Operators responsible broken for tooling?

[Matthew Hajicek - Singularity]

We very nearly came to blows about it.

[gms1]

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An employee came to the owner and said “I would like to receive profit sharing”, the owner replied “Sure, But just realize that when you participate in the profit sharing program you are also required to participate in the loss sharing program” What do you think happened?

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I would be alllll over that. Cause I'm certain I make more good stuff than I scrap and I know I've made my boss lots of money. Ill take that option

[Thee Rickster ™]

Why would you keep a person on who cannot program

or run a machine? After the very first time I would

evaluated his skill, deemed him worth keeping, training or 'not' and the problem or problem will

solve it self.

 

If you don't have time to train or investigate

then you need a qualified supervisor to do it and

report back to you on these issues.

[Dave.L]

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I would be alllll over that. Cause I'm certain I make more good stuff than I scrap and I know I've made my boss lots of money. Ill take that option

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If that's the case, I am sure your boss takes good care of you.

 

BTW, Profit sharing and loss sharing is about the whole team, unless you want to start doing piece work

 

Also, I would bet in 2009 no employee would want anything to do with profit and loss sharing

[Cad-Camr]

It sounds to me like this is a case where programming is done at the control. A lot of companies are in favor of this type of equipment to reduce the cost/overhead of employing programmers and buying expensive software.

 

The trade off is that you have less experienced people doing the programming and dont have the adequite tools to ensure the program is clean.

 

You may save some $$$$ on the front end but you will have to eat the mistakes.

[Kevangel]

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Any stories of shops charging for tooling. I understand stuff happens but it has been happening far far to frequently

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Nope none. If you are going to charge employees for screw ups are you going to give them more money when a job comes in at a double rate because of quoting a high price and getting it. You really make the money in the office..I have noticed over the years that shops can turn over the entire staff and the company keeps on rolling...its the owner that does this..good or bad.

[Verndog]

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Any stories of shops charging for tooling. I understand stuff happens but it has been happening far far to frequently.

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You cannot make an hourly employee work for free in my state (Washington), that I know, and if you deduct from their check then there are unpaid hours.

 

If somebody did that much dumb a$$ damage on 1 job, why are they still employed?? Go get a sharp / eager kid out of trade school, put a journey level - lead person to watch him, and start over.

[crazy^millman]

Lets see I did some jobs here that has saved the company about 10000 hours verse the way they were doing it since I been here so you want to include me on that profit sharing plan? Let see we get $100/hr here so where's my million dollar check?

 

Charge all you want, but if this happen where I worked I would walk in a heart beat and not look back. Things happen and people are human and if start doing things along this line be ready for delays, stalls, uncertainty, and longer run times. You tell me for every mistake I make you are going to charge me where is the line? I printed 4 page wrong today you going to charge me for the paper? You start making people fear they are going to even get paid or be able to put food on their table since you might be taking all the money they are working hard to earn then they are going to be so gun shy they will be afraid to even hit the cycle start button before you are charging them. Doing business has its pluses and minus.

 

Things happen and when guys make mistake I figure out how much that cost and then tell them how much that little piece of education cost them. The ones that care understand and do not let it happen again. The ones that care not never worked for me long!! Find a balance but you start charging people for being human and you better be ready to go out of business becuase I promise you what goes around comes around and before you know it you are going to have something go out the door and your customer might just be coming back to you charging you just like you are trying to charge your employees. Oh and if you do it to one you have to do it to them all!!!

[MattW]

Experience gained is proportional to equipment destroyed.

 

I am not being helpful, just throwing that out there.

[Gary]

Plus 1 to what Ron said. Even the best guys miss stuff once in a while. If they get charged or threatened to be charged I can guarantee resume updating will be in short order. If they screw up all the time then just cut your losses and let em go.

[htm01]

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Go get a sharp / eager kid out of trade school

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don't know what world you live in but we can't find a creature like that.

[Kevangel]

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Go get a sharp / eager kid out of trade school

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don't know what world you live in but we can't find a creature like that.

