x interface

[camgeneration]

I have been using x for 2 1/2 months now,(been programming on mastercam since 5.5) and i totally hate the new setup. they improved some functions yet the logic in the overlayout is totally missing. drop down menus are a extreme waste of time, I am not too thrilled at having to use icons either. escape now accepts operations instead of canceling. the use of functions inside of functions is a lot more limited that it used to be. overall productivity is lower with this new interface. why can't they just improve mastercam between version instead of starting new. there were a lot of bugs in the old version that could used some work first like trimming surfaces. It is lucky that the didn't mess up the toolpaths too much, although they are more cumbersome in acessing them. I have been a long time supporter of mastercam, they have lost a lot of my support on this release. especially after waiting so long for the upgrade to come out.

frustrated programmer.

[Guest]

Have you done any training?

 

Have you bothered to read the book?

 

This topic has been hashed over many, many times since the August release.

 

I feel for you the learning curve is tough because the change was dramatic, time to move on though there is much good and more to follow.

 

Keep plugging away you'll get there.

 

There are ways to customize your setup thru the right mouse button, created custom menus, hot keys, after market input device(Spaceball)

 

There is much there to help you.

 

Good Luck and

 

Welcome to the Forum

[john316]

.

 

Hang in there Camgeneration.

 

A lot of people have expressed their frustration with the new interface.

 

Drastic change has that effect on us.

 

Even though V9 was working good for me, I have found V10 to be much better overall.

 

As John said, some training helps. Here are some links to some good information.

 

http://www.mastercam.com/support/multimedia

 

http://www.mastercam.com/Support/Downloads...tsnewvideos.zip

 

 

.

[within a thou]

I wil be the first to admit I am not comfortable with X and need some training. By no means am I bashing it because i don't know enough about it. But is anyone happy with "live entity" that needs a stroke of the enter key so it knows what I just put I want. It doesn't matter what level you are at with mastercam we all will create more right geometry then wrong. Why use live entities and not just undo when we make something we don't want? To take away most of the key strokes to make it faster but then force us to hit enter after every operation seems like a oxymoron to me. I know I am a creature of habit and like left hand on keyboard right on mouse, I am not looking forward to having to get use to a spaceball. I have used a few of the more CAM orientated software packages out there and while any version of mcam blows them out of the water for 2D the 3D cuterpaths are very restrictive and limitive especialy with editing, boundary creations, remachining and so on. Just think if a lil of the attention put into changing the interface was used on things like the editing of cutterpaths, mcam could have really closed the gaps with some other packages. Another thing I keep seeing on here is mcamX has been changed to a windows environment and if this is the case why can't a skin be created to make the interface resemble older versions of mcam. and allow users the option which they want to use. I have been using mcam since v7 I think it is a great software. I just worry that some people will be turned off by the new interface and change cam packages. and for every company who switches to a different package that is one more company that my mcam skills will be useless to. Which will either cause me to take a step back to learn there new package or not even get my foot in the door.

 

Just my .02

[camgeneration]

I learned all mastercam versions on the job, yes i have read thru the book, and other literature. I understand how the new functions work (mostly). I can get almost anything done i could on other version. it is just more of a headache to use drop down menus to find less used functions. customization is a good addition, yet it should not be needed to make up for a bad layout. loss of the side menu bar was a bad misteak, i could get to any function on mastercam in a couple seconds, now i have to wait for a stupid drop down, move down, wait for another pop out, etc...

It is not a matter of learning.

[gcode]

I did not like the new interface much when I first started using it either. Now I've got it set up the way I like it, and its become second nature to me.

When I have to go back and do something in V9, I absolutely hate it.

[Pete Rimkus from CNC Software Inc.]

In response to the last couple posts...

 

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"But is anyone happy with "live entity" that needs a stroke of the enter key so it knows what I just put I want...To take away most of the key strokes to make it faster but then force us to hit enter after every operation seems like a oxymoron to me"

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When creating geometry, you don't HAVE TO hit 'Enter' - just go on to the next function (which is now easily available instead of only available via 'esc''esc''esc' becuase in V9 you'd be 3 menus deep)

 

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"Another thing I keep seeing on here is mcamX has been changed to a windows environment and if this is the case why can't a skin be created to make the interface resemble older versions of mcam. and allow users the option which they want to use"

-------

 

Because that would have added a lot of time to the development and would quickly become impossible to maintain. Also, if you hire a new programmer, sit him down at Mastercam for the 1st time, and ask him to, for instance, open a file and print it, if he's ever worked on ANY "windows" software, he'll know how to do that, instead of wondering why we call it 'Get' instead of 'Open' and 'Hardcopy' instead of 'Print'.

