Step - Check this out and comment below

[McRae]

Setp Link

 

Check this out and comment below.

[chris m]

Ever closer to "put the drawing in the front, the part falls out the back"...

 

Nothing with the word 'automatic' in the description that many times can be good

 

C

[Charles Davis]

Yes, I have been following this a little.

 

I think there may be some potential here, but in a way, I wonder how much this is an academic exercise rather than a practical tool.

 

I think some automatic and user-aided feature recognition tools could be extremely helpful; as long as I still had the flexibility to program without using these feature tools.

 

In my ideal world, the model would come in, the software would program what it could, and I'd be left to programming what it could not figure out, or what I decided I could do a better job using my human decision making.

 

Face it though, just having all the holes programmed would help a lot!

[cadcam]

Charles have you tried it?

[Roger Peterson]

I agree, just having the holes programmed would be a huge benefit, but that's about it for me. How could anything automated take into account the wide array of variables a programmer does when creating toolpaths, even on 2 1/2D geometry on a vertical mill with one setup. Interesting though.

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

quote:

---

I think there may be some potential here, but in a way, I wonder how much this is an academic exercise rather than a practical tool.

---

+1

 

I also think this is an attempt by the "Big 'Uns" (i.e. Boeing, GM, Ford, etc...) to exert pressure on the shops of the world to "Conform or die". The day one of their bonehead engineers passes a floppy to me and says here load these tools, this file and run the part is the day you'll see me run the mile in 3 flat. Too many variables, not enough machine tools are capable of this (less than 5% in my estimation currently).

 

Am I scared? Hell no. AI is still a fledgeling technology, computers may beat us in chess but the number of variables in chess vs. the number of variables in CNC Programming is like comparing a skateboard to the Space Shuttle.

 

JM2C

[Thad]

I don't have anything to add to this. I just wanted to say that I am now a Senior member!!!!

 

500 posts, BABY!!!!

 

Thad

 

[ 07-09-2003, 11:27 PM: Message edited by: Thad ]

[Hardmill]

Congrats Thad.

 

 

PEACE

[Rekd™]

quote:

---

Am I scared? Hell no. AI is still a fledgeling technology, computers may beat us in chess but the number of variables in chess vs. the number of variables in CNC Programming is like comparing a skateboard to the Space Shuttle.

---

+1, james. Got that beanie-prop spinnin' overtime eh? Does it hold you down, or pick you up??

 

 

to thad!!!!!

 

'Rekd teh depends

[Harryman]

quote:

---

Am I scared? Hell no

---

Am I placing an order? Hell no.

 

That gadget might work on simple holes and pocket features in rectangular aluminum plates, but I got plenty of time to retire B4 it works on an Integrex in nastanium.

 

The Bosses out there though that view blue collars as pet by-product on the corporate boot might listen to a sales pitch. Keep your eyes open.

 

Harry

[TheePres]

Nice, Very Nice!!

Wasnt that long ago, that I finally was courageous enough to let MC decide how to cut Multi-Surfaces.

[KCollins]

my .02...

 

I'd be much happier to see a cad standard that included tolerancing rather than this program. I harldy know an engineer that can design a working part, much less one that knows how to machine it too. But my real question is how much longer will it be before prints become a thing of the past? Now I not only like to have a model to make a part, but I still require a print. When will it be all one component?

[steve f]

At the risk of being flamed, I think this is a natural progression in CAM programming.

 

My bet is that in 10 or 15 years a programmer will be doing alot more parameter, material and tool database tweaking and setup than actual (sp?) toolpathing. I can't see it taking away jobs though since someone still needs to know how to cut metal. I have to admit that there were times when looking at a file with 300 surfaces and complex features that something like Step would've reduced the migraine and gotten the job done quicker.

 

IMO

[Noel]

quote:

---

---

I have to admit that there were times when looking at a file with 300 surfaces and complex features that something like Step would've reduced the migraine and gotten the job done quicker.

__________________________________________________

Or made the headache bigger.

 

 

Noel

[Charles Davis]

my 2 cents

 

I tend to agree with Steve Funk. I think an intermediate step of "knowledge aided" programming will happen first. The "knowledge programmed" stuff will follow from that, and the 10-15 year time frame seems about right.

