O/T Why? I don't understand the logic behind this..

[McRae]

Tim Hollis,

 

How do I sign up to be you replacement after you retire??

[Rick Damiani]

quote:

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I'm sorry if I've turned this message into a sermon, but it is important that we keep the word of God in the proper context.

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and

 

quote:

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Rick, proper exegesis is CRITICAL for a correct interpretation of any given passage. I've read through the Bible and have yet to see scripture condone sin of any kind be it sexual or otherwise

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Proper context is important in lots of things. Take this discussion, for example. The proper context would be my statement that the God I beleve in would not punish with a disease as non-selective as AIDS. Another poster disagreed with me, pointing out God's distruciton of xxxx and Gomorrah. I counterd by pointing out that God would have spared both cities if there had been but 10 rightous people living in them. Genisis 18 makes that pretty clear. That 10 were not found does not change God's willinness to spare the cities if even that small number of belevers would suffer. Indeed - look at the lengths he went to in saving Lot.

[Polite Luther]

Here ya go, join the party.

 

http://worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=35203

[MetalMarvels]

quote:

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One thing for the Driver's license... Doesn't that make our roads safer because this people now can have insurance?? ... as they go to farm the lands, wash our dishes and clean our toilets?? Please let me know if you have done that, I have only known one american dishwasher in my life.....

F. Javier

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Now you know two American dishwashers.... and I have also picked potatoes in Maine for $0.35 a barrel, side-by-side with the itinerate workers down from Canada. So what... it was a job....

 

As proven every day, having a drivers license does not mean that the individual will go get insurance. There are an unbelievable number of uninsured, but legally licensed, drivers running around.

 

What pisses me off is the added beaurocracy in getting a first-time drivers permit for my US-born daughter of US citizens. Based on the list of acceptable identification documents that was provided by the DMV for obtaining a permit, she never will get a permit... Most of the required documentation choices were for FOREIGNERS living in the State!!!!! Among the choices are a notarized marriage certificate (at 17 - I would strongly oppose marriage this early), certified court adoption papers (why would I adopt my own children??), certified divorce papers (at 17 - I HOPE not!!), Drivers license from another state (bear in mind this is for a 1st time drivers permit), State Identification card (same list of documents to get one!!!), full-sized birth certificate with state seal (no wallet sizes or copies please), current Visa for being in th US (yeah - right), current Foreign passport, Naturalization papers (she was freaking BORN here),and so forth. Very few teenagers could come up with two forms of "acceptable" ID unless they were foreign exchange students....... WTF, over.... By the way, SS card is NOT a form of ID.

[Ripper3785]

quote:

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Proper context is important in lots of things. Take this discussion, for example. The proper context would be my statement that the God I beleve in would not punish with a disease as non-selective as AIDS. Another poster disagreed with me, pointing out God's distruciton of xxxx and Gomorrah. I counterd by pointing out that God would have spared both cities if there had been but 10 rightous people living in them. Genisis 18 makes that pretty clear. That 10 were not found does not change God's willinness to spare the cities if even that small number of belevers would suffer. Indeed - look at the lengths he went to in saving Lot.

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xxxx and Gomorrah were not the only cities destroyed by God because of their immorality. And in at least one other instance he did not give these cities the luxury to be spared if they could find righteous among its residents. There were righteous among them, but most of the cities people were corrupt. (My not remembering the name of the city nor it's location in the Old Testament is hurting my argument, I know) God judged the whole city, or culture, as a whole. As even us good guys are responsible for the bad things happening in our culture.. by us not voting, and being passive and not standing up to the people who are doing bad things for our society because it's easier not to do so.

 

As such, my summary is that God can punish with a disease as non-selective as AIDS.

[Ripper3785]

quote:

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What pisses me off is the added beaurocracy in getting a first-time drivers permit for my US-born daughter of US citizens.

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Uh, where does it say two forms of ID? Colorado DMV FAQ

[TimHollis]

If you read my post about the MIB, from INS, over the SS#, good, then what I'm about to say may clear up a few things.

 

IT DON"T F*CKING MATTER!!!!!!

 

An ILLEGALE IMMERGRINT, will not take advantage of any services by the Government, that requires a photo, real name, maybe a fingerprint.

