DMG Mori - Shopping for CAM

[Snaphook]

Hello Gentlemen, 

Former MC user from long ago, former forum member and Thee Circle member (Prismlead). Can't remember my login info so here I am again.

Our shop is 100% DMG Mori multiaxis vertical mill/turn machines. We're currenly using NX to program. NX is extremely powerful and the SIM with these machines is as close as it gets. Due to our license/maintenance costs we're shopping for other CAM softwares. Esprit TNG is very limited IMO for machine SIM. Have seen it bite a fellow programmer.

Curious as to anyone else who has experience with DMG Mori Machines, post processing to achieve the proper canned cycle masks, Cycle800, and machine SIM with MC.

Any comments are much appreciated.

[riverhunter]

Its really hard to beat NX machine sim.  only thing comparable that i have used is vericut.  I hear you on the license increase.  they are really trying to drive people to subscription models.  I know of two other companies that just stopped paying maintenance.  and plan to re purchase about every 4 years if really need.... NX doesn't put many new must have features out each year.   I'm still using NX1980 something and it handles everything just fine.

 

I'm now a MC user as well so i plan to follow this thread in hoped of finding another solution  while i try and push for VC here,

 

[JParis]

I think the reality is that with any CAM title, you will either be in the deep end($$) wise for a single title or you're going to be in the deep end($$) wise for multiple titles.

 

[crazy^millman]

Programmed these machines for years using Mastercam. Yes all the above expect Machinesim. I have Vericut so never needed the Machinesim.

[cncappsjames]

Thanks to <expletive> heads at Adobe, you can expect subscription ONLY model pricing for EVERY piece of software eventually.

What was it that Klaus Schwab said???? Oh yes; [quote]... you'll own nothing and like it...[/quote].

[gcode]

I'm sure Postability has a Machine Sim for this machine.

It is not a replacement for Vericut, but it is a really good programming aid to test

tool clearance and toolpath motion on the fly without have to launch a Vericut session.

Ask for a trial license and see if it will suit your needs.

[SuperHoneyBadger]

1 hour ago, cncappsjames said:

Thanks to <expletive> heads at Adobe, you can expect subscription ONLY model pricing for EVERY piece of software eventually.

What was it that Klaus Schwab said???? Oh yes; [quote]... you'll own nothing and like it...[/quote].

It sounds almost as if you don't want to pay for your family's food with Social Credit on a 48 month instalment plan administered by the UN Dept of Subscriptions? Odd stance to take.

[Greg Williams]

Both Inhouse and Postability have this machine

 

Vericut as well

 

[Phillip herschknox]

I would take a hard look at Hypermill. They seem to have pretty good support for 5 axis mill turns these days and I know they are tightly integrated with siemens on the post processor side. I'm also sure pretty sure that their virtual machining center is simulating the posted G-code like Vericut and Siemens NX. I don't own a seat right now but have been looking into it for a Grob G350T with the turning option and a siemens control and Hypermill seems to be coming out on top.

[JParis]

8 minutes ago, Phillip herschknox said:

I would take a hard look at Hypermill.

I have no personal experience with it....I have heard the software itself is excellent, especially for 5 axis work....

I have also heard that if you gag a little on the cost of NX, that the cost of Hypermill will choke you until you are blue in the face.

 

[#Rekd™]

You are practically next door to Barefoot CNC (Mastercam reseller), contact Jimmy.

[MIL-TFP-41]

I stumbled across "Celos Dynamic post" the other day. No idea of the cost or availability of the product, tho at first glance it looks like DMG-Mori are doing something similar to Camplete, that is a post and simulation package all in one. And it looks to be compatible with Mastercam. 

 

https://www.dmgmori.co.jp/en/products/machine/id=6297

 

 

[Manofwar]

1 hour ago, Phillip herschknox said:

I would take a hard look at Hypermill. They seem to have pretty good support for 5 axis mill turns these days and I know they are tightly integrated with siemens on the post processor side. I'm also sure pretty sure that their virtual machining center is simulating the posted G-code like Vericut and Siemens NX. I don't own a seat right now but have been looking into it for a Grob G350T with the turning option and a siemens control and Hypermill seems to be coming out on top.

1 hour ago, JParis said:

I have no personal experience with it....I have heard the software itself is excellent, especially for 5 axis work....

I have also heard that if you gag a little on the cost of NX, that the cost of Hypermill will choke you until you are blue in the face.

