Am I asking for too much????

[kathy]

We brought in a young man who had taken Machine Shop and Mastercam at our local JC.

 

Right now he is working on designing and programming a holding fixture for a machined part I programmed. The file contains a surface model and wireframe (from Catia IV), the profiles and boundaries that I machined to, setup text, etc.. The ‘production part’ is machined on both sides, so I have a ‘SETUP A/B’ WCS setup, but the holding fixture is machined only from the top. Basically, it is a plate with a pocket cut out around the part profile leaving a boss, so the cavity of the part will sit on the boss. Oh yes, and some holes…

 

This kid is lost, lost, lost. He can't even figure out what profile to use to setup his pocket. Just right now he asked me how to change the Z endpoints of a line so the entity lies in a co-planer Z. I answered ‘Analyze’, and got back “What is that” & "How do I use that”????? Well, you place your cursor in the Z field, double click and type in the new value…

 

Kathy

I don’t have the time or patience to babysit.

[Rick McAllister]

Kathy,

Was he given an ability test before he was hired or did you assume he was telling the truth on his resume?

[mayday]

sorry to hear your troubles Kathy, we see this with every new young kid coming in. they seem to learn everything but how to think for themselves.

[gcode]

All the class time in the world is no substitute

for seat time, but what you are asking for

seems pretty basic. The questions he's asking

lead me to believe he's "cooked" his resume or

taken very entry level Mastercam classes.

They hired a guy here last year who said he had 10 years experience. On his first day he went to lunch and never came back.

[robk]

quote:

---

The questions he's asking

lead me to believe he's "cooked" his resume or

taken very entry level Mastercam classes.

---

+1

No matter how entry level the class is, Analyze is a function everyone should be familiar with...

 

Best of luck Kathy. I feel your frustration.

 

 

Rob

[Thad]

quote:

---

No matter how entry level the class is, Analyze is a function everyone should be familiar with...

---

"Should" being the key word here. Analyze is one of the functions that I taught my instructor in my CAM205 class. Yes, you read it right, it's a 200 level class.

 

Kathy, how many classes did this person claim to take? Shop classes have always been pretty pathetic. They still have you grind up a HSS bit for turing on the South Bend lathes, milling 1-2-3 blocks to size with a .500 dia HSS end mill...etc. It was only a few years ago that we got CNC machining and turning centers.

 

Thad

[Reece L Gibson]

Does everybody remember How they started out?

I remember when it did.I could not even make an offset on a CNC lathe. I do not know how much you are paying this person, or how much he say's he know's but it showing up now. Can you help this person a all? Do you have time? Can you talk to him? I always allowed about 60 days before a person got up to steam, knowing the company's culture, how they ran the shop. Each shop is different.

[Scott Bond]

Hi Kathy

quote:

---

Am I asking for too much????

---

YES.

I could help this guy if you want to keep him.

[robk]

I agree with you Millturn. Everyone deserves a chance. Kathy, for all you know you might have a very bright (future) programmer on your hands. He just needs to learn the ropes. I just hope he gets paid accordingly and you have the time, and the patience to deal with him, and your own workload.

 

Rob

[mayday]

quote:

---

Does everybody remember How they started out?

---

Good point Millturn. big dif between someone who claims they know it and someone who is honest about just taking some classes with minimal real world experience. cant knock someone down for telling you up front what they know. I only appied once for a job and that was 23 years ago getting into the local machine shop. back then it was a lot more competitive to get in this line of work. give him a chance if he's honest with you

[Eric S.]

I think one of the main questions is how quick does he learn? I find it really frustrating when I have to keep repeating myself.

[Tony]

If he was hired for a specific job

and he can't Do it that is one thing.

If he's a trainee thats another.

 

Ask him where he went to school

Because you want to make sure not to

send or hire anyone from there

Also, Where's the new guy donuts?

 

[ 12-09-2003, 01:49 PM: Message edited by: Tony ]

[chris m]

I've backed out of the reply window three times so far without posting in this thread but now I'm gonna have to put my 2 cents in.

 

If you were up front with this individual about the type of work he would be expected to perform and he said 'no problem, I've done that type of thing' then you have the right to be frustrated with his inability to perform the tasks you've assigned.

 

If you weren't very specific about the skills required or the tasks to be performed then it is your fault, not his, that he is underqualified for what you've asked him to do.

 

You weren't very clear on how long this individual has been with you; 'design a fixture to hold this' is a tough task on your second day in the trade.

 

Personally I don't know squat about surface machining or some of the other topics that are covered on this forum so I'd probably be just as lost as this guy apparently is if you sat me down and gave me the same job; yet if you spent a couple of hours with me and layed out how the deal works I'm sure I'd pick up the basics pretty quickly.