 

Most are coming from a country, that has a corrupt Government. They gain wisdom and experience, before leaving for the U.S., from their friends who left before them, and got deported back home.

 

So they already have their DO & DON'T list.

 

1st thing they do when they get here. Hook up with some FAKE ID, for about $300. they buy their very authentic looking, albeit phony ( MOST TIMES)

INS ID card, SS card, Birth-certificate, State Drivers License.

 

Some ILLEGALES, will become legal or Nationalized, A VERY SMALL percentage.

Of those. It would surprise you, how many PAY AN AMERICAN TO MARRY THEM.

 

The other 98%, will stay and keep earning under fake ID, most times sending the money home, once they have made enough, to build or buy a house, then usually, they themselves can go home.

 

I used to personally examine & photo-copy, the INS and SS card, of each person I hired, I did not want to get zapped $15,000. for each incident of hiring somebody who did not have the right to work.

 

Back in the days before employers could check ID on-line, the only requirement was that they LOOKED AUTHENTIC, no more, no less.

 

The basic fact is, over 95% of the ILLEGALE ALIENS, will never use their real ID for anything Government related, TO AFRAID of being deported.

 

Have you every seen inside the Medicaid qualification book?????????

 

The 1st 8 pages out of 11, DO NOT APPLY TO ILLEAGLE ALIENS!!!!!!

 

But those are only the pages that ask about...

Work history, bank accounts, real estate, property, monthly bills, and retirement benefits.

 

I know, had to do it for my Mom.

 

And so on......

 

 

Thanks

Tim H.

P.S. Edited to add.

My folks now live in MY house back in NY.

Medicaide eventually got their house.

 

[ 10-22-2003, 02:42 PM: Message edited by: TimHollis ]

[F. JAVIER]

quote:

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Now you know two American dishwashers.... and I have also picked potatoes in Maine for $0.35 a barrel, side-by-side with the itinerate workers down from Canada. So what... it was a job....

---

Good for you, the message I received from that experience was that the job was not something worthwhile and moved on... Just like you. The only thing I disagree is the fact that illegals are getting th rap for every problem... Gotta go....

[john316]

Rick,

 

If I remember right, your statement wasn't about whether God would destroy them or not, but that having a gay couple down the street from you didn't effect your family. The problem is that it does because the gay agenda is to force you to accept their lifestyle. Ex-Governor Gray Davis from California has signed bills into law that consider it a hate crime to have an opinion against the homosexual lifestyle. He also signed into law a bill that allows homosexuals to go into our GRADE SCHOOLS and teach our FIRST GRADERS that it is normal to have sexual relations with someone of the same sex, and that they are not normal if they don't accept that view. Now, tell me that doesn't effect your family. Tell me what you would think if your 6-year old son came home from school and told you that an adult male taught him in school that it was okay to let him fondle his genitals. Tell me that doesn't effect your family. THIS IS THE ISSUE. The homosexual agenda is to force their lifestyle on us whether we agree to it or not. Tell me this doesn't effect you family.

 

John 3:16

[SledGeek]

Gee,

that wouldn't be him trying to get the vote of a large minority group, would it ?

I have never seen heterosexual parades touting their free choice of sexuality. I have seen periodic displays of affection between man and woman ,but these are incidental, not planned events. their agenda is to make everyone aware of their existence .As if we need to be reminded.

quote:

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Tell me what you would think if your 6-year old son came home from school and told you that an adult male taught him in school that it was okay to let him fondle his genitals.

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I would be on Death Row !

 

Good reality check ,John.Added a fresh perspective to my grey matter !

[Lathe-Mill]

+1 John316, it's all true.

one question..:

why just tell me why when gays rally, the are half way naked and looking stupid, kissing and hugging?...why if they want to be acepted by society don't they act and look respectfull the same way the want respect fron society?

why why why????

don't be in my face and my kids faces disrespecting, cause i have never done anything like that and i don't teach my kids to be disrespectfull

[john316]

Carlos,

 

If I had a good answer for that I would have run for Governer of California

[F. JAVIER]

quote:

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Good for you, the message I received from that experience was that the job was not something worthwhile and moved on... Just like you. The only thing I disagree is the fact that illegals are getting th rap for every problem... Gotta go....