[Scott Bond]

Good morning

In the 60's & 70's I was making wood patterns for wax investment molds. I knew there will NEVER be a day that the NC could possibly make these insane aerospace shapes.

Somewhere in the middle of vesion 3.1-----, I changed my opinion.

 

So IMHO It's comeing, and it has us in it's head lights.

[Guest]

My very basic understanding of step-nc is that the machining process is built into the cad model. So when the model is created somebody (the engineer or programmer) has to put that information in there. Step-nc then takes that information and creates a program for different machines. So there will still need to be a programmer. His input will just be required earlier in the design process.

 

I don't think programmers have any thing to worry about. Stay current and educated. The engineers have too much to do now with out pushing all the programming on too them.

 

IMHO

[Charles Davis]

Jay, I haven't really tried it.. just saw the demo and have been looking at it.

 

I think trying to make mechanical engineers into machinists is like trying to turn truck drivers into diesel mechanics.

 

That is, I think that approach is solving the wrong problem. The engineer should be provided with as much DFM (Design for Manufacturing) info as possible. They also need to have some idea of the processes needed to hold the tolerances they specify. Those are CAD issues.

 

The machinist needs to know the tolerances and everything about the holes (drilled, tapped, etc).

 

The CAM system should automatically program the holes. All other features should be able to be machined by pulling from a knowledge base which is, for the most part, built by the expert machinist themselves (include a BASIC library, but the ability to easily build a library as you program parts is the key, since parts, machines and practices are so variable).

 

In other words, spiff up Solid Drill (or Pro-Drill from Anbu), and make it easier to write, read and MANAGE info in the Mastercam Operation Manager, and you're about 95% there.

 

Reaching too far, too fast, and trying to accomodate every single exception in the universe just gives you a cumbersome system that is unusable by the average person [i.e. "One Size Fits None"].

 

Give me the 95% solution, a great interface, and the inherent flexibility and power of Mastercam.

 

[ 07-10-2003, 10:23 PM: Message edited by: Charles Davis ]

[Charles Davis]

OK, so no one else has commented on this topic.

 

Does this mean I have the last word on this subject, and everyone on the planet agrees with me?

[Jack Mitchell]

Charles,

 

My thoughts echo yours as well. I did read about this previously and went to the site that Andrew pointed out numerous times.

 

There have been many valid responses from the other forum members as well.

 

Regards, Jack

[Tony]

Is it a Break through or Just another option?

I'll have to go with Just another option to

Get something done whether its done in there

or out here......

Let me now when they go public though

[McRae]

Charles - I haven't "Paid" to evaluate this option, have you? Bet it will work with a dealer SIM!! What about a cracked version??

[Guest CNC Apps Guy 1]

KBM still has a ways to go. The bigest problem in the whole equasion (aside from making Injuneerz Machinists/Programmers) is CAD integrity. Without that, the whole thing falls apart.

 

DFM is HUGE! 90% of the Injuneerz have no stinking clue on how a machined part actually gets made.

 

JM2C

[Müřlıń®]

Engineering is the last frontier for the dieing breed that is the Toolmaker.......

 

Pretty soon there will be smart machines....

 

There wont be any need for guys like us....

 

The operators will only be needed to turn off the lights

 

***Murlin backs away from his crystal ball and wipes a tear from his eye******

 

 

Murlin

[Charles Davis]

Andrew,

 

I haven't had the time to download this to try it, so I don't know if it will work on a dealer sim or not. Ditto your opinion that it seems odd to pay to Beta test software, assuming I read what's going on here right.

 

Of course, I could be wrong (and hope I am), but on the face it seems pretty primative. Once I believe it's close to being practical, I'll take the time to really evaluate it.

 

IMHO I'm not hot on the idea of "renting" software or a pay-for-service for programming. Maybe I'm a control freak or not in tune with the next coming thing, but I just don't quite get that business model.

 

If this stuff works, I'd be willing to pay a reasable price to own and then update it like the other software products I use.

 

My Disclaimer: I am NOT down on this product or prejudiced against it in any way!!! I'm just sharing my PERSONAL first impressions of what I see. These views do not necessarily represent the opinions of CNC Software, other dealers, or this network.

 

I wish these guys all the luck and success in the world. It's just that I can't sell something that I'm not 100% behind, and my customers can't make parts with a concept.

 

[ 07-11-2003, 06:32 PM: Message edited by: Charles Davis ]