John I would come work for you. Might make it fun again learning new stuff. I always want a job where I am the dumbest so I can learn and go to a new level. Unfortunately around here most shops are small job shops and the programmers are fair. Usually end up teaching many tricks and features of Mastercam to people.

 

Edit: Oops. Now I'm the braggart.

[Jayson Kramer]

I just starting using 2017. It was easy to rotate and setup a part in X7 

I just dont get how to rotate and setup the 3D part in 2017 .

I press right WCS tpo rotate part flat and it spins 90 I want it flat

So you want to either create a new WCS and you start by selecting the gnomon in the lower left hand corner of the graphics aera. 

Or you can go to translate tab and use Dynamic to move it. but are you fa miler with using the gnomon for the WCS and working with it?

[jeff]

Yup your missing something lol. Only first op is top. After that I would use bottom, left, right, front and back. Was always able to select work origin in each with a mouse click. Now you have to copy the view to be able to select something other than Mastercam origin. All ops verify to make a complete part.

But the default WCS can't be altered, correct?

Most of the time we use 1/8" oversize stock on the height, width and length and I put the datum at the edge of the stock and not the finished part for the 1st op, and then the edge of the part for the rest of the ops.

[crazy^millman]

Yup your missing something lol. Only first op is top. After that I would use bottom, left, right, front and back. Was always able to select work origin in each with a mouse click. Now you have to copy the view to be able to select something other than Mastercam origin. All ops verify to make a complete part.

 

Problem was the issues it created down the road to high end projects or programs that had many WCS in them. When the base Matrix was changed everything went south quick. By locking the base planes where all the math comes from you keep the math process more stable. When you change the start points on a system tied to them the system has a hard time correcting problems. By locking all base math calculations to a base matrix and going from there you are good to go. Like said create a CSV file of your planes and import them in if creating copies is giving you such heart burn. When I have a part with upwards of 40 to 100 WCS and several 100 operations I want it to work and since they have locked the base planes down issues I use to see are gone.  Not trying to be mean, but not all of use make simple prismatic parts on a 3 Axis machine. Even when I do I always created copies of my planes I never changed the bases planes. Seen to many issues doing that, I wanted a base reference was kind of hard if the base reference was gone.

[Guest]

Problem was the issues it created down the road to high end projects or programs that had many WCS in them. When the base Matrix was changed everything went south quick. By locking the base planes where all the math comes from you keep the math process more stable. When you change the start points on a system tied to them the system has a hard time correcting problems. By locking all base math calculations to a base matrix and going from there you are good to go. Like said create a CSV file of your planes and import them in if creating copies is giving you such heart burn. When I have a part with upwards of 40 to 100 WCS and several 100 operations I want it to work and since they have locked the base planes down issues I use to see are gone.  Not trying to be mean, but not all of use make simple prismatic parts on a 3 Axis machine. Even when I do I always created copies of my planes I never changed the bases planes. Seen to many issues doing that, I wanted a base reference was kind of hard if the base reference was gone.

 

Ron,

 

I am guessing by your statement here that you ran into the issue when doing rotary work where a plane would not spit out an angle?  

 

All you would get is A0 but if you posted it by itself it posted an angle?

 

That was all due to the matrix being skewed by as little as .00000001.  It would see it as a different rotation

[crazy^millman]

Ron,

 

I am guessing by your statement here that you ran into the issue when doing rotary work where a plane would not spit out an angle?  

 

All you would get is A0 but if you posted it by itself it posted an angle?