---

continuation:

 

sorry had to go and couldn't complete the thought... I do not think that being a dishwasher or working in the fields is a heroic thing... it is jusT something some people have to do; the ones who do it or have done it understand the effort that it takes and the low appreciation they get... I'm glad you do have an understanding of that.

what I also think is that most of the persons wearing the label of "Illegal" are decent human beings who deserve the same respect as I or anybody else, are doing the job I do not want to do and because I have been there I give them the benefit of doubt and think that because of the card life dealt them they have to do that. I don't have to... anymore.

F. Javier

[Charles Davis]

For us in California, there are two referrendums on the ballot; one to deny drivers licenses to illegal aliens, and one to repeal the "car tax".

 

I suggest you seek those out and sign them.

 

Not to get too much into the other topics on this thread, but a few thoughts:

 

1. A huge problem is the sexualization of children at a young age in our society. It's like no one gets a childhood anymore. Being exposed to blatant sexuality at a yound age is wrong.

 

2. We are a country settled by puritans seeking religious freedom. We have a pretty good system here: a secular government (as opposed to a religous government, like Iran, Saudi Arabia, etc). So we all have the freedom to exercise whatever religion we want, while our government remains (usually) neutral on the issue. Works well IMHO.

 

3. California is made up of people who are fiscally conservative and socially liberal; again not a bad way to go IMHO.

 

Personally I don't care if you worship the Moon God, just leave me out of it and let me worship as I wish.

[Brendan P]

Think what you want of me for stating this...

But IMO,religion is one of the biggest reasons this world is soo screwed up.

[Rick Damiani]

quote:

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If I remember right, your statement wasn't about whether God would destroy them or not, but that having a gay couple down the street from you didn't effect your family.

 

I made that statement as well. Plus several others.

 

The problem is that it does because the gay agenda is to force you to accept their lifestyle. Ex-Governor Gray Davis from California has signed bills into law that consider it a hate crime to have an opinion against the homosexual lifestyle.

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Are you certan that the bill says that it's a hate crime to have an opinion? 'Cause such a law would be utterly unenforceable. Crimes motevated by sexual orentation have been hate crimes for quite some time, so it can't be that either.

 

quote:

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He also signed into law a bill that allows homosexuals to go into our GRADE SCHOOLS and teach our FIRST GRADERS that it is normal to have sexual relations with someone of the same sex, and that they are not normal if they don't accept that view.

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Are you sure that this law says what you claim it does? Have you seen it? 1st grade is too early for any sex education in any school I have ever seen. Sex education normally happens somewhere around 5th grade.

 

quote:

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Now, tell me that doesn't effect your family.

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Nonsence has no effect on my family. Won't have any effect on yours, either.

 

quote:

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Tell me what you would think if your 6-year old son came home from school and told you that an adult male taught him in school that it was okay to let him fondle his genitals.

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I'd feel exactly the same as if my six-year-old daughter told me the same thing about her male teacher, or my six-year-old son told me the same thing about his female teacher. The problem with the senario you outline above is the same no matter what the sex of the child or teacher. Pedophilia and the sexual abuse of children are not the same thing as homosexuality.

 

quote:

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Tell me that doesn't effect your family. THIS IS THE ISSUE. The homosexual agenda is to force their lifestyle on us whether we agree to it or not. Tell me this doesn't effect you family.

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The 'homosexual agenda' has nothing at all to do with forcing you to date members of your own sex. Nor do they wish to force your children to date members of their own sex. All they want is to be able to date and enter into civil unions with members of their own sex without worrying about folks beating them to death for it. Really, I have a hard time understanding what the problem with that is.

[Müřlıń®]

+ a million to Hardmill and John316 for having the guts to speak about these issues.....

 

Oh ya, and to Charles.........

 

 

Murlin

[Lathe-Mill]

all i know is that there is man and women, nothing in between, two men or two women "can not procrate", if god gave you a xxxx, make it work properly be what you are suppossed to be, dont try to be something else, is like when you boss gives a print , he wants that part exactly like the print says, or you are gonna say, "i just made some changes because i CHOOSED to do it like that and i like it that way"

god created man and women for a reason, if we believe, follow,love and stand for god, why we'll try to change what he did?

i know for a fact we try to find a meanning and understand when it hit us real close, when some one we love happens to be gay, but you either are against or in favor of it, am not saying you should hate your love one, i will try to make him/her understand what he or she is doing something wrong, if god gave me lemons i will try to make lemonade, why try to make apple juice with it?...make no sense.

