Buying a new wire EDM

[Jon D. Welch]

I am in the process of buying a large wire machine and I have found 4 that are available and big enough. I have to get this list down to one so input (positive or negitive) will be welcome.

 

AGIE

JAPAC

MITSUBISHI

SODICK

 

As always thanks for your replies

[mold100]

Since charmille isnt on your list I would say the Mits.

[savagkd]

I,m running a Mits FX20 and love it.

 

Keith

[swinz]

Hi John

I know that charmilles is not on your list but I use a pair of Robofil 510 machines and can recomend these machines, these are big machines and because they are not a submerged machine it is posible to use them for long jobs with the door open. You must over ride the interlock on the door and put up a waterproof curtain to contain the water.

As for the machines on your list Japac are old machines and now part of sodick.

I have worked a Sodick this was a good machine but seemed to have fragile parts such as the wire thread system which worked alright if it was set right. But if set wrong or slightly damaged no chance of threading.

I have never used a Mitsubishi or Agie so cant comment.

Hope this is of some use - Paul

[Lucky]

We use Agie EDMs exclusively here and would recommend them highly. The AgieVision controller is much more powerful than any other wire machine control. Mastercam Wire v9.1 does a great job supporting the advanced features of this control. Charmilles would be my close second choice.

[BernieT]

I have only used MITSUBISHI, about 1996 model. Good machine, no serious complaints.

 

Got to keep the machine clean, though. Very important.

[Lars Christensen]

To answer a question with a question

 

When you are saying big, how big??

 

Machines are like cars, you are getting what you are paying for, and you can get what ever feature you want.

 

My take on Mitsubishi.

This is a japanese machine, so compare it to a japanese car. It will do all the stuff the other once does, it has alot of nice features, but it is not idiot prof. Who ever is going to run it has to have some idea of what he wants, and have a basic EDM understanding. The machine is built after the japanese mentality "This is the new stuff, 6-7 years down the road the technoligi is old, so you want to by a new one to compete anyways.

 

My take on Agie.

Mercedes!!!!

You will have a machine that is built to run for the next 20 years, you can take whoever you want and with a couple of hours training they will be running parts. The Swiss will not let you go very deep into the control, what can limit you, but in the other hand it will not allow you to f**k something up either.

 

I verly think it depends on what you are doing, to give you a good advise.

I have never personally worked on Japac or Sodick, but it is my understanding that they aint as relieble as Agie or Mits.

 

 

A good advice would be to make all 4 make a test cut for you, just make sure that you give them something in the style you will be doing, then you can visit them when they are setting up your test piece and look over there shoulder to get a idea what has to be done to get the job going. Also make sure that you give a ranges with what surface finish you want, typacly they will give you the best surface finish, so they can show off, when reality is that in the real world we dont get payed for a 5 micron finish that took 8 hours longer that a 12 micron.

Last note, most companyes offer training, USE IT!!

 

Lars

[CAM-mando]

I had a bad experience with Agie about 12 years ago, so I am probably prejudiced. In my experience people seem to love em' or hate em'.

 

That aside, Mits is pretty much top of the line as far as Jap machines go. Japax was bought out by the parent company of Sodick and I thought didn't exist anymore. Japax and Sodick are generally inferior to Mits.

 

Are you looking at new machines ? The title of the thread says "new" but as I said I thought Japax was out of business. If you are looking at used machines keep in mind that power generator technology has changed drasticaly over the years. Todays machines are far superior to machines 5-10 years ago and those are superior to machines 5-10 years before that. An 80's machine might give you 5-6 square inches and hour compared to 20-30 in a newer machine.

[lou]

Mitsubishi FA20V is one of the fast and accurate wire that I have seen. Then again, I like mitsubishi. I have 2 of thier sinkers. We did buy a few years ago a FANUC wire, But I dont know if that is a big enough machine for you.

 

Hope this helps, Lou

[Jody]

We have an Agie Classic 2S. The guy that runs it loves it. We just bought an Agie sinker because we like they wire so much. When he and I went to look at wire burners to buy, We compared the Agie and Charmmilles to a Cadilac and an Escort. i used to run a Charmilles and the Agie is much more powerful.