 

That was all due to the matrix being skewed by as little as .00000001.  It would see it as a different rotation

 

John, other issues I ran into over the years. I am a math guy and when I can do the math and not get the same results other ways I start to questions things. Had this conversation many times about things in Mastercam. The filter is broken IMHO and as many times as I have brought it up about it being broken and rebuffed I just do what I need to get programs to customers. Matrix math must have a start and end point and everything in Mastercam for years has pointed me back to 0,0,0 must be the start of all things in Mastercam. You start moving that any bit and weird things has happened. I got out of the habit in X4 of altering the base planes and life was good, but every time someone was having troubles they had modified the bases planes. I would take someone's file and create copies of the base planes for the operations they were having issues with and put the base planes back to the correct places and assign the operations to the new planes and the problems would go away. Many other things over the years working with 3rd party post builders also showed me different things. Base planes got locked and I thought it was about time. Now everything may seem more difficult for those use to one way, but for me it follows a logical process of how you go about building a matrix structure. You must have a consistent base point and then build all your math out from that base point. Any alterations to the base point of your calculations and you create a sliding ruler effect. Other software hide things and keep them out of the plain sight doing smoke and mirrors in the back ground. Guess too many years of having to create program for machines with pencil and paper keep me thinking this way, but the fact the base planes or now locked like they were before supports my thinking. Now if that is right or wrong is debatable no doubt, but I like know where I start no matter how many different turns, changes and moves I make I still like know where I started. You start making a system work like a sliding ruler then what kind of issues is that going to create?

[BrianP.]

Problem was the issues it created down the road to high end projects or programs that had many WCS in them. When the base Matrix was changed everything went south quick. By locking the base planes where all the math comes from you keep the math process more stable. When you change the start points on a system tied to them the system has a hard time correcting problems. By locking all base math calculations to a base matrix and going from there you are good to go. Like said create a CSV file of your planes and import them in if creating copies is giving you such heart burn. When I have a part with upwards of 40 to 100 WCS and several 100 operations I want it to work and since they have locked the base planes down issues I use to see are gone.  Not trying to be mean, but not all of use make simple prismatic parts on a 3 Axis machine. Even when I do I always created copies of my planes I never changed the bases planes. Seen to many issues doing that, I wanted a base reference was kind of hard if the base reference was gone.

 

No worries I don't think your being mean. There are always 2 sides. I figured it had something to do with the solids needing to be locked in for one reason or another. Doesn't mean I have to like it.

[crazy^millman]

No worries I don't think your being mean. There are always 2 sides. I figured it had something to do with the solids needing to be locked in for one reason or another. Doesn't mean I have to like it.

 

Yes sir that is correct we are all different and what is acceptable to some is not always going to be acceptable to others. Why we are all different and bring our own unique prospectives and ideas.

[BrianP.]

But the default WCS can't be altered, correct?

Most of the time we use 1/8" oversize stock on the height, width and length and I put the datum at the edge of the stock and not the finished part for the 1st op, and then the edge of the part for the rest of the ops.

 

Mastercam system origin cannot be moved but the WCS can. So here is a top using stock corner as WCS. You go to bottom. The small arrow used to allow you to pick a new WCS while the part stays tied to system origin. You now need to create a copy of the view then the arrow becomes active and you can choose a new WCS on the part anywhere. The part never moves from system origin so that when you verify you will get a complete part.

 

 

 

[jeff]

Mastercam system origin cannot be moved but the WCS can. So here is a top using stock corner as WCS. You go to bottom. The small arrow used to allow you to pick a new WCS while the part stays tied to system origin. You now need to create a copy of the view then the arrow becomes active and you can choose a new WCS on the part anywhere. The part never moves from system origin so that when you verify you will get a complete part.

 

top.PNG

 

bottom.PNG

 

bottom wcs.PNG

Is there a way to ONLY show the WCS datum lines when you hit F9? Right now it shows the System Origin lines in default brown, and the WCS in light blue. That gets consufing to my operators when it's a setup sheet in Black and White.

[BrianP.]

Is there a way to ONLY show the WCS datum lines when you hit F9? Right now it shows the System Origin lines in default brown, and the WCS in light blue. That gets consufing to my operators when it's a setup sheet in Black and White.

 

 

No. A workaround when you go to print a setup sheet is to change the system origin color to the same as your background. This will "hide" it while you print out a setup sheet. A small pain but will save you the headaches of your operators being confused.

 

Edit: The other thing I used to do is create a quick note with a single leader. F9 to hide the origins and then print. Can put your notes on different level or just blank them so the are hidden.

 

 

Edit #2: John beat me to it.