 

Hypermill user here, programming and running DMG Mori Vertical mill/turns (DMU 85 FD & DMU 40 eVo Linear FD.) We've had a couple of minor issues on the post end, but mostly a positive experience. They seem to understand the machines pretty well. Overall Hypermill support is subpar (at least in my region.) Most questions that I ask have to go to Germany, so take forever with response time. Luckily, after learning the layout, the software is pretty straight forward, and most problems can be solved by the average programmer. One thing about the 5x software, it's great for basic application. But I strongly prefer MC over HM. I hear a lot of people say how great the 5 axis is, but imo it's worse than MC. The thing that they have going for them is that the user inputs are simple and only a few exist, the problem I have is the same. They've simplified things to a point it's nearly impossible to get exactly what you want out of the software. It's not simulating posted G-Code, but does do a better job than MC.

 

[cncappsjames]

1 hour ago, Manofwar said:

Hypermill....

It's not simulating posted G-Code, but does do a better job than MC.

I can confirm this.

We had a customer with a Matsuura MX-330. His programmer is an absolute Mastercam and CAMplete hater. And I'm probably understating it.

They had a crash on their machine. I got the call to go out there and see what happened. I tried to do a little recon beforehand with nothing but push back from the programmer. The programmer blamed the machine (shocker). Tje owner was backing his guy (understandable). Anyway, I jump on a plane, get to the customer. I ask to see the CODE again... ya know the little bits the machine actually executes... ya that. Programmer got all indignant again told me I was fishing and that "his Hypermill code was 'perfect'...".

There were warranty implications on the line so I gotta see the code. Not the HyperShill simulation... IDGAF about that. The machine isn't running the simulation, it's running the code. So after a lot of back and forth, I finally get a look at the code and there was an aberrent C-Axis move... which jived with the machine operation history. The programmer never could admit the problem was with the post and simulation.

Now instead of just paying for a service call and parts, the owner paid for a flight, a rental car, AND Applications Engineer service call. Which if the shill errrrrr programmer would have put his ego aside for 60 seconds the problem could have been solved remotely. The owner was livid... understandable. 

Remember kids... ALL CODE MATTERS! 

[crazy^millman]

5 minutes ago, cncappsjames said:

I can confirm this.

We had a customer with a Matsuura MX-330. His programmer is an absolute Mastercam and CAMplete hater. And I'm probably understating it.

They had a crash on their machine. I got the call to go out there and see what happened. I tried to do a little recon beforehand with nothing but push back from the programmer. The programmer blamed the machine (shocker). Tje owner was backing his guy (understandable). Anyway, I jump on a plane, get to the customer. I ask to see the CODE again... ya know the little bits the machine actually executes... ya that. Programmer got all indignant again told me I was fishing and that "his Hypermill code was 'perfect'...".

There were warranty implications on the line so I gotta see the code. Not the HyperShill simulation... IDGAF about that. The machine isn't running the simulation, it's running the code. So after a lot of back and forth, I finally get a look at the code and there was an aberrent C-Axis move... which jived with the machine operation history. The programmer never could admit the problem was with the post and simulation.

Now instead of just paying for a service call and parts, the owner paid for a flight, a rental car, AND Applications Engineer service call. Which if the shill errrrrr programmer would have put his ego aside for 60 seconds the problem could have been solved remotely. The owner was livid... understandable. 

Remember kids... ALL CODE MATTERS! 

Shocked face.

[#Rekd™]

10 minutes ago, cncappsjames said:

Now instead of just paying for a service call and parts, the owner paid for a flight, a rental car, AND Applications Engineer service call. Which if the shill errrrrr programmer would have put his ego aside for 60 seconds the problem could have been solved remotely. The owner was livid... understandable. 

Remember kids... ALL CODE MATTERS! 

And they have Camplete and aren't using it...... makes zero sense. 

[crazy^millman]

15 minutes ago, #Rekd™ said:

And they have Camplete and aren't using it...... makes zero sense. 

Well it supports Hypermill. Can lead a horse to water, but not make it drink.

[Newbeeee™]

1 hour ago, crazy^millman said:

Well it supports Hypermill. Can lead a horse to water, but not make it drink think!

Fiss!

[?Mark]

We're a DMGMORI TC office that is also a Mastercam reseller. No issues programming/posting using Mastercam. Dozens of those FD duoblocks in our area alone.

Like with any 5-axis machine...I strongly recommend Vericut as it is well above anything that machsim can provide.

 

To add, Hypermill is nice and all, but overcomplicates pretty much everything. Had a customer whack brand new relatively simple HMC machine because of a bad post. Another sample would be Heidenhain factory apps couldn't figure out the code posted by hypermill....just whacky....but you can do some nice parts with it if the support/training is there.

 

jm2c