 

Jody

[Jody]

we like the Agie so much that i double posted it

 

Sorry

 

Jody

[Threept82]

I have (2) Sodick EDM wires A325 and A530 (5 axis)

both are AWESOME. Quick threading, and very good

cutting condition options, also a Sodick sinker.

Had Agie (ok machine) but...

[Oppiz]

I have a small Mitsu. FX10k. Love it! MC machinery has good tech and service support.

[savagkd]

I'd have to say MC machinery has Great tech and service support! The training they offer is also top shelf.

[chad fisher]

I have aq325 sodick as well. Didnt have a clue to edm machining before we got this thing. After a couple weeks it was as easy as pie. The sodick has been a great machine for us and is very easy to operate. Plus it was almost 60k cheaper than that of the Mits.

[mold100]

As far as the Japan comment do you want to compare any other countries machining centers to those that are based from Japan the big M'z are as far as I know all japs(Makino, Mori, Mazak, and Matsurra)?

[mario]

lucky

It is possible for you to send the post

I have the same machine at you AgieClassic 2 and my post doesn't good work but not good

 

Do you use

.sbl file

.sbr file

.iso file or

.geo file

 

thank's

[Fig sign]

We have Agie sinker cnc old machine based on 286 processor and we love it.

I new a couple4 of guys using Agie wire cnc.

The reputation she has here is like Lars said -

the mercedes .OUr wire is not a big one and it is ONA (Spanish )

I worked on it once and I can say - not very reliable,not very accurate,not very fast and

you can continue with not ...

Good for the money.

I can say that the old agie we have was very modern when it was a new machine and till this day

it works like a swiss clock

 

Best regards

[HevyMetl]

+1000 to Lars. Make them test cut and be there when they do it. One of the companies you listed above could not repeat their previous results with us present.

 

I would add the Makino U86 if you are looking for a large wire. I have a U32k and it is awsome. We do alot of small fluidic work here and the Makino works and works and works. I average 315 hours a month on it and I have had little to no problems. I pull maintenance daily (apprx 10 mins)on Saturday mornings (approx 1 hour) and monthly maintanence the first Saturday of the month (approx 3 hours).

 

My expierence with Mits was a FX10 and it was not good. It could not hold its tolerance over the entire tank. It was awsome in the center but the error increase as reached the travel limits.

 

I have quite a few frieds who love their AGIES, and I was seriously considering one, but Makino beat the pants off them in price. I felt the qualilty was very comperable.

 

Good luck

[Jon D. Welch]

Thank you all for the info it's helped me discard a couple of manufacturers.

[Lucky]

Mario,

 

I'm using MPWAGEVO.PST from the v9.1sp2 CD with no edits. We are using the .sbl, .sbr., and .iso files for the complete job.

 

If this post is active when creating the toolpath you will have a button in the machining parameters labeled AGIEVISION. If you do not see this button you are missing the AGIE9.DLL C-Hook. If you do not press this button and enter appropriate settings regarding piece dims, accuracy, finish, etc., your output will be garbage. You may get a good .iso file but nothing else will be usable.

[Harryman]

Good morning guys.

 

I didn't see any mention of Fanuc in this thread. I don't know beans about EDM. I'm being sent to look at a 1iC-S/AWF-12 next week. They are claiming .00000004" command resolution. We need a wire to burn some features but we need a Haas precision level not a jig grinder level.

 

Auto thread reliability will be a huge issue, one part has 117 slots through a 1/2 inch plate. Total linear cutting for both sides of slots looks like around 300 - 400 inches. Can this be expected to reliably run lights out?

[Tim Aydt Prototek Engineering]

Harry,

How about if I look at what posts we available and then that's the machine you will buy?

 

[Harryman]

You're a mind reader Tim. I have been planning to call you this morning with that very question. Ain't no way I'm buying a wire that I have to develop a post for

[HevyMetl]

Harry,

 

How much are you looking to spend? The best wire threader is only as reliable as the operator you have set it up. I run lights out threading .036 holes through 1" plate and many of these get cut into small slits and rethreaded. If I drop to .02" holes through the same plate my repeatablilty drops a little. The problem is, that "little" is usually about 30 min. after I leave the shop. I have run .013 holes through .75 plate and they run about 50% on my best day.

 

The biggest problem I have is rethreading small slits. The water jet tends to get dispersed and thread might miss the lower guide.