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There is atleast one around here and he has a part time job in a shop and still is in h.S. making a good hourly rate, paid holidays,etc. I know his Mom and the shop owner knows what he has got. I worked on a volunteer church project in which he helped (construction) and I was very impressed with him. That kid will go far. I told him if he ever needs a job to come see me.

[Kevangel]

I know a shop out in Kali was letting workers work on percentage and if they hustled they could make more....well, one guy could not and he complained to the labor board and they said guys were not making overtime pay and fined the company over 300K and almost put them out of Biz. So, they went back to hourly rate...over one person. You gotta be careful what you do, even if its better for the majority.

[JNO]

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i think you would be better off paying more for better employees then paying over and over for tooling on jobs

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Greg said it all right there. Your employees are either over paid and/or under qualified.

[Verndog]

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don't know what world you live in but we can't find a creature like that.

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With that attitude you'll ceratinly never find them.

 

Talk to the instructor, get recommendations, check references, use good instinct, and grill them. You'll have to weed thru quite a few to find them, but they're out there. We even used to let the trade schools tour our shop to develope a relationship before they get out. Can do attitude required.

[The_Evil_Machinist]

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Go get a sharp / eager kid out of trade school

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[Matthew Hajicek - Singularity]

When I was going to Dunwoody for Machine Tool I was tied with a guy named Tasker for head of the class, and another bright guy named Danis was a close second. One time a few years ago I was looking to hire an assistant and asked the Dunwoody instructer if he had anyone like Tasker, Danis, or myself in his class that I might talk to. He said "Nope, they're all pretty average this year."

[Reko]

The owner of the shop I work at just bought a $6000 boring head for me to bore an 11" diameter hole, 25" deep in Stainless Steel. He paid $2500 to make a bar to hold it. That's about $8500 for ONE TOOL!

 

Glad I didn't have to pay for it, though if I smash it up, I'll be posting here asking for help finding a new job.

 

Any owners out there still wanna b!tch about buying 3/8 End Mills?

[Mcam Nut]

Wow, I'm glad you aren't my boss.. Sure it was a dumb mistake, but considering charging an employee fo broken tooling??? I am sure he has made you more then enough profit to pay for any tooling, and if he didn't, then fire him.

[Dave.L]

I have never and will never charge an employee for tooling, in fact, I don't even allow anyone to bring in there own tools.

 

However, I suspect the spirit of this thread came from frustration and the desire to teach people to value the shop equipment like they paid for it.

 

Some people have no respect for property they have not paid for. Many, many people do.

 

Again, I would never do it, but like James would say "I'm not say'in, I am just say'in"

[crazy^millman]

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Again, I would never do it, but like James would say "I'm not say'in, I am just say'in"

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LOL Dave that is funny.

[mchin-pilot]

Dave Lelonek = Very good thoughts! good man.

[mchin-pilot]

If you buy a cheap/aftermarket/uncertified product and it causes problems,breakdowns,needs too aften repairs. Then whose fault is it??

The Products fault or the buyers?

Answere is its the buyers fault , reason being why he choose to buy that low value product.

 

Same applies when the Company Man hires some one uncompetitive. Why blame on him?

 

Go for Skilled people.

If not have courage to train someone properly first.

Or exactly - Go get a sharp / eager kid out of trade school.

[Dave.L]

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Dave Lelonek = Very good thoughts! good man.

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Some would probably disagree, but thanks for the compliment – I appreciate it.

[Oppiz]

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I really need to start charging employees when they carelessly tear up tooling, would you?

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Where would you draw the line between carelessness an a honest mistake? If you charge quality people for their honest mistakes, you'd pay dearly with bad attitudes, work slow downs, employees trying create overtime to help pay for the tooling they are forced to replace. I've been in this trade 30 years and I know the person making the chips has more control over shop output then management gives them credit for.

 

If you have a person in a position where they are are unable or unwilling to the job. Then you must take on part of the blame for poor work.