 

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" i could get to any function on mastercam in a couple seconds, now i have to wait for a stupid drop down, move down, wait for another pop out, etc"

-----------

 

Sounds like you've got to do some "Customization" (once) instead of wearing our your 'Esc' key.

[HevyMetl]

Alot of Keystrokers had or are still having problems with the new interface. The transition wasn't so bad sense I had been using other software for awhile. Mastercam is now more intuitive along the lines of higher end design software. I don't know if that was their intention or not, but it was a pleasant surprise for me. My guys that were strictly Pro Manufacturing have picked up on X very quickly. Just my 2¢'s worth.

 

And welcome to the forum.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

Personally I like "Live Entities". It has takes some getting used to though. I changed the selected entity color to white though. I'm color blind so I need as much contrast as possible. I changed back to the Black Background from that awful blue/purple whatever the heck color it was. Gradient is nothing but a sales tool. Yeah it looks cool in demos and makes it look like Solidworks but does nothing for me. Once you go Black, you never go back. I've done a lot of changes to the configuration over the last few months and I'm nearly as fast in X as I am in 9. Problem for me is I HAVE to use both so the migration has been slower than I would like but that is not the software's fault. Spend some time customizing the RMB (Right Mouse Button) and you'll be glad you did. It'time well spent.

 

JM2C

[Bullines]

quote:

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Spend some time customizing the RMB (Right Mouse Button) and you'll be glad you did. It'time well spent.

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And the keyboard shortcuts, too.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

Absolutely +1,000,000 to Bullines. My mind was going faster than my fingers.

[within a thou]

ty Pete for your reply i didn't realise that I am currently looking into training from my reseller as we speak just got the quote this afternoon.

 

My frustration with this new interface is that it seems like I am forfeiting a good part of my previous exsperience with mcam now with this new interface. personally I would have liked to see the changes more as add on changes. cut a lil of the fat from v9 upgrade this that and so on. I work on bigger one off custom tools if I do something wrong because of a lack of exsperience with mcamX it can cost my employer a lot. SO really its a familiarity issue and a confidence and comfort level with the old interface that when i create or program something I can load it on a machine and just let her go. We are only one shift here and with contract deadlines being tightened do to the changes in our economy and more companies quoting on fewer jobs I run my machine unmanned over night as often as possible to cut costs. I need to have the comfort just so I don;t have to walk into work in the morning to a disaster.

[Matt Berube at Ferron Mold]

quote:

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now i have to wait for a stupid drop down, move down, wait for another pop out, etc...

It is not a matter of learning.

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I must admit I don't like a lot of the dropdowns. The simple solution is to get rid of 'em. I am not a huge right mouse user YET...

 

The answer for me is setting up toolbars for the things I do use a lot. That is by far the best thing about this version. The only mistake I believe CNC Software made is not having a button available for EVERY SINGLE FUNCTION. I have come up with a couple instances where the button I want doesn't exist. 99.9% of the time you can really do whatever you want with toolbars.

[Roger Peterson]

quote:

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now i have to wait for a stupid drop down, move down, wait for another pop out, etc...

---

You may want to look into turning off the "fade" effect in windows. This causes a slight delay for menu's to appear.

 

Also, you can still use the keyboard shortcuts, just tap the alt key and you still have access to all of the menus from the keyboard. And just because a window pops up doesn't mean you can't access the functionality from the keyboard; toolpath contour - the chaining window pops up - I can use W for window - C for chain - R for reverse - etc... Take a little comfort in the fact that you are by no means not the only longtime mastercam user who has had to make this transition, from where you are at it just gets better.

 

Everyone will be able to pick out individual things that as a single step are faster in 9 than X. You need to look at is as a whole and I'm sure you won't be dissapointed. I'm still amazed every time I use net surface, backplot, or simpler things like setup my file with tools with the new tool manager, regenerating all dirty ops, etc...

 

As far as editing 3D toolpaths, I know what you've seen and what you are referring to is neat. It also has to be neat to make up for a few deficiencies in the toolpath creation in that product. Check out the silhoette boundary chook, I think you'll like it also.

 

 

HTH

[within a thou]

The software I am refering to is worknc when you edit your toolpaths its basically like using scissors cut out what you don't want also when windowing you have the option to create a reference diameter to make your boundaries so you can reference your cuter to maximize the time your cutter spends cutting inside the boundary. Also the processing time is a lot faster as it only looks inside your boundary and contains where it is processing. and with the remachining cuterpaths it allows you to cross cut at 90 degrees to the previous cut in one program no need to process a second. the option to force your cut high low and vice versa and many other options

[mayday]

quote:

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We are only one shift here and with contract deadlines being tightened do to the changes in our economy and more companies quoting on fewer jobs I run my machine unmanned over night as often as possible to cut costs. I need to have the comfort just so I don;t have to walk into work in the morning to a disaster.