 

Remember that you are a highly skilled and very experienced professional; things that appear very simple to you right now were not so simple when you were the new kid on the block

 

Just my opinion

 

C

 

[ 12-09-2003, 01:41 PM: Message edited by: chris m ]

[Thad]

quote:

---

things that appear very simple to you right now were not so simple when you were the new kid on the block

---

You got that right, Chris! Most things seem simple...when you already know how to do them!

 

Thad

[Rekd™]

Kathy, if you wanna send him to me, I'll smack him around a bit with a POST.

 

You've gotta ask yourself a question: Given what I know about this guy, can I afford to train him to do what he's been hired to do?

 

If not, you know what you have to do..

 

Of course, you could sign him up to eMastercam, and we can teach him..

 

'Rekd teh Destroyer

[d00d]

Just a story from here at my job. 2 years ago we hired an individual that had been to school for mastercam and solidworks with excellent marks and high recomendations from the staff at the local college. After 2 years of training they were let go. I have found that some people are just NOT mechanically inclined. Also as far as the education goes , this person in her own defense was taught nothing about the machining bizz. Most of her coop traing was modeling fish aquariums etc..And of all things the instructor was teaching 2D designs such as architecter on MAster Cam! Needless to say she was lost when put into the DIeCast die end of this trade. SO maybe inquire about some of the lab work this individual did in school, they may think they were armed with all they needed for the job. You may have a diamond in the rough, give them a project that requires mechanical apptitude, if they do well at that, it may be worth the effort to train them. Give them access to this forum, and you may be suprised. I know it has taught me more than any person or book can even dream of.

d00d

[mold100]

+1 d00d,

 

See how many times he asks the same questions and see if he will at least try to do it himself,

Maybe try and give him a simple print tell him to draw it in 3d and see if he even knows his way around.

 

Corey teh give'em a week or so then if no potenial tellem to find something new to do.

 

We had recently hired a graduated soldworks trained engineer from NC state, mind you he has a four year degree, I do not, I taught myself more in six weeks of using solidworks than we seen him use,he was hired as our mold designer but after six weeks no progress and no INITIATIVE so

we had to let him go, and now I am doing design work as well as machining

[kathy]

Thanks Guys - I knew I could count on all of you.

 

He is definitely in the 'trainee' category, but from what he told us I would have expected him to at least be able to machine a pocket into a plate.

His only classes were JC machine shop, but he did claim to be able to program and run parts on the mill.

 

One frustration is that it's not clear (it never is here) how much I'm supposed to dedicate to 'training', and what that training is to be. Am I expected to teach him Mastercam, or just how we Mastercam here? Yes, I know, talk to my boss! Well, I just talked to Pat, and he is at least informed. We feel that maybe, it will take months of training. I just don’t want to get in trouble by falling behind with my stuff.

 

I feel the pain of the learning curve. I’m working on modeling a part (wireframe igesed from Smartcam to Mastercam; side B merged into side A, wireframe and surfaces sorta cleaned up, than igesed into Catia IV) plus trying to remember the Catia IV interface. I know what I want to do, but I have to remember how to do it! I guess I’m the type of person who tries to figure it out on her own – got Randy’s Catia books open. And, I’m almost done and happy with the results!!

 

Kathy

[kathy]

ps - Thank you for letting me vent!

And you all have given me some good advice.

 

Kathy

[mayday]

quote:

---

it will take months of training. I just don’t want to get in trouble by falling behind with my stuff.

---

well Kathy sounds like you got it figured out. I still have to spend time on the floor showing peeps how to get the programs off the network and into their machines

 

Mayday teh Whats a .txt file

[gcode]

quote:

---

Mayday teh Whats a .txt file

---

The other day our IT guys said

"I didn't know there were 2 partitions on that hard drive."

after he formatted it

[kathy]

Well, I did have to explaine what co-planer meant!

 

Kathy

[chris m]

quote:

---

I still have to spend time on the floor showing peeps how to get the programs off the network and into their machines

---

Damn do I feel you on that one!

 

I can't understand how people can not be able to perform some of the functions that are required on a daily basis

 

Chris teh 'WTF do you do for a living?'

[Rekd™]

LoL, Chris.

 

I would simply tell them to practice. Go home and practice. Go home and practice in front of a mirror. Go home and ractice in front of a mirror saying "Would you like fries with that, ma'am?

 

'Rekd teh NEXT!

[gcode]

Kathy,

At least your guy came to you and asked questions.

We had a new hire who quietly worked for weeks

on a big project. He kept asking when they were going to start running his code. The day his

first code went into a machine he didn't come to work. He never came back and he never called.

Needless to say, his gcode and his MC8 files were usless.