[Brendan P]

Hey Juan,

I think it is avatar time for you buddy...

Congrats.

Now lets see it!

 

PS...couldn't be cause you double post everytime cause you happened to leave something out?

[Lathe-Mill]

THANX BRENDAN, no double posts dude, how i do that avatar thinguee, no clue dude

[Scott Bond]

Other peoples sex is your business if your in the room while it is happening. Your sexual preference is for you, mine is for me, it is not a problem. If a person(s) makes their sexual preference known to others in public, it is

then public business. If a (math) teacher in a school tells, shows ,hints,claims, insinuates, to my kids their sexual preference , I Scott Bond claim that it is wrong that my kids know!!, It is wrong because I am the parent of that child and I said it was wrong,,OBTW it has nothing to do with why my kids are in a math class.

Sex is not for public viewing, don't push it on the public and then complain that they don't accept your style the way you would like them to.

 

America has stadards,,Please do not lower them.

Please treat them like the stadards in your shop ,and adjust the task at hand to them.

How silly of you to file your shop jowl blocks to

make the work of the day measure right?

 

Scott teh' Raise the Bar,and keep it there.

 

[ 10-22-2003, 10:11 PM: Message edited by: Scott Bond ]

[Jack Mitchell]

A rather interesting and informative thread.

 

Regards, Jack

[Hardmill]

quote:

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Proper context is important in lots of things. Take this discussion, for example. The proper context would be my statement that the God I beleve in would not punish with a disease as non-selective as AIDS. Another poster disagreed with me, pointing out God's distruciton of xxxx and Gomorrah. I counterd by pointing out that God would have spared both cities if there had been but 10 rightous people living in them. Genisis 18 makes that pretty clear. That 10 were not found does not change God's willinness to spare the cities if even that small number of belevers would suffer. Indeed - look at the lengths he went to in saving Lot.

---

quote:

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You forgot the innocent sufferers who contraced HIV through blood transfusions and improper handeling of medical 'sharps'. HIV can take as long as six months to show up after first contact, which made it very hard to keep out of the blood supply for quite some time. Without straying too far into religon, the God I beleve in would not be so careless in devising a plauge to wipe the earth clean of those that violate His commands.

---

"those that violate His commands." is the point there. Yes we will all suffer his wrath for not obeying his commands. Even the so called "Good" people. His word is, his word, PERFECT. Whether we choose to believe it or not is our choice, we make the choice to violate his commands or not. And where we may see those, who we think to be innocent , suffering is just our human selves being selfish. We are all a part of his plan and no day is guaranteeed. We follow his word or not. And people will die, even those we think are "good". As far as lot went God truly knew his heart. And I'm sure God knew there were no righteous people in xxxx & gommorah He allowed him(abraham)to ask because it was abraham asking. There are many other instances were those who may have been good have perished. But who are we to say it is'nt right, if it serves Gods purpose then so be it.

Not starting a ruckus, just sharing what I've learned in my short walk.

If I offend, my sincerest apologies

God Bless

Thanks for your time

 

PEACE

[MetalMarvels]

Ripper3785

quote:

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Uh, where does it say two forms of ID? Colorado DMV FAQ

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Unfortunately Colorado Identification requirements, 42-2-107 and 42-2-302 CRS were revised as of 07/03 to require two forms of identification - according to the the DMV supervisor that I spoke with, this was a result of 9/11. I am looking at a copy right now - it doesnt help my blood pressure......

 

The opening quotation is: "42-2-107 and 42-2-302 CRS requires applicants for a Colorado driver license or identification card to submit proof of age, name and lawful presence, as the department may require. Applicants must present two different documents." It goes on with a revised list of documents. From List A and B, only a fraction of teenagers would have two forms of required identification.

 

Presumeably this was to insure that illegal aliens could NOT obtain any form of Colorado ID, but they made it very difficult for legimate applicants. Colorado went too far in the other direction in my opinion.

 

[ 10-23-2003, 08:32 AM: Message edited by: MetalMarvels ]

[MetalMarvels]

sorry - it was a hijack.......

 

[ 10-23-2003, 08:27 AM: Message edited by: MetalMarvels ]