---

[jbert]

For those of us who have had experience with other systems and found them more user freindly.

Cimatron E or Inventor in my case, this is all a very welcome change and a GREAT improvement.

[jbert]

In addition,

the help that can be received from this forum is far better than some competitors maintanence programs...

 

[mman10]

The learning curve for most everyone has been the same. Everyone for the most part is having their deadlines shortened, but just like working with new machines working with Mastercam X requres an open mind. It can be frustrating at times but the good far outweighs the frustration. After using x for a while go back and use V9 then you will feel frustration. Things are much easier to work with in X. Just my 2 cents worth.

[within a thou]

I totally agree with the help on this forum is second to none. Mastercam as a whole blows any other system I have worked with out of the water I like mcam am no where was I bshing X in any of my posts. Sure a learning curve is exspected ands when you are use to doing somethin one way for so long it should be exspected to be frustrating. I am not trying to be closed minded in my opinion in X. I know the mastercam developers use this forum as a tool as insite into what there consumers want out of there cadcam package. So with that in mind I am exspressing things I have found I like and dislike. I have done very lil with X but after having a a lot of trouble with trying to patch a complex hole in a surface file I opened it up in X clciked my chain and used the net surface and it came out perfect I was very impressed with the feature I am also looking forward to getting into the constant scallop toolpath and can see everyone elses posts on this forum about how they are impressed with the new cutterpaths. I am goin to accept the changes in X and move forward and continue to use this software. I just wanted to give my opinion on the things that have stuck out for me and post my opinion ina way that hopefully didn;t come across as "X sucks" like so many others is all. Will the developers change things that I have said probably a slim to nil chance but if everyone took this approach to exspressing there likes and dislikes instead of the "X sucks" approach maybe they will be even more willing to listen to what we have to say. On this site it states it has 85,577 seats world wide and the number of forum members is 13767. That is a pretty large pecentage of users using this forum the developers know this and do use this as a tool like we do. And I would like the tell the developers they have been doing a great job for a long time now a lot of whihc probably wouldn;t have been accomplished so fast with out the very knowledgeable members of this forum.

[Leehound]

I am defiantly in the “hate the X interface” camp. I have been using Mastercam since V6. Becoming fully proficient and learning all the little nuances has taken years. Now comes along X and I have to start over? I keep reading “it takes time” or “you need training”. What gets my panties in a wad, is I am the one who signs the checks. Exactly how much is it going to cost in training or lost productivity? During development of X, did anybody at CNC Software ever think of how much this new version was going to cost it’s customers? If we were to add up all the lost hours for everybody that is using X, how much would that be? I guarantee it equals big bucks.

 

I have already invested the time to learning Mastercam. Why should I be forced to do it all over again?

[brilu397]

I'm at the other end of the spectrum. I was only using MC9 for a lil less than 2 years b4 the switch to X. I hated having to go 3 menus deep to find something and then back my way out of it. The toolbars across the top in 9 were cumbersome because of having to go from page to page to have more than the 20 or so at time. I have found that there were things in I never knew of because they were buried inside submenus. My programming profenciency as gone WAY up since I switched to X. I like the new interface. Once I got almost everything customized I rarely go into a drop down or hunt for function. The WCS manager is whole lot easier for me to follow. The improved backplot has saved me a few times. I can do so much more in the short time I've had X I could probably write an essay on it. I'm sorry some of you are having a rough time of it, but I'm happy with it.

[iowajim62]

quote:

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I keep reading “it takes time” or “you need training”.

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Quit playin so much BF2 and practice X at nite at home

jk bro

 

I like the new interface now that I have spent several days just playin with it. It opens all my old 7,8,9 programs no probs buts that just in Demo here at home. One odd thing at first was not seeing verify the old way tho.

[Leehound]

quote:

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Quit playin so much BF2 and practice X at nite at home

jk bro

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Hey, don't ask me to give up my BF2 time! Thats what relaxes me the evenings.

[within a thou]

Another reason why I have stayed away from X is because of bugs I am not aware of if its a new interface how does one know if this the problem you are having could be a software issue or lie somewhre between the keyboard and the chair? I know they have had the update out for a week or 2 but are they still finding more bugs I am sure its not perfect yet but how long till the next update to fix the bugs they are finding in this update?